Ok. What about crossdressers? Guys that dress up like women. So inotherwords they want to be women so they get implants, wear makeup, have long hair, they wear bras, they wear womens’ clothes and I guess their target is men. Unless of course they are lesbian crossdressers in otherwords they like women. Getting pretty confusing huh?
Now who exactly is attracted to them? Certainly not straight guys cause they want the real package. And I am pretty sure they would be pretty upset once they found out they were fooled.
How about gay guys? No, I don’t think so because gay guys are attracted to guys so why would they be attracted to someone that looks like a woman. See what I am saying?
Anyway I don’t know exactly how this is considered a great debate but I was just wondering who would actually go for this type of person?
If it was gay guys, why would they find a man dressed up like a women attractive? And if it was straight guys that find these crossdressers attractive, then they really aren’t straight are they? And if it was gay guys that like crossdressers, maybe they are not totally gay?
Are you trying to confuse us or somethin?
What questions.
Hey, I used to hang with them.
There are guys who like guys who dress like women, whether they are called straight or gay doesn’t seem to matter, I believe.
The guys in question who DO like crossdressers are called “tricks”.
YMMV
gosh WB, running out of fairly intelligble questions?
Oy veysmir. You screwed it up from the word “Go,” Bill.
Step by step:
“Ok. What about crossdressers? Guys that dress up like women. So inotherwords they want to be women . . .”
No. Crossdressers do not want to be women. Transsexuals want to be women. Crossdressers want to dress like women. Some of them want to do it all the time, some of them want to do it part of the time, some of them want to do it once in a great while.
Why? Well, that’s an excellent question. Research shows that the majority of transvestites are in fact straight men, many of them with happy married lives. (Please, BTW, don’t confuse transvestites with drag queens. Most transvestites also don’t indulge in the exaggerated femininity associated with drag, which is an entirely different culture.) For some, there is a sexual fulfillment or dynamic at work; for others, other psychological gender-identity needs are fulfilled.
No, they don’t, I assure you.
Some transvestites do some or all of those things in various degrees. Some never go as far as makeup and wigs, wearing the clothes only. It all depends on the invidual.
As far as “their target is men,” you’re making a lot of unwarranted assumptions here. Most crossdressers dress because they are fulfilling an internal need. It is something they do for themselves. They aren’t doing it to troll for sexual partners. Why are you assuming they are? It isn’t about that.
There are several support groups for crossdressers, most notably Tri-Ess (Society for the Second Self), which is for straight male transvestites and their families. They have meetings where they can feel comfortable and unjudged appearing how they want to in a safe setting. They discuss issues of interest to the TG community. They undertake efforts to educate people about what transvestism is. Sometimes they will get together socially at venues known to be safe for crossdressers. There is a big event, the Southern Comfort Conference, held every year in Atlanta, where people come from all over the country to meet, shop, hear speeches, and have a good time. It isn’t about sex, Bill.
They aren’t lesbians; they are straight men who sometimes dress as women. A lot of them have sex with their wives–even when they are dressed! Shocking, eh? Different transvestites have different emotional and mental needs that are met. Some dress on their own and go out to restaurants, bars, shopping, etc., depending on their comfort level. Everyone is different.
To the extent that sexuality is an issue, there’s a whole gamut of different people who crossdress. Some are straight, some are gay, some are bi. Some are attracted to women when they aren’t dressed and men when they are. Some crossdressers are only attracted to other crossdressers.
You would be amazed how many otherwise straight men are attracted to transvestites. The most common word used to describe these men is “bisexual.”
The rest, I can’t comment on, but I’m sure someone else will.
Eh, Bill, I don’t really see a debate topic here, either. You want to discuss “who would find a man wearing woman’s clothes attractive?” I dunno, but I would suppose that the same thing that attracts anybody to anybody else.
Um, I think you need to understand something. Not all men who dress up as women are necessarily homosexual, that is, wanting to have sex with other men. Some men who like to wear women’s clothes are just exploring an alternate sexuality; it doesn’t always follow that they’re going to have sex with another man when they take off the dress. There are a fair number of straight cross-dressers out there.
And what about women wearing men’s clothes, specifically men’s suits?
I don’t see a debate, just an invitation to talk about gay sex. Sorry, Bill.
I would suppose that a straight male, who encountered what he thought was a beautiful woman, and who later discovered that it was really a man, would have to make one of three choices. He could recoil in horror and resolve never to speak to that disgusting person again. Or he could go ahead and have sex with him/her (and there are fillips to same-sex intercourse that go way beyond the simple “who’s on top?” question, you know). Or he could decide to be friends with this person no matter what kind of clothes he/she decided to wear.
Isn’t that the same decision that any man has to make whenever he meets any beautiful woman, no matter which set of gonads she turns out to have? Sex or not-sex. Friends or not-friends.
You can use “crossdresser” and “transvestite” pretty much interchangeably without fear of offending anyone, Bill.
Keep in mind, a great many crossdressers dress only at home, by themselves, and never let another human being see them dressed. In many cases, their own families do not know, including spouses. It isn’t about sex.
Among the CD community, though, it is not recommended that you attempt to pick up straight men while misrepresenting yourself as a GG (genetic girl). It can be very dangerous, and has resulted in more than a few beatings and deaths. If crossdressers want to meet men, there are plenty of places to go and avenues to use.
