"Cat out of the bag" and "Saved by the bell"

Factual Questions
1

I visited the Ripley’s Believe It or Not museum in Orlando last night. Unsurprisingly, this institution of credulity displayed several false statements, two of which were etymological:

The first was that “Saved by the bell” referred to the amusing devises of the 19th century that advertised to allow people buried alive to signal their predicament by means of a string attached to a bell. I know such devices existed, but common sense (and some basic web searching) seems to suggest that this phrase comes from the realm of boxing. Is this correct?

Second, “Let the cat out of the bag” was claimed to refer to a torturer removing a cat-o’-nine-tails from the bag in which it was kept. A web search turned up a claim that the phrase actually refers to the medieval scam of selling a suckling pig at market, and secretly switching the pig with a cat. The dupe would not realize that he received a worthless cat until he got home, unless someone inadvertently let it out of the bag, thereby spoiling the scam. This seems slightly more plausible – and closer to the actual meaning of the phrase – than the cat-o’-nine-tails explanation, but still too good to be accurate. What is the true etymology of this expression?

(I searched both the columns and the message board – I could’ve sworn I’d read about one or both of these sayings – but to no avail.)

2

Since “saved by the bell” has always been a known expression in boxing, which used to be a very popular sport, and only wack jobs ever put those devices in their coffins, I’m convinced that you have to be right about that expression.

“Cat out of the bag” I’m less sure of – a lot of naval expressions entered the language.

samclem, you out there?

3

In addition, I’ve heard there are zero instances of the coffin bells acually saving someone’s life. Seems only REALLY dead people ever bothered to install them.

Hey, anyone know if there are any of those coffin bells still around? Not new ones, but one that was installed 100 years ago or so and is still waiting for the rope to be pulled? I’d love to visit a graveyard that has a few of those devices.

4

I’ve always heard of “Saved by the Bell” in reference to boxing.

As for “Cat out of the bag” I’ve heard it in connection with “Don’t buy a pig in a poke”. I suspect it is an urban legend, but supposedly there was a scam where a con artist would claim that a burlap sack containing a struggling “something” was a pig and try to sell it to an unsuspecting townsperson. If the townsperson happened to open the bag they would find not a pig but a cat, thus the “Cat was out of the bag” and the warning to “Don’t buy a pig in a poke”.

Again, probably a UL but good for a 2-fer.

5

Michael Quinion writes a wonderful word site, and discussed this. Link is http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-sav1.htm

Indeed, “saved by the bell” is from boxing and only from the 1930’s or so.

As to the "cat out of the bag, Michael also did this one. LInk is http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-let1.htm

It’s not clear cut. It comes from the 18th century, but read his theory for yourself.

6

I heard the cat one on Bob & Tom the other morning. They said it was the pig thing, not the whip thing. Don’t know how good a source that is, tho.

7

Here’s a couple other opionions:

http://www.briggs13.fsnet.co.uk/book/c.htm
To let the cat out of the bag is said to occur if a secret is revealed. This type of cat is truly furry, unlike that just described. In medieval times piglets were often taken to market in a sack where they were sold. If the purchaser was particularly gullible he was sometimes sold not a piglet, but a cat in the sack. Cats are versatile animals and sometimes managed to escape - the cat was truly out of the bag.

http://www.briggs13.fsnet.co.uk/book/b.htm
Bell: To be saved by the bell suggests a rescue at the last minute. I always thought that this was derived from the Boxing Ring, but this is not the only explanation. Another goes as follows: A guard at Windsor Castle in the Victorian times was accused of being asleep on night duty. He vigorously denied this and, in his defence, said that he had heard Big Ben (which could be heard in Windsor in those days before traffic and Heathrow Airport) chime 13 at midnight. The mechanism was checked and it was found that a gear or cog had slipped and that the clock had indeed chimed 13 the previous night. He was truly Saved by the Bell.

8

cc Can you possibly give a contemporary cite for either of those improbable explanations?

Anyone can sit around and make up logical sounding theories. It takes a bit more work to try to find actualy instances of the appearance of the phrase/words.

While the author(Briggs) of one of your cites quotes Michael Quinion as one of his references(to his credit), he has much mis-information on his site.

Not uncommon.

9

I’m not saying these are THE answers to the OP. I said here are a couple other opinions. I don’t think the site I cited is even trying to be snopes, thank God.

10

Your site/cite couldn’t carry Barbara’s jockstrap—assuming she decided to wear one someday.

:mad: