DC Comics: Fables (possible spoilers).

So I’m dancing through the book shop last week and happen upon the graphic novels section. Lo, the proprietors are having a 20% off sale pre-Xmas. So I decide to grab the second, third and fourth volumes of the quite readable Fables series from DC Comics.

I’m loving this, for it’s recharacterisation of ‘known’ characters, but I must say the first volume wasn’t much of a fairytale story as it was a detective story that happened to be populated by storybook characters. Volume the 2 is shaping up to be much more intriguing and a more complex realisation of storybook characters in a non-storybook world (the first volume seemed to miss this point, instead going for a fairly straight crime drama).

Especially affecting was Snow White killing Shere Khan after he had killed Reynard Fox… Nicely dramatic stuff.

Now, my question is… who, the hell, are some of the characters? Is there an annotation site somewhere online? I looked through Jess Nevins’ site, and I’ve checked through Peter Karpas’ site, but to no avail.

I’m at a loss to who some of the background characters are, I can identify some, but I’m figuring others are just filler. Or are they?

Who is Weyland Smith?

Who is Reynard Fox?

Who is Bluebeard? (and what did he do to his wives?)

Little Boy Blue, I kind’ve know, but… what was his rhyme?

What am I missing here? Cos I’m really enjoying this series a lot!

Forgive me, but what you’re missing is what would once have been considered a basic level of cultural literacy. You can find out about all those characters with a little Internet research; keep looking for the earliest date associated with each one. Then go to a library – yes, the actual building – and check out some books of folklore and mythology. Good luck; you’re on your way to a richer mental world.

Thank you Baldwin, that wasn’t snarky in the least was it?
You realise I was also attempting to spur some level of discussion on this?

One interesting facet of the comic (that I failed to mention in the OP) being the mixing of Hans Christian Anderson’s characters (which were, for the most part, figments of his imagination) with those from the Grimm Tales (which were a collection of older folks stories), with the ‘brer’ characters from Uncle Tom’s Cabin characters (American folklore -how would you define this? I know it’s ‘southern’ to some degree, isn’t it?), with Baba Yaga (Russian folklore) etc etc etc. There’s a delightful rich melange therein, but what limits that comingling of literary and folkloric characters? Are the characters randomly selected et al?

Yes, I’m aware I didn’t put any of that in my OP, but I did ask a question, and yes i’m familiar with Libraries, owning a sizeable one of my own.

You see, it’s not the cultural literacy I’m missing here, in fact, I’d say I’m quite well read. However a response of this sort makes me wonder why you’d join the SDMB, given that you’re suggesting we shouldn’t discuss arts and literature, nay, we should all go and research this stuff ourselves, thereby bettering our inner self, but adding nothing to the community at large. Do you have anything to add Or are you going to suggest next that reading comics is akin to cultural illiteracy?

Did you also consider my cultural heritage could be different from yours? Please, give me an explanation on the cultural ramifications of the pontianak legend and how that relates to vampiric myth in south east asia, without doing research online, and then we’ll discuss ‘basic cultural literacy’

I say fie on thee sir, fie!

…on second reading, I realise that may have come off as a little too venomous, which was not my intent, and I apologies.

ARGH! ‘apologise’! stupid, stupid fingers!

Weyland Smith (Weyland the Smith) is a little obscure. He comes from either Celtic or Viking legends (I forget which). He lived with some swan maidens, and pursued them when they flew away. He was captured by an evil king who hobbled him and forced him to work for the king. He had no choice, as he was unable to refuse any commission given him. He was given a commission by the king to produce some fine drinking goblets. He did this by killing the king’s sons and making the cups from their skulls, then used a pair of wings he made from the swan’s feathers to fly away.

What you read in Fables is a slight reworking of the original tale.

Reynard Fox (Reynard the Fox) was the protagonist of a series of medieval epics called “beast tales”, in which the feudal system and nobility of Western Europe were mocked. All of the characters in the stories were humans portrayed as animals, with Reynard being an amoral trickster who preyed on the foolishness of others to his own benefit. The character of the fox as trickster in later Western fairy tales (in Asian tales, the trickster is usually a monkey) is likely derived at least partially from Reynard.

These two aren’t really commonly known, and I don’t think it shows any lack of cultural literacy to be ignorant of them.

