I don’t have the experience of climbing Mt. Everest, but based on other people’s experience, I have the opinion that it is a tough climb.
I don’t think there was just ONE person who posted and tried to explain things to you on this board. When you measure your years of experience on one hand and 100s of people’s years of experience on the other hand, you are bound to lose. So maybe instead of harping about how you know everything based on your own limited expereince, you should listen to what other people are saying.
faithfool wasn’t posting to tell you were wrong just because you hadn’t reached the same conclusion he had. He was trying to reach out and be nice and understanding to you. But he didn’t realize that you were actually so thick-headed that you couldn’t even recognize that.
Well, since I can only speak for myself, there’s a whole host of things I’ve based opinions on that have been learned from others. For example, I’ve never taken any drugs and although I’ve seen the evidence provided by others that doing so works for them, I’ve also seen plenty of the same sorts of evidence that presents it as less than the best idea. So, I’ve foregone tyring it. Equally, I support a woman’s right to choose not matter what. However, I don’t know if I could make that decision for myself (despite that being a moot point now) partially because I’ve read and seen just how difficult it is to process for others that have been there.
I’m not a rocket scientist but this seems to be an extremely base component of most people’s personalities to extrapolate what happens to others, make a determination on how to proceed with that information and then appropriately apply the proper bits to themselves. And I’m grateful for those that have taught me lessons along the way that I didn’t have to learn first-hand. Obviously, your mileage varies.
Nowhere have I said that you should come to the same conclusion I had. You’ve had an entire pit thread devoted to you, yet you’d mentioned (I think and am perhaps misremembering this part – it’s been a long read) that no one had tried to reach. I disagree with that, but thought that maybe a fresh perspective, that had absolutely no dog in this fight, might help. That’s all. You’re more than entitled to continue to feel, behave and think the way you do. I tried to address you respectfully and politely. That seems to have been ignored, much like the part that was the cruxt of the ‘lubrication’ quote. That if you truly are considering what other people say, like you hinted you might be, that acknowledging that alone seems to go a long way towards everyone understanding what page their own.
But again, do as you wish. I’ve now been in two different threads (besides this one, the other is about comparing pets to children) with you participating and instead I fervently wish that I’d skipped engaging you all together. Not because you’re not worth the time, but because I don’t have the ability to deal with this sort of mindset. That’s mainly why I tend to avoid as many conversations with my mother as possible and that decision continues to serve me well.
So in closing, good luck with how these things turn out for you and hopefully someday you’ll find an experience of someone else important enough to adopt as your own to spare you the trouble. I’m out and on to more interesting Dope pursuits.
[ETA: Didn’t see samm’s post, so thanks to him (her?) for recognizing what I was trying to do. Oh, and for the record since I’m not sure which side of that boy / girl thing you fall on, I’m female. At least around the edges.]
For God’s sake, curcoat, nobody is going to tie you down and force you to bear children! Having or not having children is your choice and really nobody cares what you choose. Nobody. Maybe your mom cares or something, but I promise you that nobody on this message board sees this as any sort of transgressive, offensive or even interesting choice. We aren’t trying to force you to spawn. I doubt anyone is. This “overwhelming pressure” is nowhere but your own head. Not having kids stopped being the end of the world like half a century ago. Really it’s almost routine today. So you really, really don’t have to be so shrill and defensive about it.
So why do you have to freak the fuck out every time someone mentions children in any way shape or form? To hear you talk you’d swear all parents were hideous abusive dragon-beasts, and all childless people were sainted angels. You make parents out to be the most evil and selfish people in the world. Why can’t you trust that they have their reasons, just like you have yours? Not having kids doesn’t make you some kind of higher level of being. And lets face it, you didn’t choose not to have kids to save the environment or cure cancer or something. You chose it because you wouldn’t enjoy raising them. Your choice on this issue isn’t a sign of you being a better (or worse) person. Your just doing what you want and thats cool. But don’t try to turn this into some kind of battle flag.
And yeah, I get that you don’t like kids and regard them as beings a little above wasps and below worms. But it’s generally not polite to continually mention your distaste for a whole class of people. For example, even if I really just don’t like old people, it wouldn’t be cool for me to go off about how I wish they didn’t go to restaurants, etc. We live in a society, and sometimes we have to deal with people we don’t like. This means you might gasp be expose to a kid when you go out in public now and then. Suck it up.
Yeah, I do think you are a bit abnormal. In the sense of “not conforming to the norm.” So what? Own it! It’s your life. You don’t have to defend it from anyone. You don’t have to let this define your very being. Honestly I suspect it is you who is to some degree uncomfortable with your choice, because I know tons of voluntarily childless people who don’t talk about it constantly. But whatever.
“A tough climb”. Good one. Way to provide a totally vague example that has zero to do with the subject.
Another good one. 100’s of other people’s experience is just that - their experience. And then their opinions based on their experiences. I do listen to them and all they say is I am wrong and they are right, generally without any reason other than their opinions based on their experiences. Only an, well, idiot would take that to heart.
As for my knowing everything, I have said nothing even close to that.
Being nice while telling me that I am wrong because she is right isn’t really a whole lot better than you calling me an idiot.
Look, I get that you have a knee jerk negative reaction to anyone calling the blacks to task for their actions. However, that doesn’t have any affect on my experiences, the opinions I’ve drawn from them, or my mental abilities.
Those are not opinions per se, those are decisions based on facts, and in a smaller way, the experience of others. Evidence of the effects of drug use (I assume you mean illegal drugs?) is almost totally factual - I’d have trouble finding any opinion of weight on it. WRT to whether or not you would get an abortion, that is a personal emotional decision, somewhat (or greatly, I don’t know) affected by what you know of the experiences of others.
Exactly. But there is a huge difference between forming an opinion based solely on the experiences of others - experiences unsupported by facts either pro or con and experiences that you probably didn’t share - and forming an opinion based on those experiences, plus your own, plus whatever facts you can find. I am particularly leery of adopting an opinion that is being forced on me by someone(s) who merely says they are right and I am wrong.
Not all of that paragraph made sense to me so you may have left out a word or two. As for addressing politely and lubrication, this is the pit and I am not going to assume that anyone has any desire to be nice. Regarding you not wanting me to reach your conclusions, you seemed very disappointed in the fact that I do not share your opinion of rap music or the reasons that so many people crank it out at unreal levels.
I am getting the feeling that you are the “can’t everyone just get along” sort? If so, the pit isn’t exactly the place for that belief.
The mindset of someone who has arrived at an opinion after much experience and thought and isn’t going to toss it aside because strangers on the internet disagree with it? Or the mindset of someone that doesn’t run off when the bullies come out? I’m sorry you cannot deal with that, but again I am not likely to change just because someone says I should.
Uh, what? I went back a page in this discussion and saw zero mention of children by anyone. What are you on about?
Don’t get out much do you? Of course, if you are in China you may have zero idea of what it was like to grow up female in the US during the 60’s and 70’s. Even now women who don’t want children are looked on as freaks and/or weak minded souls who will change their minds when they meet the “right man”.
As for the rest of your post, again - what are you on about?
Hmmmm. I’m usually likely to (or at least try to) change, and it doesn’t matter to me how it comes about, if it’s a good idea. IE: healthy, positive for the rest of humanity, something I’d been sorely lacking.
And no, I’m not overly the sort that just wants everyone to get along. I just always hope that there’s some way to get through to others when it might help them and it seems worth it to give it a shot. < shrug >
Curlcoat, I have no interest in criticizing you…I actually appreciate your candor and have read your posts with interest since your experiences and opinions are so completely different from my own. But here is some food for thought since you appear to be an animal lover like me:
Have you ever met people who hate cats? I know people who claim they have met lots of cats and had the same bad experience with all of them. So now they hate them all. Would you agree that this does not make it a fact that dogs are better than cats, but rather means the cat-haters just had bad experiences or perhaps they gave off some vibe that made the cats react negatively to them? Do you think it is possible for a cat-hater who holds that opinion because of a lifetime of negative experiences to change his view? If so how could that person change his perspective?
I really don’t know. (Get ready, Even Sven is about to lose his shit for no reason) All I can do is equate it to my response to children. Over the years I went from no real opinion on children to dislike to an actual negative physical response to them. I think this is because over the years children have essentially been forced on me, the I am female therefore I’m required to love them schtick. So maybe a cat hater is made that way because friends/relatives have insisted that s/he interact with cats and “get over it”?
