Dear Job Market: Please stop penetrating me there

The BBQ Pit
41

[QUOTE=Soul]

edited again to add: Holy crap you people are good luck. I just got offered an interview for Wednesday at Avita Community Partners
[/QUOTE]
Go You! Crossing all my fingers for you.

Oh, and one other piece of advice that my husband took from that career counsellor: when they ask you the inevitable “tell me one weakness you have,” don’t make up some bullshit weakness that’s really a strength, like being too much of a perfectionist. Think of a real weakness, but something relatively minor, and explain how you overcame it, or strive to on a daily basis.

For instance, my husband talks waaaaaaaaaay too fast. He frequently has to be told to slow down, because you can’t understand him when he gets his motor going. This proved to be a detriment in meetings where he had to give presentations. So he worked out a signaling system with a coworker, that when he got going too fast, the coworker would rub his eye or some other non-obvious signal, indicating that he needed to slow down, which he was then able to do.

Again, wishing you the very best of luck!

42

Much better. But it can still be even more specific.

This could be a big area of advantage. What was the client base before and after you were involved? Any specific things you did? The ability to get customers is good, no matter what your job is.

Lines two and three are good. I don’t understand the first. Which management - customer or caterer?

Good stuff to include, but what were your positions exactly? In a sentence, how did they show leadership?

One thing to remove - I don’t think you can call yourself an administrative professional if you’ve never had a paying job as one.

BTW, I agree that temping is a good idea - especially for an admin job.

43

[QUOTE=Soul]
Most of my friends are still in college. Two of my close friends with whom I graduated are in the same situation as me, and another was just fired from waitressing (I feel bad for her – not that she didn’t deserve it, but still). The friends I have that are working are doing service type stuff – one is in Teach For America, one is getting a stipend at a youth summer camp in Nevada, that type of thing. The only friend I have that’s managed to find full-time employment post-graduation has been good to me, putting me in touch with a few people, but that’s drying up rapidly.

I’ve tried Dice, but while I consider myself pretty computer literate I’m no programmer or IT guy. There have been a couple of jobs on there that caught my eye, mostly HR stuff in tech places, but nothing has come of them so far.

I’ll happily post my resume here – I’m really glad you asked, tdn. I wanted to, but I couldn’t decide if that would be too demanding (“I can’t find a job, you people go get me one!”). Here it is, in plaintext below:

I need more experience, that much is obvious. I should have worked more in college, and I kick myself now for not having done so. Looking back, the thought that my only two responsibilities in college were to get good grades and squeeze as much fun as possible out of my four years were childish. Damn that hindsight.

Also, I’m worried that people reading my resume might think I just have an Associates Degree since UGA, for whatever reason, formats the lettering for sociology as A.B., not B.A. Should I just switch the letters?

Also, if you’re interested, here’s a sample cover letter of mine. This one was for an administrative assistant position that turned out to be a scam, but whatever.
Thanks for having a look at these, I sincerely appreciate it. And I know we’re in the Pit so it’s not necessary to say this, but still: be brutally honest. I know something must be wrong, and I’ve had my friends and one professor look over my resume. The likely scenario: I’ve missed something and they were too nice to point it out. While kind to spare my feelings, it’s ultimately less than helpful.
[/QUOTE]

In my previous life I was a hiring manager. I’ve seen plenty of resumes and have done plenty of interviews. When I looked at resumes I looked for something which showed that the person:

  • Can do the job
  • Will do the job
  • Will like the job

So, looking at your resume and cover letter a couple things pop out:

  • No GPA. Assumption - GPA must be low. If it wasn’t, why wouldn’t it be on the resume? While this wouldn’t kill you with me…you’ve just had 2 strikes and will be looking for a reason to kick your resume into the can.

  • What is a A.B.? I would treat this as ignorance on my part as it probably is a common thing…but it isn’t the B.S. or the B.A. I am used to seeing on resumes. Anything diferent is suspicious. I would give it no weight as I continued reading but would be curious.

  • Description of Degree. Hmmmmm…I don’t usually see this. I think it would hurt you because as I read itI would think that it really doesn’t apply to THIS position. Sociology is a common degree - everyone knows what it is. Don’t explain.

