Come Geek Out with me on Dark Shadows (the Original Series)

[Biotop]

@Don_Draper

OK, so because of this thread, I was inspired to hulu this series again for the first time in about 15 years. Hulu begins at episode 210, which is when Willie breaks into the Collins family crypt and unleashes Barnabas. I don’t mind starting there at all, since the Billy Malloy murder mystery (even with his ghostly appearance) and the Laura the Phoenix storylines didn’t interest me that much.

I watched about a week’s worth of episodes so far. A few observations:

1. That secret room in the Collins family crypt is HUGE! It’s got to be bigger than the ‘official’ room where Joshua, Naomi, and Sarah are buried. I guess that makes sense from a staging standpoint, since it’s where the more dramatic events take place. On the other hand, in-universe, how the hell does anybody not know that "secret room’ is there??? I realize nobody’s been in there too often, but did nobody in its history ever happened to walk around the perimeter of it and think “Why is this structure large enough to contain two whole rooms when it only has the one??”

2. Conversely, the coffins for the other 1795 Collins family members are tiny! There’s no way anybody the same height of either Roger or Elizabeth (whom Joshua and Naomi are dead ringers for) could be interred there – not unless their corpses were cut up into pieces and simply jumbled into those pygmy tombs.

3. The crypt keeper makes a comment about the third tomb containing “the little girl Sarah Collins…” which is a nice bit of foreshadowing. Evidently there were planning ahead for her ghostly appearance. But just as obviously, the writers were not planning too far ahead, as the birth/death dates for Joshua and Naomi can’t possibly be correct. Naomi’s date of death is 1821, which spoilers! is way off the mark. Similarly, in the next episode, Barnabas remarks to Elizabeth that the Old House is “where Jeremiah and Josette Collins” lived…Which, as we’ll see, wasn’t the case.

4. Just prior to Willie breaking into the crypt, there’s a scene of Elizabeth and Victoria looking at the portrait of Barnabas. Right next to the portrait is a mirror, which Elizabeth and Victoria are reflected in. That makes for a great shot, but I couldn’t help wondering where that mirror went in the 24 hours between Willie unearthing Barnabas and his arrival at Collinwood. For staging reasons, the mirror had to go – because no doubt somebody in the next few episodes who would be gawking at the portrait and then at Barnabas would have to have caught a glimpse of the mirror and seen that Barnnabas did not have a reflection!

5. Where did Barnabas happen to get a totally mod, tailored suit to wear? It’s perfectly in keeping with the mid 60s time period, but he only just got out of a 200 year imprisonment 24 hours earlier. And that suit is TOTALLY custom tailored to his frame. It’s not like he could just steal a suit from some random Collinsport resident unless he just happened to find a guy who took his exact same measurements. (and I doubt too many people in Collinsport wear Savile Row threads anyway.)

6. And lest you think I’m dumping too hard on the series, I will say for the record that Willie is a suitably sinister creep, Barnabas does project a oily, menacing, but charming personality. And even minor villain Jason (who was written out very quickly after Barnabas arrives) is an entertaining scoundrel. He’s too ordinary a character to have ‘saved’ the show, as Barnabas did. But I can imagine an alternate time line in which Willie didn’t free Barnabas and Jason was the central villain.

I just started rewatching it too inspired by this thread. And the Amazon streaming is easier than dragging out the DVDs.

History changes from the 1795 story given in bits and pieces and then the actual events broadcast. But perhaps Vicky going back in time altered history.

You also have to wonder where Willie got the skills to fix up the old house. Or how Barnabas was able to adapt to modern life so easily. Or where Barnabas got his money or… etc. So many unanswered questions.

Early Julia Hoffman scenes are just awesome!

[Grumbacher_Red]

Yay! So glad to see the thread is thriving, and I didn’t mean to be away so long.

Don Draper, I said the same exact thing about the Secret Room in the family crypt…didn’t anyone notice form the outside? And also, Joshua Collins said it was built “during the war” which I assume is the Revolutionary War, to hide guns and ammunition. That is a plausible reason for it, but I think the Redcoats woulda noticed. It would have been better if it were an underground secret room, but that doesn’t diminish my love for the story as a whole at all.

And I love Barnabas’ figure and clothes. That “present day” double-breasted suit is tailored perfection and very flattering on him. Louis Edmonds wears wonderful clothes as well. There is an episode shortly before the 1795 storyline begins where he is wearing a matching houndstooth vest and jacket with dark trousers that I want to see my man in so bad! I have been looking for something similar for him for Christmas, lol!

