Child Molesting Priest Killed In Prison

[Tuckerfan]

*Originally posted by Copaesthetic *
Although it’s obvious at this point that I have missed the second page with my previous post, I’d reiterate here that a “cured” may still maintain the desire to have sex with children after treatment or incarceration, thereby not being “cured” so much as “prevented”.

It is, however, better than nothing.

[Monty]

Let’s see: What we have now, according to some posters on this board, is that the justice system should include the following:
[ul][li]Assault[/li][li]Rape[/li][li]Murder[/ul][/li]Glad to see we’ve such an enlightened crowd.

Oh, I forgot one:
[ul][li]The vicitim is automatically at fault for what happened to him.[/ul][/li]
I think I’ll remember this thread (and a few others with similar “enlightened” sentiments and when those of you who seem to hold those views complain about something bad, I’ll refer you to your own words.

[Monty]

For the sarcasm-impaired: My last paragraph above was sarcasm. I guess I should’ve included this phrase therein.

[Nightime]

This seems to happen in every thread about subjects like this, Monty. Yet it never ceases to amaze and disturb me.

Especially the part about how someone wished it was a former victim of the priest that killed him. WTF? You are wishing that his former victim has never gotten over what happened, and is now a murderer? Disgusting.

[Shaolinrabbit]

*Originally posted by Tuckerfan *
It is, however, better than nothing.

Absolutely. I’m neither of the mind that child molesters are demons incapable of rejoining humanity, nor that they should be taken out back and shot.

I think that I, as well as many others, are mixed on the subject. Sure, try to help them, try to “cure” them. But if I knew the kid? They’d better hope they get killed in prison.

It’s a contradictory viewpoint, but one I work on daily.

[Monty]

Nightime: It’s also disturbing that someone wished for Phelps to picket the guy’s funeral!

[E-Sabbath]

It is kinda funny, though.

[Eternal]

*Originally posted by aasna *
A perfectly valid point. However, one must also take into consideration those who reoffend and are not caught, those who become too afraid to reoffend (which is not quite the same as being cured) and those who shift focus from child-molesting to child-porn.

Ah, but let’s also not neglect all the child molestors who were never caught but reformed without outside help. (Since they weren’t caught, this population could be as high as 200 million)

[The_Man_With_The_Golden_Gun]

Monty, yeah, you may remember this thread when we complain about something bad, but I don’t think anyone here is a child molester.

This dickhead got what he deserved, and I for one am glad he is dead and rotting in Hell.

[TVAA]

*Originally posted by Qadgop the Mercotan *
**TVAA, both those sources you cite indicate that while the recidivism rate is high, it is not 100%.

** Really? You’re not kidding?

Boy, do I feel dumb for suggesting that the recidivism rate for pedophiles is 100%. I know, Qadgop, why don’t you point out the place where I made that claim, so you can make me look ever dumber?

Go ahead, quote and post it. Vent your righteous anger upon me, O Master of Literacy.

**In fact, they suggest that over one half of pedophiles who are treated don’t reoffend.

** And of course, everyone knows that not molesting another child, being detected, arrested, and convicted, is equivalent to no longer being a pedophile.

Gee, you sure cleaned my clock on that one!

Granted, better treatments and more studies are needed to find out what works best for the most people, but it’s hard to write off half the population as incorrigible when in fact it appears a significant number can and do change.

Changing behavior is necessarily an indication of a change in orientation, right? Right?

[Qadgop_the_Mercotan]

Calm down, TVAA. I humbly admit error in that I should have used your cites to address Canvasshoes’ assertion that pedophiles rarely or never change. You never made any such assertion. My bad. Mea Culpa.

Do you have other issues with me?

[CarnalK]

Since none else has bothered I’ll mention that the “high rate of recidivism” is a lot lower than for other crimes.

Answer: The initial follow-up of the child molesters found that 42% were reconvicted of a sexual or violent crime during the 15-30 year follow-up period. Ten percent of the total sample of child molesters were first convicted for a sexual/violent crime between 10 and 31 years after release. Not all child molesters recidivated at the same rate. The highest rate of recidivism (77%) was for those with previous sexual offenses, who selected extrafamilial boy victims, and who were never married. In contrast, the long-term recidivism rate for the low risk offenders was less than 20%.
Although the long-term recidivism rates for the child molesters were substantial, the recidivism rates for the nonsexual criminals were even higher, 61% versus 83.2%, respectively, for any reconviction. That nonsexual criminals have higher recidivism rates than child molesters runs contrary to the common assumption that child molesters are a particularly high risk group of offenders. Nonsexual criminals tended to be reconvicted for property offenses and for nonsexual violent offenses. In contrast, child molesters had much higher rates of sexual recidivism (35%) than did the nonsexual criminal group (1.5%). The predictors of sexual recidivism (e.g., prior sexual offenses, victim type) were different from the predictors of nonsexual recidivism (e.g., low education, youth, nonviolent offenses).

(my emphasis)

From Canadian Solicitor General’s office

If anyone is actual curious I’m sure the DoJ website can be searched.

[CarnalK]

Though the priest is certainly in the worst category statistically for a molestor.

[Monty]

*Originally posted by The Man With The Golden Gun *
Monty, yeah, you may remember this thread when we complain about something bad, but I don’t think anyone here is a child molester.