Awards received - GOOD. Awards are a good indicator of smartness and adaptable/flexibility and work ethic. However, they can be faked/overblown pretty easily. I see 3 scholarships…but what ARE they? Are they merit/academic? Or are they because you fit some weird criterion of a scholarship donor? (not all scholarships are based on academic ‘merit’. Here some description would be good or they lose their impact.

Work experience - good. Explanations should be tightened up and several more added. Surely you learned more than 2 things on your first catering job. Also go in most recent first format - not a nitpick but it did throw me a sec. Also, describing what you learned like ‘Became accustomed with interfacing with multiple levels of management’ is not as impressive sounding as something like ‘Duties included bla bla bla between x,y,z executives…’

Your resume isn’t bad…I would look at it as a graduating student looking for their first post-college job. I would be concerned with the missing GPA and the awards that might not be merit based…but not enough to torpedo you. However, if I had already had a stack of resumes I was interested in…you’d probably get set off to the side.

====

I would then move onto the cover letter. Yup, I’m weird…I read the cover letter after I looked at the resume. :slight_smile:

I like it. The best cover letters (IMO) are ones that take what was in the job notice and address them - which looks like what you did. Assuming I needed someone to compose and proofread documents you would capture my attention. However…if you just made that up…it could be bad. What if I don’t need you to compose and/or proofread documents?

Ahhh..honors graduate…that answers my first concern from your resume…though I would be scratching my head as to why you didn’t have that on your resume! That’s huge! Probably your biggest achievement!

Your third paragraph seems a bit strange. Maybe it would sound better emphasizing your Honors degree…say things like hard work, dedication, organization, and intelligence but don’t SAY it…show it by describing what you did that show these things.

Have to go.

In Short - what you have is fine but doesn’t blow me away. I think it could be reworked to have more impact.

44

Can you still visit the career center at the University of Georgia? I went to Texas A&M, and I had been having bad luck looking for jobs my last semester of school, and when I visited the career center they were really helpful on fixing my resume and giving me some leads on where was hiring and places to find potential employers. They also had mock interviews you could do that I’m sure would help but I just never got around to it. They would still let me use the career center resources after I graduated, just for a small fee I think. I don’t know anything about the University of Georgia, but maybe someone at the career center can help some.

45

Still working on the resume (I have four different ones now for different fields, this is cool!), but I just had a thought. It seems odd that I spent four years learning all of this cool information and all of these odd skills (anyone want their demographic analyzed?), but never learned how to actually tell people I have them. Oh well, back to work!

46

You should also try going to your local One-Stop Career Center. These are the DOL-funded entities in your area who are tasked with matching businesses and workers, and many of them have resume workshops, on-site job fairs, interviewing skills classes, etc. Basic services are free; others may cost money.

Good luck!

47

Soul, has it occurred to you that your thread title itself suggests an alternative career path? :wink:

48

Two suggestions:

  1. Although it doesn’t sound like UGA has a great career center, you might want to work with them on your resume and job possibilities as well, assuming they provide those services to alums.

  2. If you are applying online to a position, make sure you include the key words and phrases from their ad in your description of skills. Most of the time, there’s simply a computer program filtering the applications so if the key words aren’t there, you’ll end up in the reject pile.

49

[QUOTE=BrainGlutton]
Soul, has it occurred to you that your thread title itself suggests an alternative career path? :wink:
[/QUOTE]

:smiley:

Now that you mention it …

50

[QUOTE=BubbaDog]
You appear to be intelligent yet somehow seem to miss the point. It’s obvious from your explanation that it’s the research skills you developed while acquiring the degree that made you successful, not your knowledge of history or theater.
[/QUOTE]

I think that was his point. I’ll add to his point: my sister got her degree in medieval literature. She is now a very successful ad exec and travels around the world regularly.

Nobody is disputing that those working degrees require critical thinking etc. What he was saying (and you missed) is that the English majors et al.(that you disparage) also have those skills.

