I think you’re mixing enough apples and oranges to make a nice fruit salad. I question the worth of instilling patriotism and nationalism in our youth, but that doesn’t equate to endorse vandalism. You have the right to be patriotic or not, as you wish. You also have the right to honor deceased servicemen or not, as you wish. What these punks did was prevent others from exercising their rights.
And again, I did not want to make more of that incident in that thread than it likely was - a bunch of (probably) kids getting into trouble.
Still, one of the reasons I’m teaching certain patriotic lessons to my kids is so they will know exactly why actions like this are wrong - and why they are more wrong than ordinary acts of vandalism that don’t involve such disrespect.
I’m not sure it can be “more wrong” any more than you can get “more pregnant”. I say you can teach your youngsters that these things are wrong because they trample on other peoples’ rights, independently of the patriotism issue.
Oh no. There are degrees to every crime. Surely you know that.
Which is worse, putting a swastika in a classroom, putting one in a veterans’ cemetery, or putting one on a synagogue?
I think there’s something to be noted in the fact that these (this?) vandals went about vandalizing the graves in a manner that just had to be calculated to offend in the worst way possible. He vandalized graves. Of dead soldiers. On Memorial Day. With swastikas. I mean, we’re past the trifecta into decathlon territory. There’s a specific area of the human brain that governs the disgust response, and I’ll bet that it’s lighting up in millions of people’s brains as they read about this.
Should that, in and of itself, be a crime? Well, no, not in my opinion, but I do think it should be considered if they ever catch the vandals and indict them.
Of course, if it were up to me, I’d make it so that every time the vandals had a human interaction of any sort, it would begin with: “your behavior was despicable. My [relative/ancestor/friend/whatever] served this country, and you desecrated their service and their memory. You are a loathesome, abhorrent toad, and you should be shunned until your name is forgotten by all those who knew you. Would you like fries with that?”
But, that’s just me.
Why the swastikas? Are the pro NAZI or just commenting on US policy in the Iraq war?
Swastikas are very utilitarian: as both symbols and literal depictions of twisted assholes.
At the same time, by doing so, it makes it more likely they’ll start bragging about what they’ve done. Hopefully, when they do, someone who overhears them will call the VFW, and then, several hours later, the police. Who’ll show up, eventually, and the punks will be charged with desecrating the graves, and also with attempted assault. Despite the fact that there’ll be nary a scratch on the vets, the prosecutors will have no trouble securing a conviction, I’m sure. 
You know, I don’t have an answer to that question. It could be appropriate in a classroom as part of a study of Nazi Germany. It could be appropriate in a German veterans’ cemetary. I don’t see it as ever appropriate in a synagogue. In general, it isn’t appropriate in any of these and I don’t see any one as being significantly worse.
Maybe it’s both! They’re probably American Nazis angered at the U.S. invasion of Iraq. Saddam Hussein had famously close ties to Nazi Germany, Iraq being a fellow Axis member and all. Most of Hitler’s inner circle actually escaped to Iraq at the end of WWII, and were living in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad, and east, west, south and north somewhat.
Bolding mine.
I’m not sure that putting a swastika in any of those places is actually a crime.
Disrespectful? In poor taste? Offensive? Sure. But criminal? I don’t know about that.
Wow, thanks for pointing that out!
Oh sure, this is why Nazi hunters have been striking out in South America lately. All the really good Nazis have been in Iraq. Of course, since the invasion, there is some evidence that they were smuggled across the border into Syria. One thing that has to be said for Nazis, they’re extremely portable.
Would it surprise you to know that that is indeed the case?
Would it also surprise you to know that in most jurisdictions, the act of placing the swastika on a synagogue, or even on a church or cemetery in some places, constitutes prima facie evidence of using the swastika to intimidate. This is a felony charge in most places.
This isn’t surprising in the least, when you consider that there really is no innocent or nonintimidating way to put a swastika on a synagogue, anymore than one can nonchalantly burn a cross.
Why are you so quick to wonder if that might have been the point?
Not that it makes perfect logic, but such an act conveys contempt for the military and for the US. The single biggest motivating factor for such contempt in my estimation is the war in Iraq. It isn’t necessarily true but if I had to guess, that would be the case.
I wish you luck with that, but one need not have patriotic lessons to know why such actions are more wrong than ordinary vandalism.
On the official Wrong-O-Meter, the first scores a 76, the second is a Code Blue, and the third is Grade B.
No, none of that would surprise me, although i’d like to see some evidence of the appropriate laws.
The point i was making was how ridiculous your argument was, because, as someone has already pointed out, putting a swastika up in a school classroom might be perfectly acceptable in the context of a class about the Third Reich. How that compares to putting one up on a synagogue, i’m not sure.
And you still haven’t made any convincing argument about the alleged connection between BobLibDem’s attitude to patriotism in the other thread, and his comments in this one. The link you make between them is so spurious as to cast doubt on your intelligence and rationality. I never suspected you were part of the milroyj-style dribbling idiot brigade, but i could have been wrong.
was anyone else misled by the thread title?
I came in expecting to have to defend the rights of humanity to defend themselves against the undead…
Well, just so I’m not completely OT, defacing graves period is low, and this just takes the cake. I’m not much for actually believing in ghosts and whatnot, but I sincerely hope those kids get haunted by some sort of Christine demon-thingy.
Jerks :mad: