Convince me I should believe in your god

Great Debates
1

I invite any and all believers to put forth compelling reasons for me to believe in god. I am a hard case, but I will not be combative (just annoyingly passive-aggressive with my questions).

Bear in mind that I have some first-hand experience. I know very well that faith can make a person feel amazingly good – but so can the Owsley stuff, or that girl who does the, um, nevermind that. Personally, I do not trust feeling really good, I have been in love before, love has the power to cloud one’s mind.

So, what have you got? Not a god, but make the case for your god. In your own words, scripture will summarily be ignored, as will fighting words (from any side).

My apologies if this is a retread of two score similar threads.

2

Convert to the worship of Dread Cthulhu, and you may yet hope to be eaten first!

3

Well, I guess if you wan to burn in hell for all eternity, suffering in agony every second, crying out in pain, with never a moment of respite, that’s your business!

4

Dionysian revels. Need I say more?

5

The pear of anguish may help change your mind.

6

Threats of hell don’t do much to convince someone who doesn’t believe in hell that your god is the right one. That’s like threatening coal in the stocking to someone who doesn’t believe in Santa.

7

Proof starts at about 3:20.

8

I’m trying not to cross the line into threadshitting territory here, but: For You, Is there anything to be gained from this thread? There aren’t a lot of religious people here that are going to take your bait, and those that do aren’t likely to “realize” you’re right after all, especially when the thread is basically “Hey religious people, come here so I can make fun of you!”

9

I could try to convince you, but Om hardly believes in Himself anymore, much less expecting anyone else to believe in Him.

10

So does alcohol.

Sleep it off, For You.

11

I like the haze that comes with love. Maybe some minds need to be a little cloudy so that they can enjoy living. All left-brain and no right-brain thinking really warps a view of reality, I think. The opposite is true too.

12

Now back to the directive in the OP: “Convince me I should believe in your god…”

No, that would be against my religion.

13

When I was young, I was raised by atheist parents and became an atheist myself. Mainly during my college years I spent vast amounts of time on this message board and other forums insulting religious believers and proclaiming my superiority to them. At the time, I severely limited my intellectual exploration, not reading any books and barely talking to anybody except those who I was sure would agree with my own prejudices. And at the time, I was extremely unhappy almost all of the time.

After leaving college and entering graduate school, I began to suspect that there were vast intellectual landscapes which my education had left out. Hence I began reading books, studying topics, and talking to people who challenged my inherent beliefs that I had clung to throughout my life. As a result of doing so, I began to change my mind about things which I had previously simply assumed to be true. That produced, among a great many other things, my conversion to Christianity. And now, rather than being unhappy, I am mostly pretty happy.

You’ve obviously decided to respond to such testimonies by saying things like “Love has the power to cloud one’s mind.” This true, no doubt. I also know from the experience of my own past that hatred and sarcasm and smug feelings of superiority have the power to cloud my mind, and overall I doubt any human being has ever been able to think pure reason without some clouding by emotion. We can, however, decide to some extent which clouds we wish, and I’d take love over the absence of love any day of the week.

14

On this message board? Never known you as a unbeliever participating on this board. Lots of sound arguments can be used without having to resort to that. I doubt you could have been too insulting, moderators would only have allowed that to a certain degree or maybe it was a bit different then. Do you recall what threads these were on?

15

Thanks for the personal story, it illustrates that different people’s personal needs can be addressed in different ways. For some, it appears that believing is what is needed to stay balanced.

I have learned fairly recently that being right is of great value in the lab, but we do not spend much of our time there, we live with people. Most of us are wrong about most stuff most of the time, or at least we can benefit from looking through others’ eyes. (Ever play with a three-year-old and see through their eyes?)

I am just failing to see that believing makes one less hateful. I spend almost all of my time not being hateful, it is too consuming. I even make a bit of an effort at not feeling superior to anyone else, because we really are all kind of screwed up in our own special ways.

16

razncain: Insults against Christians are pretty much given a free pass on this message board. But my earlier self did not pour out thousands of posts calling Christians murderers and bigots and idiots, claiming that the Nazis were Christians, or all the other stuff that certain members of this message say routinely. I was, however, quite dismissive of religion in general, as expressed in posts like this one.

The juxtaposition of what I wrote then with my current signature line is somewhat amusing.

17

That depends on what you believe. If you believe and take to heart Christian teaching about love, and forgiveness, and humility, and thankfulness, and removing the log from your own eye, and did I mention love? it ought to make you less hateful. And many of us find that believing in a loving, forgiving, generous God helps us to be more loving and forgiving and generous ourselves—or at least I hope so.

As for convincing you that you should believe in God, I don’t think anyone can do that on a message board. The best I can hope for is to urge you to be open to God: to question some of your assumptions and prejudices; to read and think and talk to people (the non-hateful ones, the ones you can see yourself admiring or relating to); maybe even to pray.

18

I wouldn’t consider you a “hard case.” Multitudes of skeptics existed before you, and will surely come after as well. Moreover, FAITH, is a rare gift - opens the mind and changes the heart - without which would make it IMPOSSIBLE for anyone to persuade you towards God.

Case and point:

LUKE 16 (excerpt)

And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father’s house:

28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

19

Which god?

20

“Which god?”

How many do you have?