I find that the most successful people have advanced degrees–and there are lots of people who have obtained the working degree who go back and get an advanced degree in a completely different field–and succeed. IOW, your degree, no matter what it’s in, only takes you so far. Success depends on how you define it.

I think given the amount of sheer ignorance and poor spelling out there, ANY post-HS degree will stand someone in good stead. A great deal of success depends on hard work, looking for and taking advantage of opportunities when they arise and yes, luck.

Frankly, if all I wanted from undergrad was a “working degree” I would have gone to trade/tech school. Taking German, religion, psychology, Shakespeare etc were not only enjoyable, but also fulfilling. Those are the classes I remember fondly and wish I could do more of.

Congrats on the interview, OP!

51

[QUOTE=eleanorigby]
I think given the amount of sheer ignorance and poor spelling out there, ANY post-HS degree will stand someone in good stead.
[/QUOTE]
Unless it’s already so prevalent that the ignorant and poor spellers have risen to positions of responsibility, and prefer to hire people who are a good fit with them. Language skills are not that marketable anymore, and the day may not be far off when they are a net negative to employers.

52

I’m currently taking a Composition for IT Majors course and the instructor and the school in general keep telling us how English skills are more important than ever but I sometimes wonder why when business is more than willing to outsource to India and Indians whose English really ain’t all that great.

It seems to me English is nice, but isn’t a requirement to get paid.

53

[QUOTE=Beware of Doug]
Unless it’s already so prevalent that the ignorant and poor spellers have risen to positions of responsibility, and prefer to hire people who are a good fit with them. Language skills are not that marketable anymore, and the day may not be far off when they are a net negative to employers.
[/QUOTE]

Oh, please. And how do those poor communicators compete in their chosen field? I had a coworker who made up words (unfortunately not in an amusing way like Mr Spooner) and mangled grammar mercilessly. She was forced by our boss to take a remedial English course if she was to keep her job. I know this because she shared it with us–she was so surprised that she couldn’t keep doing what she was doing and maintain her success. Me, I was shocked she got the job, given her propensity. I quit working with her because in personality she resembled Darth Vader, and because I couldn’t communicate effectively with her (and other reasons, of course).

Poor spelling may work in advertising (and it works because we read the words Krispy Kreme and realize it’s spelled wrong–it grabs our attention), but it won’t work anywhere else. If I were to be in court, having to testify in a med/mal case and my charting was littered with misspellings, the prosecuting attorney would play that up to show my incompetence and undermine my position. And she would be right to do so.

Please explain how excellent communication skills such as mastery of the English language (or any language) will be a “net negative”? wtf? :confused:

lev–I don’t think it’s fair to compare people who are ESL. India has many problems, but it does have a good system for teaching English, IMS. In IT, you may not need excellent English to code stuff etc, but when you need to communicate with a client or sell your product, you will need those skills.

And it’s not just English–to be informed about the world, you need to know about it. Soci, anthro, psych, econ, history etc all teach about our world.

54

[QUOTE=eleanorigby]
I think that was his point. I’ll add to his point: my sister got her degree in medieval literature. She is now a very successful ad exec and travels around the world regularly.
[/Quote]
I actually choked with laughter on this one. Is anyone surprised that success as an ad exec is possible with a medieval literature degree?

Nope, didn’t miss it. But you apparently missed it twice. Here’s an example that maybe even you might understand.

  • I need to hire a new position for my business. Let’s say somebody to manage accounts in a region away from the home office. It requires critical thinking, ability to perform thorough research, and sound business skills. Should I look to hire a business major or someone with a History degree? 100 people applied. How do I get my applicant base down to a reasonable size before I interview? If I dump all of the history, sociology, and Medieval Literature majors out of the list I may miss the best candidate, but I can’t afford to search through the entire list so …bye bye. If I keep the business majors, at least I know that they have basic skill sets that might actually apply to my business as well as those skills from the other degrees.

Try convincing your customer base that your new “non working degree” hire is the perfect person to solve their tax problem, design their HVAC system, improve their health.

55

Soul, you’ve made great improvements. I do think calling yourself an adminstrative professional at this point is a bit overstated. Also, I would not say community leader for something if you were only a regular volunteer. If you led teams of volunteers, say that. Otherwise I’d call that category Community Service.

But really, it’s a heckuva lot better. Good luck!

56

I agree that you are being a bit limiting. When I first got out of college with a pesky Anthropology degree I worked at a temp agency as well as a part-time job (evenings/weekends) at a toy store. Yes, I was working 12 hours days to pay my rent but I was working. Sometimes you have to be a little more practical and a little less prideful. Or maybe it was my pride that kept me going (my dad called me weekly to tell me, “you’ll come crawling back home”).

Anyhoo, after a couple of months of that I picked up a hourly-with-benefits job I saw in the paper (that place they say you’ll never find a job in?). It was something related to the print industry that had nothing to do with my education. Having medical insurance and paid vacation sure was nifty! I quit my toy store job and luxuriated in working 9-5. After 9 months there I got an unexpected call on an unsolicited resume (that other place they say you’ll never find a job) with a major U.S. book retailer.

They offered me two interviews, both hourly with benefits - one for an online customer service rep and another for an administrative assistance position. I requested only the CSR position. My view at the time was that Admin assistant is where careers go to die (as it turns out, this particular company was rather better than average at promoting out of the AA ranks).

7 years later I was a senior Content editor and one of the nation’s most influential people in the Science Fiction, Fantasy, and Romance novel book categories.

Then I quit, spent 2 years working on a horse farm, and went to law school.

…

Where was a I going with that? Oh, yeah, if I had insisted on salaried work I would have spent the first … oh… 2 years of my working life unemployed, and never gotten my foot in the door at a company where I spent 7 mostly-happy years.

57

Hey, you’re in my boat. You’re already way far ahead of me though. I haven’t even started serious job searching yet…

Here’s a crazy thought, and since I’m crazy it’s what I’m planning on doing. Go to another country and teach English. I’ve heard it’s not really a plus to starting a career, but it’s fun, exciting, and it’s something.

58

I’ll back up those who say to not restrict yourself to salaried positions, and to spend time doing skill-building things.

My employer is a post-production company in LA. This is my first full-time job. A degree was required to be hired, with English/language majors preferred. In college, I studied psychology, which is right there next to sociology under useless majors, but I got the job because I had a good deal of experience writing and proofreading. I had intended to be a journalism major and spent all of high school and half of college doing as much proofreading and writing as I had time for.

Basically, you have to round yourself out if you feel there is a stigma against your major. If people perceive it as being easy or unserious, you need to supplement it with experience they can’t ignore.

All 3 positions I’ve had here have been hourly, which is what I prefer since overtime is very common here. And it’s not crap pay either; I make just under $40k/yr and have full benefits and a 401k. The only people who are salaried here are supervisors and upper management, and at times they probably wish they were hourly. The only people who start salaried here are the ones whose title contains the words “officer”, “director”, or “president”.

59

[QUOTE=Autolycus]
Hey, you’re in my boat. You’re already way far ahead of me though. I haven’t even started serious job searching yet…

Here’s a crazy thought, and since I’m crazy it’s what I’m planning on doing. Go to another country and teach English. I’ve heard it’s not really a plus to starting a career, but it’s fun, exciting, and it’s something.
[/QUOTE]
My ex-wife got a Masters in EFL, and is living in the Czech Republic. Living abroad is what she’s always liked, and EFL with some credentials is almost a guaranteed job someplace.

60

[QUOTE=Beware of Doug]
Unless it’s already so prevalent that the ignorant and poor spellers have risen to positions of responsibility, and prefer to hire people who are a good fit with them. Language skills are not that marketable anymore, and the day may not be far off when they are a net negative to employers.
[/QUOTE]

Except when your design project crashes and burns because the people writing the specs can’t express themselves clearly. I’m an engineer, and I assure you that unless you are a real genius, the way to get to the highest levels of the profession are to be able to write and speak clearly.

On the other hand, it is perfectly possible to get a working degree and take lots of enriching classes. I got a degree from that trade school on the Charles, and took history, religion, and lots of philosophy.