I did some back ground reading last week and discovered much of what has been said upthread about Jonathan Frid, Louis Edmonds and Joel Crothers. It had me wondering what their conversations must have been!

Biotop - I wondered about how Barnabas could possibly have any money, too. It would have all been inherited by other people by now, and if he had any personal money in a bank it would have reverted back to the family. More of that fabulous Dark Shadows Magic!

I am up episode 470, not as much as I had planned, it was partly real life getting in the way and getting absorbed in that background reading I just mentioned.

Some favorite scenes from the latter part of the 1795 storyline are when Joshua finds out that Barnabas is a vampire. It was so satisfying that I backed it up and watched it again! Louis Edmonds really surprised me in this scene, he was quite good, and Jonathan Frid was stellar as usual. Another was Naomi’s suicide, and also Angelique’s surprise courtroom appearance.

And speaking of Angelique, I know she is about to show up…Vicky bought this painting of her and Roger (in another smart double-breasted jacket & stylish suede loafers) is getting hypnotized by it. A terrific scene is Barnabas attempting to destroy it and the painting restores itself! Love it!

Apparently Barnabas doesn’t know how to drive a car, because Vicky was drive them to the cemetery when they had the wreck, which has brought in this Dr. Lang dude.

When they showed Barnabas in the hospital I was 20 shades of WTF, because how in the Hell did they not detect this was a dead guy? HAHAHAaaahhaa!! And Barnabas just so happens to fall into the hands of yet another rogue physician in tiny little Collinsport! Halleujah and pass the biscuits!

I am still loving Julia Hoffman, and too funny they talked about her new hairstyle. In most soaps they didn’t mention such stuff.

Still wanting to know what is up with all the “new” characters…except I can;t muster up too much care for the whole Vicky/Jeff Clark(peter bradford) storyline.

So, Miss Mapp - I guess all the present day Collins’ are descended from Daniel Collins?

[Grumbacher_Red]

Biotop - Yes, I think Vicky going back in time had to have changed history, because Barnabas knew who Phyllis Wick was, and he said she was Sarah’s governess who was tried for witchcraft. He did not know who Vicky was until 1966, so I think it is safe to say she altered it. That makes for easy explanations of differences, too!

Kathryn Leigh Scott has not been on screen in quite some time, I hope to see her soon.

[Siam_Sam]

It seems to me a vampire can always access money. There are supernatural ways to enter and exit bank vaults, or maybe just go someplace far enough away and kill someone with enough cash. Just because it may have happened off camera doesn’t mean it didn’t happen at all.

[Grumbacher_Red]

@Siam_Sam

It seems to me a vampire can always access money. There are supernatural ways to enter and exit bank vaults, or maybe just go someplace far enough away and kill someone with enough cash. Just because it may have happened off camera doesn’t mean it didn’t happen at all.

True enough! I know Barnabas has the power to mesmerize, although they don’t show him using it much.

[Miss_Mapp]

@Grumbacher_Red

So, Miss Mapp - I guess all the present day Collins’ are descended from Daniel Collins?

That’s right. You’ll see Daniel again as an old man (played by Louis Edmonds) in the 1840 storyline with his own family.

Oh, about money. Barnabas has that big box of what I suppose were mostly his mother’s jewels (although there are some hideously expensive earrings that did belong to Josette); they must have been hidden in some secret place at the Old House for the last 170 years. When he needs cash, he sends Willie out to pop a diamond ring or bracelet.

[Grumbacher_Red]

@Miss_Mapp

That’s right. You’ll see Daniel again as an old man (played by Louis Edmonds) in the 1840 storyline with his own family.

Oh, about money. Barnabas has that big box of what I suppose were mostly his mother’s jewels (although there are some hideously expensive earrings that did belong to Josette); they must have been hidden in some secret place at the Old House for the last 170 years. When he needs cash, he sends Willie out to pop a diamond ring or bracelet.

Thanks for confirming about Daniel.

Ah yes, I do recall something being said pretty early on about Willie hocking some jewels, but I thought it must have been the ones Barnabas himself was buried with. If he was able to hide away some of Naomi’s ice he must have done it quick because there wasn’t much time after Naomi died and Joshua chained him up. He could have done it in those hours right after that Goodbye scene between Joshua and Barnabas, which, btw, was another wonderfully acted scene with Frid and Edmonds.

