When asked what circumstances require an emergency late-term abortion (Partial-birth abortion), in case of the mother’s life and/or health, the esteemed Crafter_Man replied:
WTF? Since WHEN? We’ve had these debates before, and some of those in the medical profession here on the SDMB have said otherwise.
What the fuck is your problem? Do you HONESTLY think a woman will just wake up in her seventh month and say, “Gee, I don’t want to be pregnant anymore!”
Are you really so blind when it comes to your beliefs that you refuse to see reality?
Get this through your thick little skull, you misogynist piece of shit: No one LIKES abortion. No one does it for shits and giggles. But it’s a complex world out there, and sometimes, SOMETIMES, nature throws up and a late term abortion is the best option for a woman. I’ve talked to women who’ve had to have them, and they’re not happy. These pregnancies are WANTED, and most women are very upset at having to go through this. However, for some strange reason, they actually -gasp!- want to live.
And maybe if you pulled your head out of your ass once in a while, you’d see that life is not so black and white as you would have it.
Are you contending that each and every late-term abortion performed in this country was physically, medically necessary to save the life of the mother, Guin?
No, life isn’t black and white. Including the fact that some (not all) women who have late term abortions don’t have them for medical reasons.
To state, “These pregnancies are WANTED…” is seeing things in black and white, more so than Crafter Man’s comments.
On what basis do you get off calling him 'misogysist piece of shit"? If it’s on the basis of the comment you quoted, I just don’t see it. That would mean everyone who is opposed to late term abortions is a misogynist, do you think that is true?
However, it seems Crafter_Man is implying that NONE of them have.
I don’t think everyone who is opposed to late-term abortions is a misogynist-far from it! I’m opposed to them myself-when they are done for the purpose of birth control.
HOWEVER, to say that they are never medically necessary, and that to say so is only an excuse-that’s absolute bullshit.
Maybe your’re a better mind-reader than I and actually understand what Guin was really saying. But I read that to mean “these pregnancies” referred to the women she’s talked to about later-term abortions.
Since the mental “well-being” of the mother is considered a “valid health reason”, it is entirely possible for a woman who doesn’t desire a child to find a doctor who will agree that the procedure is necessary for her mental health.
I think we’re in substantial agreement, then. It’s clear that many of these are motivated by legitimate medical concerns, and to suggest otherwise seems wilfully blind.
To the question that what kinds of conditions would make a late-term/PBA medically necessary.
In other words, it’s never used to save a woman’s health.
I’m sure the loopholes are used already-d’uh. However, I’d imagine that they are the minority. The MAJORITY are already used in emergencies, I believe.
Since the quote was in response to being asked “what circumstances require an emergency late-term abortion (Partial-birth abortion), in case of the mother’s life and/or health”, that sure sounds like saying they are never medically necessary to me.
I was actually a tad annoyed in that thread that rather than answering the question, a few posters (Crafter_Man included) decided to turn it into a debate rather than just answering the question.
And yes, I suppose “none” could be a valid answer, if the poster provided a cite of some sort.
The first sentance definately looks to me as if he’s saying “There are no circumstances where a partial birth abortion will save a womans life” I’m happy to be corrected if he disagrees. (autz - how did you read it?)
The second sentance is technically true imho, but (especially wrt to the first sentance) carries the implication that they want an exception because it will be used as a loophole, which is I suspect how he meant it.
FTR, I think some people do want no-questions asked 8-month abortions, but that most people (specifically normal “pro-choice” people) find this worse than even ‘no 8-day abortions’ people. But this’d just cloud the issues.
Looks like Crafter_Man isn’t TOO far off with his assessment. I think this illustrates the point very well. If a late term pregnancy needs to be terminated for the health of the mother, that does not necessarily equal abortion. There are other options out there.
Do you HONESTLY think a woman will just wake up in her seventh month and say, "Gee, I don’t want to be pregnant anymore!"
That’s exactly what my suite mate did in college. Knew she was pregnant, lived in denial till the 7th month and jaunted off to Georgia to have one done. Refer to the other PBA thread (the “could doctors be that evil” one) if you wanna know the whole story.
aren’t those really opposites? There are people who are in strong denial of reality (I see it all the time, not relating to pregnancies), which kinda means, that, no, they **don’t ** know.
Yes, you can say "but they had to have known, they didn’t have a period, they kept throwing up, got bigger " etc etc etc, but if some one is actually in denial, no, they don’t ‘know’.
Guin, the fact remains that there are women out there who will do unspeakable things to avoid motherhood. I doubt that they would stop at an elective late term abortion.
In the cases where a woman’s health is at stake, is an abortion the only acceptable option? The AMA says that there are non-abortion options in all but the most extraordinary circumstances.
The reason this is a hot button issue is purely because it is related to abortion. The number of people actually affected (endangered) by this law is very small, those that fit into the AMA’s ‘extraordinary’ group.
She knew. She kept putting off doing something about it because she was freaking out over the fact that she was pregnant with a biracial baby, which wasn’t gonna jive for her. In the 7th month she figured she oughta do something about it.