Bluebeard was a rich man who was considered ugly because of his blue beard. He wooed a young woman, who married him because she was so impressed with his wealth. He left on a trip one day to another estate, telling her not to look into a certain room, which she did, only to find the corpses of his many previous wives, all murdered because they had done the same as she. She managed to stall him long enough for her brothers to rescue her and kill Bluebeard.

This one, or at least the idea of Bluebeard as a rich man who killed a series of wives who displeased him (the subject of folktales from all over; the Arabian Nights are based on the same basic premise) is more widely known; most people have heard of Bluebeard and may have some idea of him as a serial killer, but the exact story isn’t one that’s commonly known, because our culture thinks of fairy tales as children’s stories. Bluebeard doesn’t fit that idea, so it’s become an orphan.

The ‘brer’ (a shortened form of Brother) tales aren’t Uncle Tom’s Cabin, they’re folk tales originally told by slaves, and are derived from traditional African tales. The versions we know were written down by Joel Chandler Harris, who took the nom de plume Uncle Remus. Uncle Remus was a composite of several African American storytellers that Harris had heard telling the stories growing up.

The Fables all once lived in the Homelands. Notice that Homelands is plural–there were many of them, each with it’s own kingdom or set of kingdoms. The Fables from Grimm, Anderson, Perrault, Africa, American folklore, etc. didn’t live together originally, until the Adversary started invading the lands one by one. Once they realized what was going on, they all fled to our world, and have been forced to live and work together.

Thanks Six.

I’ve heard the name Reynard the Fox, but could never find any actual story information on him. A lot of the links seem to indicate he is akin to Basil Brush but I now realise this is just silly and kind’ve wrong. Although I’m sure you could postulate Basil being based on the Reynard-concept in form and thought.

Weyland (the) Smith, I’d not heard of. The tale you describe is interesting given his first representation in Fables vol.2 (I’ve not read beyond this). Is it possible to conflate the character of Weyland Smithers (Simpsons) with Weyland the Smith? Or is it just a similar naming convention? (I can’t see a similarity, given that one is willing and servile by choice, the other is trapped and vengeful, oh, and one is not a Blacksmith).

Blue Beard, sorry, never heard of him. However, as you point out, this could be a result of his ‘orphaned tale’ status.

Thanks for the ‘Brer’ correction. Now that I think of it I knew that was Uncle Remus, not Uncle Tom (and I’m somewhat embarrassed to have confused the two). I realise I also knew these were African tales that came over on the slave ships. I am, in fact, a fool, (of sorts).

I get the multiplicity of the ‘homelands’. What hadn’t clicked until now is your statement, which is entirely correct, that each homeland represents a series of stories from various origins. This is fairly obvious from the relationships between related characters (Snow White’s Prince Charming is also Cinderella’s Prince Charming, etc etc etc).

I have been thinking about the characters that haven’t made it through to ‘our Earth’, and I suspect this would explain missing characters (although we don’t really know who is missing, or rather which homelands fell under the Adversary, yet, because they may be there but not yet seen). We did see the fall of the lands ruled by ‘the Great Lion’, whom I would assume is Aslan, meaning that the C.S.Lewis world has been overrun

This would now raise the question, are new homelands created everytime a new story is set down, or is there a cut off point? The Lewis Carol characters and Rudyard Kipling’s Jungle Book characters are obvious in many scenes (I wonder if Kim and some of the Just So animals are there too?). L.Frank Baum’s Ozian flying monkeys are there too. But what is the ‘newest’ character depicted? My spoiler above would appear to be among the newest, but has anyone spotted anything newer?

Nonetheless, thanks, again, for the insight Six.

Bluebeard… is a bit more interesting than that. It’s based about equally on Giles de Rais, a knight of the court who was designated as the field marshal of Joan of Arc. After her death, he retired to his castle, where he became an alchemist, and murdered over two hundred children for use in his experiments. He was put to death in 1440…

And Henry VIII, who was king at the time the story was published by Perrault, in 1697.

Ooh! Good link, with a link to a searchable version of the Blue Fairy Book. I’m going to re-read that later. http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/fairytales_myths_fables_&legends/111446

If you decide to start picking up Fables Regularly, feel free to stop by the weekly comic book discussion threads. I always buy Fables, myself.

So far we haven’t been given any indication as to whether “new” stories manifest fable-homelands… the notoriety of the stories seem to lend the fables in them power, better preservation, but that’s about all we know.

:eek:

:wally

gene, how far have you read? I don’t want to spoil things that happen in later volumes.

