As discussed in this Great Debates thread, and reported by the Washington Post , the FBI has began recruiting for a new anti-obscenity squad. This is not to target child porn, but porn with consenting adults, sold to adults.
I conjecured in that thread that even the conservatives on this board tend to be pretty liberal socially, and would not think this is a good idea.
Is this true? Do any self-identifying conservatives and/or Bush supporters here think this is something that the FBI should be spending resources on?
If your answer is “no” because there are greater things to worry about, such as terrorism, if we found ourselves in a relatively peaceful and safe time (not that I’m saying that has ever happened or will ever happen) would you then support a crackdown on porn depicting and sold to consenting adults, hypothetically?
How much do you think conservatives/Bush supporters in the “real world” think this is a good idea? Just the religious right, or most conservatives? (Is there an estimation of what percentage of self-identifying conservatives also identify themselves as religious right?)
Let’s not discuss the Constitutionality of this, as that is being covered by the GD thread.
I’m honestly not sure. I think in some parts of the country many religious conservatives truly feel that society has moved in a “bad” direction with all the blatant obscenity seen on television and that the government should be doing something about it. However I don’t necessarily think the Republican party or “conservatives” as a group are, by the nature of being conservative, necessarily ideologically aligned with this trian of thought. Nor do I think religious people necessarily feel this way, I think it’s a popular train of thought amongst some religious people in specific denominations and more importantly in certain areas of the country.
On retrospect, I should not have limited the first question to the FBI. I see you do not think it’s the business of the FBI to go after this stuff, but do you think any agency of the gov’t should?
Fuck no. This is just feel-good looks like we’re achieving something bullshit. It’s devious too, isn’t porn practically by definition obscene? If they’re trying to outlaw porn in general, they should be a lot more up front about it.
If they could prove that someone is being exploited, then action should be taken on a case by case basis. Other than that, as long as no one is being harmed in a criminal manner, and they’re not abusing kids or animals, why should they be prosecuted for things that don’t seem to be illegal? Getting sexual pleasure out of peeing on someone is kind of weird, but if the other person doesn’t mind…
Mostly the religious right (which does not include me, as I’m non-church going and identify only as “vaguely Christian.”) and the uptight parents of teenage boys who are afraid that their undersupervised sons will find naughty magazines and videos. See if you can find data on the number of conservatives who pushed for Parental Warning labels on music, and how many are “religious.” I figure there will be a high correlation between that group and those who support something like this.
I would support a crackdown on illegal porn sold to anyone, including “consenting adults,” but not “mainstream” porn.
I have no idea. For my part, as a libertarian/conservative, I think it’s incredibly stupid. There are more important things we should be concentrating on.
Probably not. I got to be a supporter of W via the libertarian route. So there’s a big part of me that says “Do whatever you want…”
But OTOH for the last four years I’ve been a lot more open to social conservatives. I still don’t agree with them on a lot, but I don’t find them threatening at all. And if you look at what’s going on these days as a clash of civilizations, then…I guess…maybe…I’d possibly…consider some ideas about the government getting inolved in some of these issues.
Well firstly as the issue has come up, I’m talking about “generalized obscenity.” Specific types of pornography (I’m mostly talking about child pornography, or any pornography where someone is in it against their own will) should and is criminalized and that is the business of the law enforcement agencies of the federal government.
But “general obscenity” isn’t something government should be trying to “suppress.” I don’t think, morally, pornography of any kind is really a good thing. However just because I find pornography inappropriate and even “wrong” morally doesn’t mean that it should be the business of law enforcement. As long as we’re talking about consenting adults viewing/digesting pornography (strictly pornography featuring consenting legal-aged parties) I have no problem with it. It’s not how I want to spend my time but I don’t think it’s the business of the government to get involved in that.
That was going to be my question. After all, they could just make all porn illegal and ivylass would, based on her previous post, support cracking down on it. I suspect, however, that her position might not be quite that simple.
There’s a vast, wide gulf between the two, so we need to be perfectly clear here: what is obscene and what is not, and is there any way to come to a satisfactory definition of obscenity that all parties will agree to?
But there’s a considerable issue even with this. Prongs Four and Five refer to “contemporary community standards”, and this means that any obscenity charge must be brought in that community. The United States of America does not constitute “community”. Standards in large cities, for example, aren’t the same as those in small towns. What’s acceptable in New York might not be in Chicago.
Suffice it to say, there is no one definition of obscenity. There’s just too much wiggle room on either side for that to be feasible.
The news article specifically ruled out kiddie porn and defined the sort of porn that would be targetted. The question is, do YOU think these meet the obscenity test.