And damn, Vicky is so easily suggestable! Both Julia and Barnabas are able to hypnotize her at the drop of a hat! I know Carolyn and Maggie have both been spellbound as well, but it took much more effort and they both ultimately shook it off and regained control. Vicky was ready to run off and marry Barnabas with very little prompting and far fewer bites. She goes along with the men so easily. Even taking into account the narrow world of females in the 1960s and her background as a parentless child, Vicky just seems to have no sense of self at all, and is showing NO sign of developing one. It makes me understand why Alexandra found playing her a drag after awhile, this character isn’t evolving.

[Leo_Krupe]

Don Draper, we thought about those things as well, especially about the secret room in the crypt. In my mind, “in universe,” it fits within the crypt building, so if one walks around it, it’s not obvious. Of course, it was that size for cameras and production.

Barnabas’ clothing, etc. He’s a vampire. Undead. Meaning he has powers beyond anyone else’s, so off-camera, he managed to coerce Willie/a tailor/someone else to get/create an outfit for him. Remember, Barnabas was able to convince Willie to unlock the coffin while Barnabas was still chained up. How did Barnabas know about Willie? Or did he just send out thoughts to anyone (Mayday! Mayday!) and Willie was sensitive enough to pick them up?

[carnivorousplant]

@Leo_Krupe

Remember, Barnabas was able to convince Willie to unlock the coffin while Barnabas was still chained up. How did Barnabas know about Willie? Or did he just send out thoughts to anyone (Mayday! Mayday!) and Willie was sensitive enough to pick them up?

I though Willie was just…Willieing away in the mausoleum and opened Barnabas from curiosity or hoping he good steal something.

[Grumbacher_Red]

@carnivorousplant

I though Willie was just…Willieing away in the mausoleum and opened Barnabas from curiosity or hoping he good steal something.

Yeah, I thought Willie was motivated by the story of the jewels in the portrait having been buried with Barnabas and that’s why he was poking around…but since I started watching pretty much right at the episode where Willie finds the Secret Room and opens the coffin, I missed what made him think there was more thna meets the eye about that mausoleum.

As for size, I’ll just buy into the idea that the Collins’ Mausoleum is like Dr. Who’s Tardis.

[Grumbacher_Red]

@Leo_Krupe

Barnabas’ clothing, etc. He’s a vampire. Undead. Meaning he has powers beyond anyone else’s, so off-camera, he managed to coerce Willie/a tailor/someone else to get/create an outfit for him. Remember, Barnabas was able to convince Willie to unlock the coffin while Barnabas was still chained up. How did Barnabas know about Willie? Or did he just send out thoughts to anyone (Mayday! Mayday!) and Willie was sensitive enough to pick them up?

Yes, an inelegant vampire is really just a few steps away from a zombie and they can’t be seen or even thought to associate with that crowd! How gauche and tacky!!

[Miss_Mapp]

@Grumbacher_Red

Yeah, I thought Willie was motivated by the story of the jewels in the portrait having been buried with Barnabas and that’s why he was poking around…but since I started watching pretty much right at the episode where Willie finds the Secret Room and opens the coffin, I missed what made him think there was more thna meets the eye about that mausoleum.

In the episodes right before Willie finds Barnabas, Willie hears the story about Naomi’s jewels being buried with her, so he’s interested in the crypt. And he notices the bling Barnabas is wearing in his portrait. But more than that, the painting’s eyes start to light up and we hear the sound of a heartbeat. So it’s really both the temptation of jewelry and Barnabas drawing him in that leads Willie to find the coffin.

[salinqmind]

It was often wondered how many vampires in ‘True Blood’ were so wealthy. Some had been alive for centuries, so I suppose if they were bright enough to stay alive and thrive, they could accumulate wealth. And it was said somewhere they got rich off of their victims - robbing or mesmerizing the wealthy.

[Grumbacher_Red]

@salinqmind

It was often wondered how many vampires in ‘True Blood’ were so wealthy. Some had been alive for centuries, so I suppose if they were bright enough to stay alive and thrive, they could accumulate wealth. And it was said somewhere they got rich off of their victims - robbing or mesmerizing the wealthy.

