Right, I agree - if you did indeed “coast” thru the stop sign, I don’t know what your beef is. However, if you can come up with an excuse as to why you did it (e.g., baby sick & had to get home fast), you may get out of it without points. On the advice of a friend, I went to court for a speeding ticket. Of course I had been speeding, but I didn’t get any points and he reduced the fine. I didn’t even have to have an excuse. The judge asked me about my driving record, that’s all. If you have a clean driving record, go to court and see what happens. And if the cop doesn’t show up, you get off automatically (at least here in Md.)
I think Rachelle’s anger is based on her feeling that she observed the spirit of the law rather than the letter. She feels that she did not do anything unsafe…rather than coming to a complete stop, she slowed down to three miles an hour or so. She also did not do anything that everybody else does not do all the time. If you’ve never rolled a stop, write in and tell us about it. You might also mention that you’ve never had a drink, masturbated, or said a swear word. Come on. Everybody does it. So do you.
And that’s where the problem is. The rolling-stop-signs law is selectively enforced. Not everybody who rolls a stop gets busted. In fact, almost nobody who rolls a stop gets busted. So when you get busted for rolling a stop, you get mad. Laws only work when they apply to everybody all the time, and busting somebody for violating a law that is only rarely enforced seems capricious and arbitrary. And capricious and arbitrary enforcement of the law causes the law to be resented and people to disrespect its enforcers.
Have I rolled through a stop sign? Sure. But every time I did it, I knew I was rolling more than the car – I was rolling dice, taking a chance that I would be caught. If I had been, I would have accepted the consequences of getting caught with good grace.
This is the way the system works. The law is clear. If you violate it, there is a chance you’ll get caught. I’m sorry - the selective enforcement argument doesn’t cut it with me. It’s all part of the chance you’re taking.
Don’t like the consequences or the odds? Don’t break the law.
That said, she’s certainly entitled to explore all legal options to defeat or lessen the consequences. That, too, is part of the system.
- Rick
Ha! I’ve never rolled a stop. Of course, I’ve run a red light more than once, and ran a stop a couple of times. 
Rachelle, try http://www.lawstreet.com/lawguide/KSTR.html
Rachelle, you might want to check http://www.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/004968.html if you’re trying to beat the ticket.
I think California outlawed speed traps a few years ago. That didn’t stop cops from setting them up, though drivers who fought speedtrap-related tickets usually won in court. I don’t know where this currently stands, though. And it looks like it’s not pertinent to your situation.
You’re only as old as you look.
Geesh, another poster who starts a thread to see if he or she can get out of having broken the law by using a legal technicality. <throwing hands in air>
That having been said, the answer to the OP is that it would vary state to state. I don’t know the details (you might try asking Melin), but I do know that in California in the 70’s there were some very stringent curbs placed on what the police could use to establish violation of speed control laws. I also remember the uproar there when the state Highway Patrol started using unmarked cars as an experiment.
Seems like the principle at issue is the second one I suggested: it’s not fair when you get caught if you thought you were getting away with it.
Laws are enforced “selectively” because the police can’t be everywhere, all the time.
I’m with Bricker on this.
In my suburban neighborhood they recently erected two new stop signs, 100 yards apart, for two side streets that intersected with the “main” street. For the first week, practically no one bothered to obey them. I can understand blowing by them at first out of force of habit for those who use the street daily, but this continued, like I said, of one week…until the police parked a cruiser there, both during the day and at night (sporadically). During the night shifts, the cruisers parking lights were on.
Those who live on this street now make a token attempt at a stop, but not many come to a full stop. I quess it’s good enough for everyone concerned.
Haven’t seen a cop there since.
FYI…There are something like 45 (give or take) drivers ticketed (in NY) each year for going ONE mile over the posted speed limit. Cops, in most of these cases, were looking to find additional violations of the law however, but for those who just happened to be “speeding”, I can only imagine their frustration. (Cite provided upon request)
That is, of course, ONE mile per hour over the limit.
Here in Montana, they can hide, they just can’t conceal the car. A cop can park the car anywhere he damn well pleases. Popular spots are between other parked cars, behind trees, in between piles of snow, etc. They may not, however, conceal the car by putting camo netting over it, or covering it with brush or anything else.
