Community Property?

In My Humble Opinion
1

I was having a discussion with my BIL last night about his (and hub’s) Grandpa’s estate. Grandpa’s still with us, and we were saying we all wanted him to spend all his money before he goes. But Grandpa’s too stingy. He’ll die with a million bucks, easy. He’ll live in a tiny house in a bad neighborhood and wither away, just as he’s doing now. Too cheap to move to assisted living, which would benefit him and Grandma hugely. Hugely. I can’t stress how HUGELY it would benefit, well, just about everyone involved even if Grandpa doesn’t see how his high expectations of people dropping everything to help him is unrealistic.

Anyway, discussion soon turned to what will happen to Grandpa’s money once he kicks it. We all hope it will be gone, but it won’t. I stated I wanted nothing to do with it, and I quote “I NEVER WANT TO FIGHT OVER DEAD PEOPLE’S STUFF WITH ANY OF YOU”. No one commented. I’m thinking it’s probably inevitable. God I hope not. But…my BIL said I wouldn’t have to worry about it, since any money left would be my husband’s alone, and not mine at all.

As you see from my location that we’re in CA; a community property state. Is it true that I have no interest in my husband’s inheritance? I told BIL that I’d check with my smart friends and let him know the truth.

2

By community property, are you suggesting that you are entitled to an equal portion of the estate with the siblings and however many spouses they have? I’d find it hard to believe that CA law is written that way. Of course, I have zero legal training, so what do I know?

I would assume, in the absence of a will, state law specifies how the estate is divided. I tried Googling, but my eyes glazed over as I skimmed the first article I opened… I believe that in FL (where my inlaws live), if there is no will and no surviving spouse, the assets are divided among the surviving children. I can’t imagine other states differ that much, but I’m probably wrong on that.

You’ve piqued my curiosity - I hope someone who knows comes along soon…

3

I have absolutely no expectation of being named in the will. My husband will be noted though. My question is, am I entitled by community property law to half of what my husband receives in inheritance?

Or, is it as my BIL stated; that inheritances are not subject to community property division. If that latter is true, then I’ll need to spend a little thought as to how to react. I don’t really care much, just curious. I certainly don’t expect to be divorcing my husband ever so it’s kind of a non-issue. But…I’m an only child and will thus be singly named in my parents’ estate. Goes both ways, I guess.

4

I do, as the spouse of someone who inherieted money, but not in a community property state.

Here, the money was his. He wisely determined that it would be in the best interests of domestic harmony if he immediately declared we were in this together, so we took care of “our” goals with it. My BIL got divorced, but since the money had been used, house had been refinanced, etc., they wouldn’t let him seperate out “his” money during the divorce - had they kept “his” money and investments seperate, he would have walked out with “his” money.

But if Grandma is still alive, and he doesn’t have a will - she will inherit everything. And SHE may decide to move to assisted living and spend every penny.

5

[QUOTE=RSSchen]
As you see from my location that we’re in CA; a community property state. Is it true that I have no interest in my husband’s inheritance? I told BIL that I’d check with my smart friends and let him know the truth.
[/QUOTE]

Yes, yes, it’s true that you have no interest in a bequest to your spouse under California’s community property law:

6

I believe, however, that it becomes community property as soon as you move it into a bank account with both your names on it. That’s what we did when my husband and I needed to distrbute a bunch of money that he recieved from a life insurance settlement–we had to make it community property so that we could each distribute part of it without running afoul of community property laws.

Regarding fighting over the inheritance–I wouldn’t assume that he has a million dollars unless you have something more concrete than “he’s a cheap-ass bastard who made ok money for years”. IME (though I am not a lawyer or anything), disputes over property often happen because of this 1) everyone assumes there is more money than there is, because how people appear to live is often a poor reflection of their actual worth–you don’t know what expenses he might have that he didn’t share, or what poor investments he might have made, or whatever. 2) People, on some level, count on getting a certain amount 3) when they don’t get that amount, because it was never there to start with, they get bitchy and feel like somehow, they’ve been cheated. 4) the only possible object for that feeling of being “cheated” are the other people named in the will.

This happened when my grandmother died. People had done some math based on some very shaky, overly optomistic assumptions, and when the estate was not as large as they thought it would be, they had a fit and became convinced that there had been pilferage.

The only thing you can really do to avoid this (grandfather can do a lot, but as granddaughter-in-law, it’s not really your place to encourage that, I suspect) is to keep everyone from inflating their expectations. The myth of “grandpa’s fourtune” tends to grow when people edge each other on, talking when no one really knows anything.

7

[QUOTE=Manda JO]

Regarding fighting over the inheritance–I wouldn’t assume that he has a million dollars unless you have something more concrete than “he’s a cheap-ass bastard who made ok money for years”. IME (though I am not a lawyer or anything), disputes over property often happen because of this 1) everyone assumes there is more money than there is, because how people appear to live is often a poor reflection of their actual worth–you don’t know what expenses he might have that he didn’t share, or what poor investments he might have made, or whatever. 2) People, on some level, count on getting a certain amount 3) when they don’t get that amount, because it was never there to start with, they get bitchy and feel like somehow, they’ve been cheated. 4) the only possible object for that feeling of being “cheated” are the other people named in the will.

This happened when my grandmother died. People had done some math based on some very shaky, overly optomistic assumptions, and when the estate was not as large as they thought it would be, they had a fit and became convinced that there had been pilferage.

The only thing you can really do to avoid this (grandfather can do a lot, but as granddaughter-in-law, it’s not really your place to encourage that, I suspect) is to keep everyone from inflating their expectations. The myth of “grandpa’s fourtune” tends to grow when people edge each other on, talking when no one really knows anything.
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Yep. The other thing that happens is that people forget that even a million dollars divided 22 ways (by the time you divide it between children and grandchildren, etc) is less than $50,000. For some reason inheritence brings out the worst in math illiteracy.

Futhermore, if he dies without a will, his wife gets everything. If she dies without a will, their children get everything. For the grandchildren to get anything, there needs to be a will that names the grandchildren. At which point, what you are entitled to is spelled out.

Be very careful, there was a lot of bitterness when my husband’s grandfather passed on and his children didn’t get anything, but the second wife did. (She is the one who died and left us money - which we thought nice as she was in no way obligated to leave us anything - and other people thought she’d left them too little).

8

I am not your lawyer. You are not my client. What follows isn’t legal advice. Some of it may, in fact, be wrong. But we’re in IMHO, not GQ, and I feel like living a little dangerously today. Read on at your peril.

Otto is correct. A bequest made to one member of a community is separate property. Separate property remains separate property unless and until the owner of the separate property takes the appropriate steps to transmute that separate property into community property. Incidentally, people, the rules about separate property and community property are the state’s default rules. Those of you unlucky folk who happen to live in those dreary separate property states can agree with your spouse that you two will create a sweet little romantic community out of your property. Marriage is just one big freaky contract that the state helps you write, but most of its terms are up to you.

But back to your issue: the bequest to your husband is your husband’s separate property. Similarly, on your birthday when your coworkers gave you that nifty watch, that’s your separate property. If you and your husband don’t yet have wills, this might be a good time to look into that. It will give you an opportunity to discuss how you want to deal with things like this, including whether you (he, in this case) want to convert that bequest into separate property.

9

[QUOTE=Campion]
Otto is correct.
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See, if more people just adopted this as their default setting, the world would be a much better place.

10

[QUOTE=Otto]
See, if more people just adopted this as their default setting, the world would be a much better place.
[/QUOTE]

Gosh Otto you must be tomndebb’s love child!