WB, there’s a very interesting book entitled (IIRC) Bound and Gagged which analyses pornography from the perspective of “outsider” porn- namely TV, TS, and fat porn. The author comes to the conclusion that what defines something as “obscene” isn’t whether it’s sexually explicit, but whether it appeals to unconventional desires. In the course of all this analysis, the author gives a lot of insight into what people get out of these unconventional sexual fetishes.
There’s another book (which I only got a chance to read half of, to be perfectly honest) entitled Vice Versa, about bisexuality. That, too, could give you some perspective on the complexities of human sexuality. For one thing, the book makes the point that your “gay” vs “straight” division is utterly simplistic. Even the idea of a continuum from “straight” through “bi” to “gay” doesn’t describe reality, because in reality there are people who, for example, frequently fantasise about people of the same sex but only have sex with people of the opposite sex, and vice versa.
Don’t really want to know that much about it to tell you the truth. The reason this even came up was we were watching “mango” on Saturday Night Live and mango seemed upset that men were thinking he was gay but when someone was acting like he was how could someone assume anything else imho?
btw I wish they would drop that bit. It is not even funny.
Nonsense. Mango is one of the funniest bits on the show.
Bill, what does Mango have to do with crossdressing? Yes, the character is effeminate, but he isn’t a drag queen and he doesn’t wear dresses. (The pink tam o’shanter could be a tad CD, I guess.)
I would just like to mention that sexual orientation and gender identity are two different things. A male to female transsexual can be heterosexual (that is, attracted to men), bisexual, or lesbian. Being a transsexual doesn’t necessarily make someone gay.
You want to post “Crossdresser Who Want’Em” in General Questions? Are you holding an auction?
You posed the question but you don’t want to know that much about it? So this is more of a tiff with ingorance?
I am not sure what you are talking about. I just don’t want to go and out and buy a book about it and read about. Like I said it just seems kinda of confusing who would want a crossdresser because of reasons I stated earlier.
I don’t know if the books Ben mentioned would be helpful to you. But you bring up a question, someone suggests a book regarding that question and you don’t want to know about it?
Why not? As I’ve said, I don’t know them, but they have been suggested as reflecting upon your question, so if it was a sincere question, why would you not want to look into them? If you don’t want to buy them perhaps your local library has them on hand?
Kind of confusing why someone would want to be a crossdresser? I thought you OP was about why someone would want to sleep with a crossdresser (and both questions have, think been answered, or at least addressed. Me? I’m with Turpentine).
Bill, though I can’t add a whole lot to what pldennisonhad to say, let me construct an analogy for you:
Neither of us gave our lives to Jesus in response to something or someone in the world that we wished to please or gain. It was in response to an inner need in ourselves that accepting His call fulfilled.
Though the idea is not on all fours with a religious conversion, it may be easier for you to grasp it if you see it as filling an inner need in something like the same way.
I’d also add that while transvestites tend to dress in clothing of the opposite sex (there are women who dress as men as well) to fulfill a psychological need, the term drag queen (or king, for the women-dressed-as-men) sometimes means this but more often means someone who does this professionally – as a way of making a living. And are often, though not always, straight arrows in their private life.
A transsexual is, as noted, someone who is convinced that the plumbing their body came equipped with does not correspond to who they really are, inside. And current gender reassignment surgery procedures require the prospective surgery candidates to live as the sex they think they ought to belong to for a year prior to having the surgery – during which time they do indeed get hormonal treatments and sometimes implants. This may account for some of your confusion.
And for Pete’s sake disabuse yourself of the idea that effeminate=gay. Some gays are, some act the role as “camp,” some are not, and some straight people are as effeminate as the screamingest queen. We have examples of each category of person right here on this board, who will no doubt post to this thread sooner or later if it doesn’t die down first.
I think this has been handled pretty well by other posters already, but I just have to throw my two cents in.
There are lots of reasons other than being transgendered for a man to wear women’s clothing. Drag queens do it professionally, for entertainment value – kind of like being an Elvis impersonator or something. Most drag queens only dress in drag for performances.
Many straight men like to wear women’s clothing in private, or wear women’s underwear beneath normal men’s clothes. Some simply prefer the feel of women’s underwear to men’s. Others might be said to have a lingerie fetish; they like to see women in lingerie, they like to see lingerie on its own, and they like to wear it themselves. I’m sure there are other reasons too. This sort of behavior is apparently quite common, but most men keep quiet about it for fear that people will wrongly assume that they are homosexual or transgendered.
Other men dress in drag to make their wives or girlfriends happy. Yes, there are straight women who go for men in drag. Some think it’s sexy, and others just find it amusing to dress men up like dolls. I knew one woman (not a friend) who was quite keen on getting her boyfriends to dress in drag. I think she got turned on by forcing them to do things they’d be embarassed by.
There are also a few young men and teenaged boys who wear articles of women’s clothing for pure shock value.
Bill, do you live to sound ignorant, or is it just a hobby?
First of all, if you want to know what “transvestite,” “crossdressing” and “transsexual” mean, either pick up a dictionary or use a decent web search engine. We are not here to be your personal secretaries.
Second of all, I think the points in your OP have been sufficiently debunked (i.e., transvestites are not transsexuals), but there’s something I want to add. I will type slowly because I know you are not the brightest bulb in the pack.
Sexual identity, gender identity, and sexual orientation are all seperate issues.
Now I know it’ll be next to impossible to wrap your brain around that one, since they all seem to be intertwined, but psychologically speaking they are not (they are related, but not the same).
No doubt I’ll be asked by others for cites, which I will provide momentarily. Having TV & TS friends just gives me a leg up in this department…
