I thought only FCS schools got a paycheck, not FBS G5 teams? They just get the joy of being whacked on regional TV.
I thought it was all negotiable. I can’t find a cite right now but I’ll keep looking.
Just found one: Syracuse pays CMU for visit.
Even OOC P5 opponents can get a payout if they travel. Michigan State got paid $300k for making the trip to play Oregon this year (and it’s part of a home and home two year deal that pays Oregon the same amount to make the trip to East Lansing.) The home team sells tickets, souvenirs and concessions while the traveling team has to pay to get there. They all negotiate contracts on how that money gets spread around. Home and home two game series are one big way to level the playing field but even there checks can get cut.
If Alabama, TCU, Oregon, Ohio State, Florida State and Baylor were all to lose this weekend, there would be no team there would be no teams with fewer than two losses.* In this circumstance an undefeated Colorado State, Boise State, or Louisville could sneak in. The first two lost early games putting them out of the running (although both did crack the Top 25 eventually.) They’d probably both (well, one or the other) be in the Top 10 right now and an undefeated season would cause them to jump the two loss teams.
- If Louisville went undefeated, FSU would have two losses after Saturday in my scenario.
And that’s just it… an undefeated Marshall doesn’t really mean anything. Who’s to say that Arkansas at 6-6 in the SEC West, or UT at 6-6 in the Big 12 wouldn’t have done as good or better with Marshall’s schedule? And more interestingly, does anyone think Marshall would have managedr 6-6 with Auburn or UT’s schedules?
To some degree, you are comparing apples to apples when comparing records within the Power 5, but once you get outside of that, and into the second tier FCS conferences, it becomes MUCH harder to compare records. I mean, U of North Texas was 9-4 last year, but it’s pretty clear to everyone involved that any Power 5 conference team with the same record would have beat them by at least 20 points. Georgia at 8-5 DID stomp them 45-21 last season.
My vote would be to split the Power 5 off into their own conference- there’s a very clear talent and funding difference between the Power 5 and the rest. It’s not fair to schools like Rice, SMU, Marshall, Tulane and UCF to be competing in the same bracket with schools like Alabama, Oregon, Texas A&M, UT, Notre Dame, Penn State, et al.
Probably worth considering that the odds were pretty low when only two teams played in the BCS National Championship game. Similar issues with strength of schedule and having a hard time getting a competitive power conference team to schedule them existed then. At least now they only have to slip in to 4th to make the playoff.
Louisville is in the ACC.
Even if that happened I still think your hypothetical undefeated Louisville*, 2-loss PAC 12 champ Arizona, 2-loss SEC champ Missouri, and either 2-loss Big 12 co-champ Kansas State or 2-loss Big 10 champ Wisconsin would all get in ahead of an undefeated Boise State or Colorado State. Heck I would bet Mississippi State or Michigan State would make it in before a mid major would.
*Louisville is a P5 team not a mid major.
Yeah, I forgot about that. I still think an undefeated MWC team would be in the Top 4 in the AP Poll and I also think that the committee would put them in as well (If that scenario were to happen).
I do not think either team is better than all those others, but that’s not the way things work in College Football.
Of course the cynical view would be that there can never be a Marshall vs Boise State (or whoever) playing in the Championship game. The sponsors/network/college finance guys would never allow it.
What have they accomplished? They have one win against a top 20 team, and that was in overtime. They’re squeaking out all their games. If a mid major team was blowing out everyone they played there’s no reason to think they wouldn’t be ranked just as high.
see post #9
Marshall was blowing out everyone they played and only made it to #24 on the committees poll.
I should clarify, NCAA Football has three divisions, historically: I, II, and III. I was eventually divided into two divisions, IA and IAA.