Nowhere did I say nor imply that anyone was. To say that to me on this subject is foolish and childish.

This dickhead got what he deserved,

Yes, he did. He got sentenced to prison and that’s what our system of justice says he deserved. He also got murdered, something he did not deserve according to our system of justice. I’ve a question for you about your position below.

and I for one am glad he is dead and rotting in Hell.

I was not aware that “rotting in Hell” was part of the criminal sentencing process in our system of justice; nor was I aware that you were the one who got to determine if someone did, in fact, hie to that particular destination upon their expiration.

Now for the question: So, exactly how many rapes in prison constitute the “deserved” punishment? How many assaults in prison constitute the “deserved” punishment? Obviously being the victim of murder can only happen once so you’re saved from answering that query. By whom should these “deserved” punishments be administered? If those administering the “deserved” punishments are doing such a good thing, by how much should their sentences be reduced? And how are you going to handle the dilemma when the individual administering the “deserved” punishment just so happens to have committed one of the crimes you think the assault, rape, or murder is the “deserved” punishment for?

To hold to the idea that ANYONE deserves to be the victim of an assault, a rape, or especially a murder just because they’re in prison, IMHO, places you on the same moral plane as those you despise.

Now I won’t be suprised if anyone whips out the false charge that I just said that you deserve any of those punishments. I did not. I pointed out YOUR lack of humanity and the lack of humanity others who are advocating such barbaric treatment.

CarnalK: Would you be so kind as to put up some citation about priests being statistically the worst category of molestors?

[The_Man_With_The_Golden_Gun]

Sorry, but I believe that the following deserve the death penalty, as administered by the state: child molesters, rapists, murderers, etc. That’s my view. We should stop the assaults done by prisoners by simply executing these monsters.

I don’t determine who goes to Hell and who goes to Heaven. I don’t even know where this cockknuckle went. I hope he went to Hell, and I imagine any just God would send this animal straight to the bottom circle. This man ruined lives. Lots of lives. I get the feeling you were never molested as a kid, so you probably don’t understand how horrible child molesting is.

And I have a lack of humanity, because I understand what a painful experience child molesting is. :rolleyes:

[CarnalK]

Would you be so kind as to put up some citation about priests being statistically the worst category of molestors?

If you read the quotation I gave above it notes that:

Not all child molesters recidivated at the same rate. The highest rate of recidivism (77%) was for those with previous sexual offenses, who selected extrafamilial boy victims, and who were never married. In contrast, the long-term recidivism rate for the low risk offenders was less than 20%.

I believe the priest was unmarried and selected non-related boy victims, no? Here’s a Institute for Psychological Therapies describing recidivism risk factors:

Table 1
Risk Factors for Sexual Recidivism
(Hanson & Bussière, 1996, 1998)

1. Plethysmograph preference for children (r = .32)
2. Scale 5 (Masculinity/Femininity) of the MMPI (r = .27)
3. Severely disordered (r = .25)
4. Deviant sexual preferences (pretreatment) (r = .22)
5. Prior sexual offenses (r = .19)
6. Any personality disorder (r = .16)
7. Negative relationship with mother (r = .16)
8. Scale 6 (Paranoia) of the MMPI (r = .16)
9. Low motivation for treatment (r = .15)
10. Victim stranger (r = .15)
11. Antisocial personality disorder (r = .14)
12. Plethysmograph preference for boys (r = .14)
13. Victim female child (r = -.14)
14. Prior offenses (any nonsexual) (r = .13)
15. Anger problems (r = .13)
16. Age (r = -.13)
17. Early onset of sexual offending (r = .12)
18. Prior offenses (r = .12)
19. Victim related child (r = -.11)
20. Single (never married) (r = .11)
21. Diverse sex crimes (r = .10)
    (Note that 13, 16, and 19 are negative correlations)
    I didn’t mean to imply that the occupation of priest was a risk factor.

[omni-not]

One has to wonder if things might not have turned a bit differently had the guy been allowed to marry and have kids in the first place… But that a whole other debate, huh?

Also, I’ve always been fascinated by this prison code of ethics which makes heroes out of guys who rob banks and kill security officers, employees, customers in cold blood, for example but treats child molesters and others as scum not worthy of living.
Please note that I am NOT in any way, shape or form condoning the actions of child molesters. The rationale just seems somewhat a bit odd to me.

[Monty]

Oh, well, Carnal, if you’re just going to make stuff up, forget I asked. Or you could provide what I asked about what you asserted. There are, in case you didn’t know, unmarried males who are not priests.

The Man With a Gun: I guess it’s a damn good thing you don’t make the laws. Hmmm…seems to me like the guy who got murdered in prison was there for breaking a law, was he not? Also, my image of a just deity is one who accepts repentance and THAT is between the repentant sinner and that deity, not you.

[The_Man_With_The_Golden_Gun]

Yes he was there for breaking a law. What’s your point? And stop being such an asshole about it, okay?

[Monty]

You’re the asshole celebrating someone’s murder, jerk. My point is that the man was in jail for breaking a particular law. Thus, the punishment he deserved is the legal punishment for that law. Got it, asshole? Do you care to actually answer the questions I put to you, asshole? WHO should be the agent of the state administering the rapes? WHO should be the agent of the state just walking up and killing the guy prior to his appeal process being completed? HOW MANY assaults on his person, HOW MANY rapes constitute the “deserved” punishment?