I’m with Bricker as well. Saying “everybody does it so it shouldn’t count” is a bunch of crap. Yes, I did a rolling stop once when I was in High School, got a ticket and have never done it again since. I also signal every turn and lane change the required number of feet depending on highway or city streets, pull over to the right for emergency vehicles, and stop for the school bus when the lights are flashing. The law is not optional or open for debate; it does not change depending on how crowded the road is, how late at night it is or how inconvenient it is for you. Stop trying to lump everyone in with you because you’re a scofflaw.
Love stinks! (Yeah, yeah!)
This reminds me of a letter in the paper a couple months back. A woman wrote in complaining “I parked in a no-parking zone just for a minute and got a ticket for $30!”
Um, so? She broke the law. It was a no-parking zone for a reason. People could’ve died in a fire because she was blocking a hydrant. “Just for a minute”…does that make it less illegal?
So many people seem to forget that driving is a privilege, not a right. They teach the road laws in driving school. They are there for a reason. It doesn’t matter how late it was, or how little traffic there was…it was a stop sign that you went through. You took the risk, you got caught, and now you have to face the consequences. That’s the way it works.
And $52 isn’t much of a fine–here it’s $120 for stop signs and $140 for red lights.
Just adding my weight to the Bricker line. If you don’t think a law is fair, complain, protest, whatever, but breaking it and expecting sympathy is a bit rich.
I never touched him, ref, honest!
Zulu: “They teach the road laws in driving school. They are there for a reason.”
Unless I miss my guess, the road laws are there for public safety. Who, exactly, did Rachelle endanger, pray tell?
“It doesn’t matter how late it was, or how little traffic there was…it was a stop sign that you went through. You took the risk, you got caught, and now you have to face the consequences.”
I’m sorry to break it to you, but we don’t have traffic laws because there is something inherently moral and virtuous about having zero velocity near red octogons. The goal of all traffic laws should be public safety, and from the information we have there is no reason to believe that Rachelle endangered anyone. I certainly feel sympathy for anyone who feels the bite of an arbitrary law which is not narrowly tailored to address the goal for which it was intended. Unfortunately, it looks like she has no option but to be screwed by the system.
She endangered anyone who may have been coming the opposite direction having the right-of-way! What an asinine remark! Just because no one was injured or killed doesn’t mean what she was doing was unsafe. Ignoring traffic laws is not a valid way of “sticking it to the MAN,” which seems to be your agenda. I’m sorry you find laws to be so constraining but that’s no reason to kill the rest of us following them!
Love stinks! (Yeah, yeah!)
Erratum, the dead of night is exactly when you should follow the traffic laws to the letter. Visibility is down to virtually nil. This more than offsets the lower number of cars and pedestrians on the road.
Screwed by the system huh? I’m sure all the people who’ve been run down by people who thought ‘It’s late, there’s not going to be any pedestrians about’ will be comforted by your support of those poor defenceless drivers who broke the law and never got away with it.
Eschew Obfuscation
As Vixen and Tengu pointed out, anybody who may have been on the road that she didn’t see.
Two weeks ago an old lady suffered a broken hip when she was hit by a car that rolled the stop sign to make a right turn, while watching for traffic from the left. The driver neglected to look to the right for any pedestrians. The pedestrian had the right of way, and she was already on the crosswalk. She was lucky…most people just speed right through the stop sign without slowing if there’s no vehicle traffic.
A child was injured several weeks ago near my home. A driver didn’t want to bother waiting for someone to make a left turn in the middle of a street in single lane traffic. So, the driver passed on the right, which is illegal here, without slowing. He hit the child, who was walking along the median.
As a pedestrian, I can’t tell you how much it frightens me that I have to share roads with people who think it’s okay to pick and choose when it’s okay to break a simple traffic law.
First of all Mattk, I’m not looking for sympathy. I understand that I broke the law by rolling through the stop sign. What I’m pissed about is the fact that I got a ticket instead of a warning.
That John Denver’s full of shit man!
In your view, Rachelle, what should be the criteria for a warning as opposed to a ticket?
I could certainly understand if you said, “I’m disappointed I got a warning instead of a ticket.” But when you use the word ‘pissed’ it suggests you believe you were entitled to a warning, and unfairly received a ticket instead.
- Rick
Disappointment doesn’t cover the way I feel about receiving this ticket. I should have gotten a warning because I have a clean record. I have never had a ticket before in the 10 years I’ve been driving.
That John Denver’s full of shit man!