Then IA was renamed FBS (Football Bowl Subdivision) and IAA FCS (Football Championship Subdivision.) I think you guys are confusing FBS/FCS with each other. Marshall is an FBS school, North Texas in an FBS school. People have traditionally referred to IA schools that are very weak compared to the “power” conferences as “mid-majors.” The power conferences have changed over time (Pac-10/12, Big 10, Big 12, Big 8, SWC, ACC, Big East, SEC have all been considered power conferences, the Big East absorbed a lot of traditional power IA independents in the early 90s, the Big 8 and SWC combined to form the Big 12), but generally the mid majors haven’t. Bowling Green was considered a mid major in the 80s and still are today. Only a few have moved around, Louisville was a mid major in the 80s and is a power conference school today, SMU was a power conference school and is a mid major now. Some schools have historically been considered football powers as independents, Notre Dame is just the last prominent one, but prior to the 90s lots of schools that were legit in football were independent. The Big East actually was formed partly because there were so many good football independents in the east at that point, and the pre-existing basketball conference saw an opportunity to expand in to football.
When I mentioned Marshall had a schedule worse than 20 some FCS schools that means they actually had an SOS lower than 128 (there are only 128 FBS schools), which is why I said their SOS was actually lower than some FCS schools. (ATM it’s ranked 134 by Sagarin.)
What have they accomplished? They have won all of their games, that is what they have accomplished.
They beat Clemson, who only three losses are against FSU, GaTech, and UGA. Probably the best 3 loss team in the country.
They beat Louisville which is just outside the top 50.
Th #5 team in the CFP poll is Ohio State. Just what have they accomplished? and anticipating your answer, What has Michigan State accomplished?
What have they accomplished? They have won all of their games but 1, that is what they have accomplished.
They beat Michigan State, who only two losses are against OSU and Oregon. Probably the best 2 loss team in the country.
They beat Minnesota which is just outside the top 25.
Thanks for the history lesson on the conferences. Good summary.
I think some people are giving to much credence to Sagarin. Everyone of the SEC teams is ranked in the top 22 in Strength of Schedule. That tells me that Sagarin formulas are self perpetuating. SEC teams SoS are good because they play each other. They get better because they play each other. and so on and so on.
Heck, Sagarin has 6-6 Arkansas ranked AHEAD of 12-0 FSU. FSU is ranked 17th!
Does anyone think that passes the SMELL Test?
Here is a summary of the AP polls and the computer rankings that used to go in the BCS formulas.
AP C AH B C M S W Team
1 1 3 2 2 1 1 2 Alabama
2 2 1 1 1 4 17 1 Florida St
3 3 2 3 4 2 5 3 Oregon
4 4 5 5 5 3 3 4 TCU
6 6 4 4 3 8 13 5 Ohio St
5 5 9 7 13 5 8 8 Baylor
8 8 6 11 6 10 23 7 Arizona
10 10 8 6 8 6 4 6 Mississippi St
7 7 16 8 14 9 10 12 Michigan St
9 9 10 12 16 11 12 10 Kansas St
13 14 11 14 7 7 2 9 Mississippi
11 11 15 10 15 19 15 18 Wisconsin
12 12 12 13 10 16 18 14 Georgia Tech
14 13 13 9 12 15 16 15 Missouri
15 15 18 15 18 12 6 19 Georgia
AP = AP poll
C = Coaches
AH = Anderson and Hester
B = Billingsley
C = Colley
M = Massey
S = Sagarin
W = Wolfe
Again, this is a hypothesis at odds with experience: in the last ten years, the precedent has been that undefeated teams that beat at least two P5s can be ranked above 2-loss P5s, and possibly above 1 loss P5s. (“Can be;” not “always will”)
In 2010, undefeated TCU was ranked #3, ahead of all 2 loss teams, and ahead of 1 loss Ohio State, Wisconsin, and Stanford
In 2009, Oregon was the highest-ranked 2 loss team, at 10-2. They had beaten #18, #4, #6, and #13 during the season. They went into the bowls #7, behind three undefeated midmajors.
If you want to argue that the playoff committee will be less sympathetic that the BCS was, fine, but before making predictions about what will never, ever happen in the future, you might want to deal with the facts of what we’ve already seen happen within the last five years.