Freudian Slit said:
The difference between sitting together having a pleasant conversation back and forth and trying to walk away but getting grabbed and clutched and pawed? As long as it is an exchange of words, without manhandling or intimidation, it’s okay for him to keep trying to persuade her to change her mind. It’s only creepy when he is forcing himself on her, is physically impeding her departure.
Hippy Hollow said:
Yes, it is supposed to be Dad under the beard. But the thing is, the key to the song, is that the boy doesn’t know that it is Daddy, he thinks it really is Santa Claus. So, to his perspective, Mommy is getting friendly with Santa Claus in a way she usually is only friendly with Daddy, and a way that if he knows anything about the behavior realizes is reserved for “special” relationships. So he can tell Mommy is doing something wrong. But he’s all giggly and happy and “I’m telling Daddy!”, not upset, running and yelling, but laughing and joking. That’s why it bothers me.
Arkcon said:
Ah, thanks for explaining. Guess I was the one reading something in.
As for that specific line, basically the singer is listing all the naughty things that could have been done but weren’t. And it’s kinda a euphamism, not necessarily just kissing. So what a straight man is saying is, “I coulda been banging every ho on the street, but I stayed home by myself so I would be ‘nice’ instead of ‘naughty’, so gimme my [del]loot[/del] reward!”
The problem is are they taking the song at face value (I want loot), or with sexy overtones?
Annie-Xmas said:
I don’t get creepy, I get bitter. And a touch of nasty. “You didn’t mean anything to me, I got over you so well I don’t remember a thing about what we did.” Though I think it might be meant to be more triumphant (I’m stronger than I thought), it comes off mean (you’re worthless and unmemorable).
Simmerdown said:
I vote incomprehensible, with a tough of WTF. (Note the titling in the film mispells his name - “Joesph Spence”).
That’s actually pretty funny.
Yes. YES. No one pays any attention when I say this song is about date rape. It’s like “Ok, seriously, I’ve been here for six hours. Why won’t you let me leave?”
“Aw, come on, it’s cold out. Just spend the night.”
“What’s in this drink you gave me? Tastes kinda funny.”
“It’s, uh…cinnamon. Yeah, that’s it.”
:dubious:
Alright, I posted that last before I read the whole thread. I suppose it could be construed either way, but the male always struck me as a little too aggressive and unheeding of what she wanted.
Well, yes, it could be, but one way is consistent with the prevailing sensibility at the time it was written and with the totality of the lyrics, while the other way cherry-picks a few lines and imposes a specific modern perspective onto them.
True in a sense, but please consider that his pleading is exaggerated for comic effect, and that BOTH of them seem to hear what the other is saying while blithely ignoring same and pressing on with their own agendas (cleverly underlined by their consistently stepping on each other’s lines, which is how it is written).
Consider that when everyone else says you’re wrong, it could be because you’re wrong.
Six hours? Where does that come from? For all we know, she just got there (hands are cold, still has hat on). And how is he not letting her leave? For all her TALKING about why she should leave, she isn’t DOING anything to leave.
How does this equal date rape?
No, tastes kinda strong. Sure, he’s hoping to soften her resistance with booze, but that’s a far cry from putting a date-rape drug in it (which is what I gather you are inferring). In the era the song hails from, “what’s in this drink” would be a typical reaction to tasting something with some extra kick (more booze). A nefarious drug wouldn’t even be on the radar of 99% of the population.
Look at the list of people who have recorded this song. Does it really make sense that these folks are getting behind something that promotes, or even mentions, date rape? Or that all of them are somehow missing that it’s about date rape?
It’s an innocent song from an innocent time. Viewing it from today’s vantage point of date rape and date rape drugs is, I submit, missing the whole point. And overlooking the other 98% of the lyrics.
My favorite version of “Baby, It’s Cold Outside” is the one Liza Minnelli & Alan Cumming did - mainly because halfway through the song, Alan gives in and HE gets up to leave, and they switch places, with her pleading for him to stay and him giving reasons to go. 
Love that version!
Yeah, that one’s very sinister. I also associate it with Home Alone, and so with homicidal nine year olds.
So spiking someone’s drink with more booze isn’t skeevey? Maybe back then that was considered kosher but nowadays, it’s illegal.
Well, a lot of people did things back in the day that would be interpreted as date rape today, so I’m not sure what “Look, lots of people recorded it” has to do with anything. I just hate the whole trope of “Guy has to wear down girl’s resistance.” I hate to harp on “Enthusiastic consent” but…well, things are easier when both people are eager.
Plus I think another reason I hate this song so much is because I first read about it in A Return to Modesty by Wendy “Huzzah for Chastity Belts” Shalit. God, I hate that woman.
I suppose this isn’t necessarily in the spirit of the thread, but my contribution is this really weird version of Jingle Bells I found on YouTube.
Well, weird and/or annoying.
That is too irritating for WORDS.
Woeg, did you check out the version posted by dropezone?
**Freudian Slit ** said:
Not if he asked if she wanted and drink so he mixed her a drink. He just mixed it strong instead of weak. But that’s hardly in the same category as offering her a “fruit juice” that’s got vodka mixed in. Or pouring everclear in the fruit punch without telling anyone.
Gary T said:
And the male role is titled “Wolf” is also suggestive. He’s not the nicest man and certainly has an agenda. He’s pushing that agenda. But that doesn’t make it date rape, just aggressive in trying to pursuede.
And I don’t know why I’m defending this song…
Irishman, I haven’t yet - I’ll check it out tonight!