What does phimosis have to do with sanitary or unsanitary practices?? 
Hijack, but since one can be technically a Jew without having the slightest connection with Judaism, what if say, it happens that my mother’s mother’s mother…etc…was Jew 500 hundred years, and I’m unaware of it? Would such punishments for not complying to whatever commandment apply to me?
What if I’m aware I’m technically Jew? A former girlfriend of mine was in this situation of being technically Jew (her grandmother was) but had absolutely no knowledge about Judaism (her mother was in new-age/reincarnation/oriental wisdom things) and she had no contacts with anybody who was Jew (except once when she used the technicality of being Jew to be an au-pair in a Jewish family, with disaters ensuing).
She couldn’t argue she didn’t know she was Jew especially since she used the fact to get a job. So, was she held by the commandments applying to Jews despite not knowing any of them?
As the mother of a fatherless uncirced boy I would have to say HUH!? My chap never had a father to teach him the “how to own a penis” tricks (well not since he was a baby).
When he was about 8 I read a “You must clean under your foreskin or your dick will fall off” kind off article. The next time he was in the shower we had an interesting conversation through the bathroom door.
Me " Hey you know that loose bit of skin on your willy?"
Him “MUM!!! SHUT UP!!!”
Me “I’m just saying you are sposed to clean under it”
Him “MUM!!! SHUT UP”
Me “I’m just saying I read something and you are sposed to clean under it”
Him "MUM!!! SHUT UP…I’m in the shower I wash myself!!!
So far his dick hasn’t dropped off due to pee overload :rolleyes:
Oh and I never even attempted to scrub under his foreskin when he was in nappies. Just as well I never had a girl cause I wouldn’t have scrubbed out the girly bits either :rolleyes: A bath cleans a child. No need to disenfect the private parts 
If other Jewish posters correct me on this and say there is nothing wrong with the useage, I will happily change my stance, but calling someone “Jew”, as opposed to “a Jew” strikes me as rather insulting.
Having no particular reason to assume that it’s different for a baby, I would point out that the pain lasts for some days, as one would expect from a surgery, hence that anesthesia isn’t enough to suppress all pain.
Consider the fate of the poor waif who propounds creationism on this board. What unrelenting destruction we can be witness to.
Cecil himself pinions and impales Freud, who was after all doing his honest best. Why? For a mere lack of scientific rigour, he’s lumped in with the spoon-benders.
So all arguments must fall that contradict the mighty tests of scientific empiricism. Or so it seems. Because it seems to me that circumcision recieves a mighty soft run here. How much contrast there is with any other argument or occult practice based on superstition, you might care to name.
Between creationists, astrologers, circumcisers and the rest, I see no intelligible difference. The question is: why does anyone else?
The "master might be a genius and all, but personnally, I wouldn’t ask him if I needed a medical opinion.
If there are significant benefit in being circumcized, how comes this procedure isn’t recommanded by the doctors or medical societies anywhere outside north-america (that’s assuming it’s recommanded in north-america, something I don’t even know)? Are all foreign doctors totally ignorant of these benefits and need enlightement, or could it be related to the fact that circumcizion is a common custom in the US and people are eager to defend what they’re accustomed to?
The poor waif should count itself lucky.
Of course not…I was referring to male circumcision. They didn’t use anything on my son. I just don’t understand why.
Your arguments appear exactly as weak to me. My arguments are rationnal and don’t include name-calling or barely veiled accusations of antisemitism. And what did I fail to do, exactly? I did respond to your arguments. The thing I failed to do was resorting to name-calling, as you did, and this habbit of yours certainly plays a part in the fact that I can’t take your statements very seriously. People who have to use insults to make their points rarely are in a strong position and rarely deserve to be taken seriously.
At any rate, I didn’t think it polite to discontinue discussion with you without letting you know. I told catsix as well; I don’t wish to see you taking the futile step of arguing with someone who won’t reply. This is the last post in this thread addressed to you that I’ll write, clair. I’m hoping others more interested in the issue at hand (circumcision, in case anyone’s forgotten) will fill the void.