Or, maybe every interaction this person has had with cats has actually been negative. Cats are relatively sensitive creatures and they may act badly in the presence of someone that they can tell doesn’t like them.
Or, maybe this person just doesn’t get cats and so views everything they do in a negative light.
Or, maybe this person has just had bad luck and every cat they see is actually a feline demon.
Not sure what this has to do with the subject tho!
The disconnect here is not that you aren’t into kids. It’s that you have an extreme and uncommon reaction, but insist that your reaction is entirely rational and normal and it is society who is completely out of line. It’s not. You have issues here. You have major personal issues that are pretty obvious to everyone. That’s fine. We all have issues. But own up to it, woman. Don’t blame some huge social conspiracy.
FWIW I’m a 28 year old woman who doesn’t have kids and is moderately dedicated to staying that way. Now and then my mom will send me a news clipping about how women’s fertility declines after 30. And now and then family members ask me when I’m gonna settle down and have kids. I don’t hold it against them. It’s what normal people do. I just shrug and tell them that if they want to have kids they are free to have them. That’s all it takes. No need to flip out every time someone wants me to hold their baby.
In your ignorance you call the way I feel about children “an extreme and uncommon reaction”, but I suppose that is because you are only a little over half my age. For one thing, people who are actually childfree (which you aren’t) are not uncommon, for another my reaction to children is pretty much in the middle of the range. You have heard of Dead Baby jokes, right? There are lots of folks that take those more or less seriously. My response to children is fairly common among the childfree, which is why we never wanted to have any - we don’t like them and don’t want to have to live with them.
Funny you should say I shouldn’t flip out since you are the one that lost her mind over some mild thing I said someplace, that you couldn’t be bothered to quote. Again, this is your ignorance. Things are much better for women now who choose to not have children than they were when I was of “prime childbearing age” - one of the reasons I don’t like children is my immediate family turned their backs on me when it finally became obvious to them that I wasn’t going to reproduce. Some future, not even yet conceived baby was more important to them than the daughter, granddaughter, cousin they had known all her life. Babies I would have had to had on my own, since my first marriage to an abusive man lasted less than a year and I didn’t remarry until I was 36.
And, for the last three decades I’ve been told I shouldn’t (or can’t) get time off near holidays because I don’t have children, I must take on extra work I won’t be paid extra for because Mommy had to go take care of the kids (or have another one), that I shouldn’t be allowed to work from home because I don’t have kids. When I left my shithead of a first husband, the first thing those that didn’t know me well were concerned about was if there were any children that would be “broken hearted” about losing their dad. Hell, I was just over 22, I was practically a child myself and was left in terrible financial and emotional condition but of course that is unimportant. After that, I was unmarried and wearing no ring for 14 years, yet every new acquaintance or co-worker wanted to know how many kids I had - not “do you”, it was “how many”. Now that I am showing my age, the question is have a “gotten” any grandchildren yet. I guess I just prefer being viewed as something other than my reproductive bits.
I pay over $3000 a year in taxes to support our city’s public schools, yet I am not allowed to step foot on that property. I have no idea how much of my taxes goes to pay for ADC, MediCal, DentiCal, WIC and whatever else goes to support the choice of having children. Yet not only are my choices not funded, they are heavily regulated and ridiculed.
I realize that the US and maybe the whole world is baby crazy these days, to the point they have a TV show based on a teenage pregnancy of all the stupid things. However, this does not make the childfree choice “uncommon” and having babies shoved down one’s throat for three decades has resulted in reactions for more “extreme” than mine.
The way you feel about children is extreme and uncommon. You are not in the “middle of the range” and only a fool would think you were. It’s weird to not like kids. There’s nothing wrong with being weird if you’re not hurting anyone, but don’t pretend it’s normal. Whether you like it or not, most people like children, and that’s the world you have to live in, so suck it up. Some of us even WERE children once.
Of course, you also seem to dislike black people. You’re starting to run out of people to like.
Didn’t you go to school? You’re paying back for the education that was offered you. Stop whining. It’s pathetic.