That said, I disagree with your contention that the opening arc “misses the point.” The point is that the fables are really just regular people, perhaps with more interesting backstories than most folks in NYC, but just people. That’s why it’s unsurprising to see a story in the book that isn’t all about the magic of fairytales. Then you also get the stories that depend more on the high concept.

I assume new homelands might still be appearing; the lands of the lion weren’t created until '39 at the earliest and the first book wasn’t published until 1950, but we know that several fables were in the mundane world by then.

–Cliffy

“Reynard the Fox”? Isn’t Renard simply the French word for a fox? (Time to call in William Safire’s Squad Squad.)

dangergene:

I believe the Simpsons’ character is actually named Waylon. Not that this would negate any answer given to your question.

Frankly, I’m wondering about the more modern fables. Superman certainly would count. Maybe not the rest, but certainly Superman. Howdy Doody, as well, if the tale must be over and done, and sponsored by the belief of children.

Grimm’s fairy tales has a variation on the Bluebeard tale. (Bride visits groom’s place despite several dire ominous warnings, and discovers that groom has a predilection for chopping up young ladies and devouring them. She escapes, thanks to help from an old maid living there, and rallies the rest of the family to destroy these horrible murderers.)

Also mentioned as having fallen to the Adversary are the Emerald Isles, which as far as I can tell is

the land of Don Quixote.

…I think pretty much all the mythological characters that aren’t public domain got killed off. :stuck_out_tongue:

wow! Thanks everyone, lots of wonderful stuff therein, this is the sort of thing I was looking for.

E-Sabbath that link is superb, yes, I shall idle away many an hour in the office perusing the content (and trying not to get caught, which makes posting my intent online rather foolish, yes?).

Cliffy, just finished volume2, starting volume3 during lunch. On reflection, I realise you’re absolutely right. Particularly given the interaction, albeit minor, between the Fable community and the ‘mundy’ world. These are normal people, even if they are long-lived, and they live normal lives, for the most part, in a normal world surrounded by people who had bizarre adventures a long time ago. The lives they lead now are as normal as you or me.

Well, you or me if we owned a vorpal sword! :smiley:

Not spoiling things, but do we ever find out WHO the adversary is? I keep wanting to look for clues, but I’m feeling we’ve not been given any yet. Does this play out later, or has it not been touched on yet?

Gamera, not to gush or anything, but it was actually your posts in the Weekly Comic Book Thread that made me pick up Fables. I had wanted to start form issue one, but missed it when it came in. I held off because a lot of the pre-solicitation blurbs made it sound a bit lame.

Thank you for posting good things about it, because if it weren’t for your positivity, I wouldn’t have given it a go! gush, gush, gush.

(and yes, I read the WCBT each week, but keep finding I have nothing to add beyond, ‘yup, me too’. Fret not, I’m not new to comics in the least, I figure i probably should start contributing :smiley: )

cmkeller, you are absolutely correct. It is ‘Waylon’, as in the C&W singer. I suspect i was confusing the similar phonetics and struggling to make a connection there.

Thanks again everyone.

There’s also a Fables Graphic Novel One-shot available… something about the “Last Castle” - it serves as a prelude to the most recent Fables Arc, and shows the last days before the evacuation of the homelands. Pretty good stuff.

It has been touched on, but not revealed.

The first time I heard of Weland it was in the epigraph of James Dickey’s Junk, quoted from an English epic called Waldere:

“Huru Welandes worc ne geswices monna aenigum sara se Mimming can heardne gehealdan,” which means (very roughly) “Weland’s work will fail no main who can weild the hard Mimming.” Mimming is the name of a strong sword that he made for Waldere, the hero of the tale. In Beowulf he also gets a nod as the maker of Beowulf’s armor. Only in the legend Deor Klagan do we get to hear anything about Weyland himself – that’s the one with the swans and skulls.

Oh, and sometimes he’s cited as king of the elves. Bizarre, no?

<minor unboxed spoiler>

In The Last Castle, we learn that the last refugees from the Homelands left around the time of Napoleon in the early 1800s. This would mean that any lands, such as the Land Of the Great Lion, that are known to have been conquered have existed for at least that long, and the stories are only making it into the mundane world much later. This suggests that the fable folk in the mundane world are the source of the stories, or at any rate are not a product of them.

THe “Last Castle” one-shot is included in the “March of the Wooden Soldiers” TPB (vol. 4).

–Cliffy

I did not know that. I think I only got the first TPB, the rest I’ve been buying as they come out.