[/QUOTE]
Hmmm…I only read you last comment about you intending not to post anymore in this thread after I began to write my response, and then I acccidentally hit the “reply” button. Forget about this pointless last post, then.
I think you’ve got it. It has a name by the way: ‘conservative’
I wouldn’t ask him to take out my tonsels either, but he’s more than competent to report on current research.
Jesus fuck! Do none of you people understand how a cost benefit analysis works? Lets take penile cancer, for example. If there have been 60,000 cases since 1930, that is a statistically insignifigant number when compared to the total number of boys born in that time. The AMA and other organizations have taken the completely understandable stance that this, and other potential benefits, are not signifigant enough to recommend the procedure for newborns when measured against the potential risks inherent in any procedure. (This type of logic is employeed all the time. Municipal officials know that installing seatbelts on schoolbuses would save something like a dozen or 2 lives nationwide each year, the expense of installing them isn’t deemed worth that benefit. Pretty cold logic if it’s my kid who dies, no? I am pretty sure Cecil did a column on that one too) My stance is that if a parent weighs these factors, and decides that he or she wants their child to be cut, they are simply making a different risk/benefit calculation than the AMA, and they have every right to do so.
**
If you didn’t know, then you didn’t know. There is a statement in the Talmud which goes ones rachmuna patrei. If you are in a position where there you had no choice other than to violate the commandment, then you are exempt. If a Jew is in a position where the only food on Earth is bacon then he’s allowed (requred, in fact) to eat it. If one is in a place where (for whatever reason) no matzah is available on Passover no matter how hard you try to obtain it, then you are exempt. If you don’t know that you are Jewish and were never told, and had no reason to suspect that you might be Jewish, then you are exempt. You are only culpable for sins through negligence (partially responsible) and willful action (completely responsible).
She is technically held to the commandments. However, many of today’s halachic authorities hold that most of the Jews today who don’t keep the commandments have a status of tinok she-nishba (a kidnapped infant). Such a person grew up without the knowledge of what it means to keep the commandments and live a Torah-observant lifestyle. As such, they are really responsible for their lack of observance of the mitzvos. OTOH, we are required to treat them as Jews. So, while I could give the person in your first example a plate of pork to eat, I couldn’t give it to your former girlfriend.
Zev Steinhardt
I don’t know about that. I’m a staunch creationist and yet I seem to be treated well on these boards.
Please, don’t lump me in with the astrologers…
Zev Steinhardt
I would like to bring up the fact that US members simply fail to understand why for non US’ers this obsession with circumcising newborns in the US is at the very least strange (I find it at the very least weird and completely illogical) when there is no religious background or command behind it.
As claireobscur said: It seems to be something “unique USA”. (You are not saying that studies on this issue are not done/available in the rest of the world, no?)
In my opinion this US habit is a left-over of interpretation of the Biblical commands, wether those who circumcize their children even kow that, or not. It is ingrained in US culture thanks to the Judeo- Christian heritage.
What is even stranger, since this origins in Europe where circumcision as far as I know never was practiced on Christian children.
In my view this could be an interesting debate for GD, yet so many things of what could be posted there are already posted here.
The problem here is that anything else then the version of X against the version of Y gets lost in the amount of posts already made.
Everyone interested in contributing to the discussion must spend hours reading before the conclusion is reached that this thread is merely kept alive by one member: Catsix defending an argument without any flexibility or will to come to an understanding of the religious positions and others replying to catsix while knowing that if you reply or not, it shall make no difference.
Salaam. A
You ever going to start using a smaller brush?
?
What part of my post is unclear?
Salaam. A
Speaking as a Jew (albeit a rather agnostic one), I say that since the quoted poster is not a native English speaker, we should cut him some slack. And personally, I pay more attention to the manner in which the word is used, rather than whether it is preceded by the definite article – and the manner has been pretty darn respectful so far IMO.
[There was no pun intended in re: “cutting slack.” Really.]