Cop uses taser on handcuffed 9 yr old girl

No, no, no, you misunderstand Silenus - he rightly pointed out that I am a fraudulent mindreader, and went on to prove that he is the real deal, by telling me what I was thinking.

He can read mine too!

Nah

He’s just a fucking idiot.

Question: Taser vs. Stun Gun. I thought a stun gun was a hand held device that looked kind of like an electric razor an Catwoman used in the second Batman movie. A taser fires a metal dart (with wire) at the person while simultaneously firing another metal dart (with wire) off at an angle to the ground to complete a circuit.

Am I mistaken? Is there a difference between the two?

Taser is a commercial name - see www.taser.com

Well, they have studied electric shock and children, mainly around the issue of cardioversion and the joules needed to restore normal rhythm. There have been extrapolated juvenile primate studies on the amount of electrical force needed to throw an immature heart into an aberrant rhythm.

In both cases, the forces needed are far, far higher than the Taser supplies.

Sometimes, one has to weigh the situation quickly and try to choose wisely.

BTW, here’s taser info: http://www.taser.com/pages/citizen/faqs.html

Great God, I’m one for waiting for all the facts and so forth, but there are certain assumptions one can make with a fair level of safety. And unless this child has been eating “New! Lucky Charms with Bull Testosterone and PCP!” for the last 7 years, I doubt she could be a threat to any adult male while handcuffed.

Methinks it was a combination of the “boys with toys” syndrome, coupled with the “I am the policeman, also known as, your God” disorder in this specific officer. Not saying that most, or even many officers are like this - I rather think a very small number of them. But even I’ve personally known a small-town cop who would have done just these actions in the article, for the sheer power trip of it.

I have some small knowledge of “special needs” children and the facilities that exist to help meet those needs.

I stand six feet tall, and weigh upwards of 220 pounds, and I have met eleven year old boys capable of eating apples off my head without using their hands.

I have physically restrained any number of children who were attempting to harm themselves, others, or me, who successfully hoisted me off the ground, despite the fact that I was far larger than they were, and weighed as much as twice what they did, through sheer berserk force of will.

Now, I don’t know what kind of cop we’re dealing with, here, or what sort of nine year old girl. I have only the story linked in the OP to go on. However, I would like to assume that no sane cop would zap any normal nine year old girl with a taser; seems to me that the chance of serious harm (including cardiac arrhythmia) would be pretty substantial.

On the other hand, I know for a fact that there are nine year old girls who are freakin’ huge, and when seized with berserk fury, could well injure a fully growed police officer… at least partly due to a complete lack of interest in the potential consequences of doing so (ranging from “nightstick upside the head” to “jail sentence.”)

I am not crazy, or sadistic, or cruel. But if I were a cop, dealing with one of the large and dangerous children that I have encountered during my years in the mental health and education biz, and I thought the kid might well do me an injury, I might well hit 'er with the taser, and who gives a damn how old she is or whether or not she’s cuffed?

Perhaps I am right. Perhaps I am wrong. If we’re talking about some six-foot berserko amazon who was about to kick out the rear window, I’d have zapped her ass stupid, and no two ways about it.

If we’re talking some little moppet, representative of most nine-year-old girls, who got a jolt because she was pitch’n a tantrum and the cop wanted to play with his new toy, then this cop plainly deserves to be hung by his scrotum over a slow fire.

…but until I see some facts, I withhold judgment.

Keep in mind that there were at the least two…count them…two cops on the scene.

The one who called for the backup…and the back up.

There may have even been more.

Reeder,

Part of my point. How out of control do you think this kid was before the officer said “Uh guys I can’t keep her under control. Come by with a taser already” you think ANY officer would like the embarassment of calling for backup against a girl that size if there wasn’t a very serious situation going?

FWIW, I want to add that I have seen a six year old girl, special needs, get extremely angry over a punishment for her unacceptable actions to another camper (making fun of their disability).

The six year old – skinny as a pin – flew into a rage, threw a couch, two chairs, a few tables and two bed frames over in the span of under 60 seconds.

That was fucking scary. I’m sorry. I wanted to be anywhere but there at the moment (sidenote: kudos to the counselor who stayed while we herded the rest of the campers out.)

Of course, that was done without being handcuffed. But sometimes little ones are able to be a helluva lot stronger than adults.

There are a lot of facts we do not know (several good ones brought up on both sides), however. So it is hard to know either way whether he was truly justified or not.

Shadez,
glad all her limbs are still in piece

Personally, I think nine-year olds deserve an occasional shocking, just to educate them on the harshness of life.

Just kidding, natch. I can easily imagine a extreme set of circumstances where a person who happens to be female, nine, and cuffed still represents an extreme danger to herself or others, and if the choice was to zap her or club her, zapping was correct.

Determining whether or not the circumstances were actually that extreme requires more facts, and I’m prepared to reserve judgement until then. Reeder isn’t, and that’s why he’s so damn entertaining until his batteries wind down and it’s sleepy-time.

I love the fact that the Bushco supporters can’t pass up an attack.

Says a lot about them.

Is it possible that, while handcuffed, she would be able to thrash around enough to be a danger to herself? And that an attempt to subdue her could result in an officer getting bit?

Really. I’m asking. Is it possible?

Yes.

Not being a Bushco (whatever that is) supporter myself, I’ll just say you invite attacks, R-boy. Your moral outrage just screams “ridicule me!”

(reads quickly back through thread)

…Oooookay, Reeder, perhaps I’m skimming too quickly here. Precisely where did the Bush Nazis invade? I must be missing something…

Maybe anyone that criticized or disagreed with Reeder should divulge if they are a Bushco supporter.

Darkhold = Hates bush with the fire of a thousand suns. Not a member of Bushco or any affiliated group.

Like I said earlier, from what I was hearing on the news, she was attempting to kick out the window and was thrashing around pretty wildly. She was pretty nuts.

I understand what you are getting at, but tasering a 9-year old seems to me to be one of the worst ways to subdue them, from an effectiveness and health-risk standpoint. But I don’t know, no one on this Board was there of course. It’s possible that there was just a whole lot o’ panic goin’ on, and someone made what seems IMO to be a profoundly, career-ending bit of poor judgment.

I’ll go out on a limb on a side note and say even if the act was justified somehow at the time, right or wrong the publicity and outrage has likely relegated this officer to guarding abandoned grain silos in South Dakota.

Now, this is not to say that cops can’t make some screwy decisions.

I remember seeing a news video, a while back, where some greenpeace types had decided to have a sit-in in someone else’s place of business. Just sat down, using your typical nonviolent civil disobedience techniques. They sat in a circle and linked arms, and refused to be moved.

The cops showed up, and decided to pepper spray them. However, rather than just hose’m in the face, they decided to put the pepper spray on swabs and stick the swabs in the protesters’ eyes.

This frankly struck me as insane, but nobody asked my opinion. I would have thought that sticking foreign objects in the eyes of resisting arrest suspects would have been WAY more lawsuit bait than any cop would want to handle, especially if all he had to do was hose’m down real good with ordinary cop-issue pepper spray; even if their eyes are CLOSED, that stuff’s going to puddle up and get in their eyes sooner or later, and they’ll have to unlink to wipe their eyes, and hey presto! Drag 'em out and toss 'em in the paddy wagon…

…but nobody asked MY opinion. Cops do weird stuff sometimes.

Tasering a nine-year-old girl strikes me as being in the same ballpark – it just begs for something to go disastrously wrong – but, hey, I’m not a cop. Makes me wish I had some video of that little girl, though, to judge from. Was she a child with a tantrum, or was she Baby Huey?