This is what I used to think about Anne Rice’s vampires, that they were so enticing and beautiful that they could charm they way into, and wealthy people out of…money and nice things.

[salinqmind]

If a vampire is the monster-type hiding in the woods or whatever, spending the day in a crypt, it wouldn’t need clothes, money, or social standing.

Wasn’t it Dracula, the Bram Stoker vampire, who was brought out of the shadows into society? I often wondered, ‘why’. Did he run out of victims in his native land? Why did Barnabas show up at Collinswood, ‘I am your long lost cousin’?
Why not fly under the radar, so to speak? (Although I suppose there would be no stories, otherwise! Just ‘don’t go into the cemetery at night’.)

[Miss_Mapp]

@salinqmind

Wasn’t it Dracula, the Bram Stoker vampire, who was brought out of the shadows into society? I often wondered, ‘why’. Did he run out of victims in his native land? Why did Barnabas show up at Collinswood, ‘I am your long lost cousin’?
Why not fly under the radar, so to speak? (Although I suppose there would be no stories, otherwise! Just ‘don’t go into the cemetery at night’.)

I can’t say about Dracula, but for Barnabas, Collinwood is his home. Listen to how he talks about the Old House when he first comes back to it and restores it; next to Josette, it’s his one true love. Vampire or not, he* is* one of the family and wants to get back into as much of his old life as he can.

[Broomstick]

The other thing is, if I recall, Barnabas is the type of vampire that really does prefer to rest in/on his “native earth” during the day, he just wouldn’t sleep as well anywhere else (if what vampires do during the day could be called “sleep” - arguably it’s also “coma” and “dead”). So he does have some incentive to come back to Collinwood over and above the fact his family is there.

[Rick_Kitchen]

@salinqmind

If a vampire is the monster-type hiding in the woods or whatever, spending the day in a crypt, it wouldn’t need clothes, money, or social standing.

Wasn’t it Dracula, the Bram Stoker vampire, who was brought out of the shadows into society? I often wondered, ‘why’. Did he run out of victims in his native land? Why did Barnabas show up at Collinswood, ‘I am your long lost cousin’?
Why not fly under the radar, so to speak? (Although I suppose there would be no stories, otherwise! Just ‘don’t go into the cemetery at night’.)

“Varney the Vampire” written circa 1845, had a debonair, wealthy vampire not living in the shadows.

[Leo_Krupe]

@Miss_Mapp

In the episodes right before Willie finds Barnabas, Willie hears the story about Naomi’s jewels being buried with her, so he’s interested in the crypt. And he notices the bling Barnabas is wearing in his portrait. But more than that, the painting’s eyes start to light up and we hear the sound of a heartbeat. So it’s really both the temptation of jewelry and Barnabas drawing him in that leads Willie to find the coffin.

Thinking back, I’m sure you’re right about the jewels. It’s been a few years (3 or 4) since we’ve watched it.

For the money vampires have when they re-awaken, I’d think they’d have the foresight the protagonist in Where Were You Last Pluterday? did…(I’m sure someone will correct my once-again faulty memory)…he went to the past, wrote books, then went to the future and collected the royalties.

[Don_Draper]

@salinqmind

If a vampire is the monster-type hiding in the woods or whatever, spending the day in a crypt, it wouldn’t need clothes, money, or social standing.

Wasn’t it Dracula, the Bram Stoker vampire, who was brought out of the shadows into society? I often wondered, ‘why’. Did he run out of victims in his native land? Why did Barnabas show up at Collinswood, ‘I am your long lost cousin’?
Why not fly under the radar, so to speak? (Although I suppose there would be no stories, otherwise! Just ‘don’t go into the cemetery at night’.)

For an interesting take on what you’re talking about, check out the movie Shadow of the Vampire with John Malkovich and Willem Defoe. The conceit of that movie is that Murnau’s movie “Nosferatu” starred an actual vampire. There’s lots of meta-commentary about the process of film-making, but there is one intriguing scene where the vampire talks to some members of the film crew during some down time (because he killed the cinematographer I think.) When the crew members ask him what he thinks about the story, the vampire answers that it makes him sad. He describes how, when the Jonathan Harker character visits the castle, the vampire would have difficulty providing a meal for his ‘guest’ – where would he get bread or wine? Would he even remember how to buy groceries? The gist of it is how the vampire has been a monster so long, he only has the vaguest memories of being a human. But that he registers his forgotten nature as a terrible loss.