Did Neanderthals have souls? (Souls and religion)

Before the Rama-and-Sita and Krishna stories, one previous avatar of Vishnu in Hindu mythology was Rama-with-the-axe, essentially a pre-civilized barbarian. Not quite the same thing, but close enough for metaphysical work! :slight_smile:

AFAIK, no mainstream Protestant groups have said anything definitive on this. Catholics,. as noted, have no issues with evolution provided that the existence of the individual soul, a direct creation of God, is allowed in.

Friar Ted has referenced in passing the Evangelical Conservative view – Adam and Eve were historical characters, though not necessarily the first hominids ever, nor necessarily created in 4004 BC – just the first ones endowed with (rational) souls by God. On this take, pre-Adamic hominids may have been around, but would not have had the characters we ascribe exclusively to human beings.

Only godless people don’t have souls.

Atheists are godless people,

Therefore, atheists don’t have souls.
They don’t mind because they don’t believe in souls, anyways.

What about all the unbaptized babies that have to settle on Limbo? Do they have “child of god” level souls, but that becomes moot since no one dropped water on their forehead and spoke Latin? Or do they also not have “child of god” level souls?

I only ask because I remember how scared I became in Catholic grammar school when a classmate’s infant brother died of SIDS and wasn’t baptized yet. Our lay teacher tried her best to sell that Limbo wasn’t all that bad and that it was up to god to grant permission for Limbo baby to have heaven visiting rights. Yeah, them Catholic lay teachers… :rolleyes:

Limbo was a theory by some Catholic theologians never taught formally by the Church. (What Sr. Mary Ferox may have had to say is not “the teaching of the Church”). It was fairly recently disavowed formally, IIRC.

It was disavowed recently, not in 1980, though. We were told enough prayers for the baby would help god give said permission.

By the time I got to 8th grade, Queen Of Heaven didn’t teach about Limbo anymore,
my facebook alumni tell me purgatory is still popular there.

(The same teacher also told us that pets don’t go to “human heaven” with us. :dubious:
Yes, my kids will be attending PS.)

Damn straight, brutha! :smiley:

If I remember correctly, Jesus is quoted as saying He came that we may have “life” more abundently, didn’t say to save our souls. There is a quote that He states that it is better than losing one’s soul. But why should the soul suffer for what the body does, if the body is just a vessel for the soul? The driver of a car is held responsible if the driver gets the car in an accident, even if the car is faulty.

Then the soul is supposed to get a glorified body if the soul is not lost. And how a soul can be lost makes no sense to me.

Damn Strait? Isn’t that the narrow part of the River Styx? :smiley:

I’m afraid that while Catholicism embraces evolution, it does stipulate that Adam and Eve were real, historical people:

Catholic Answers: Adam, Eve and Evolution

My belief is plants is not so much of a soul but just a resource for man (i.e. God provided all seed bearing plants for food for man). The earth is of the womb of humanity, what we consider mother nature, and is a living creation of God, the female aspect that God created to nurture us as a mother nurtures her child providing for all the child’s needs and taking care of all the waste. As a mother, her calling and greatest satisfaction, is to provide all our needs and IMHO our efforts of recycling, resource management, CO2 reduction is saddening to her as those efforts are so meaningless and detract to the standard of living she wants to provide, and causes us to worry about things that don’t matter and it is really foolishness to the level of a fetal child providing his own resources by recycling his waste, but if the fetal child could actually accomplish that the mother would be helpless to intercede.

Isn’t the soul the contents of your brain? What else could it be?

My crackpot theory (the difference being I admit it) is that when an animal dies, the contents of it’s brain are uploaded to that Great Database in the Sky and scanned for useful information. More highly sentient beings such as ourselves maintain a degree of consciousness even as we become One with Everything.

But I think plants, insects, etc, are more like complex little machines and therefore don’t have much of a seat of consciousness to live on after they die.

You don’t think it’s a good idea not to abuse your mother?

Our Father and mother desire us to live good lives, and not to worry about things that we can’t effect, or would be way to costly and stunt our development. Dumping extra waste in a attempt to hurt mother earth is one thing, but trying to cut waste to zero is another. We are expected and designed to create a certain amount of waste, and just as a mother can handle the waste produced by a embryo, as population grows she can certainly handle the waste of a 8 month fetus also.

Scripturally, no the (spiritual) heart is the soul. IMHO the mind is a ‘device’ that takes our sense and thoughts of this world and translates them to our soul and back. It allows though in the physical world that our bodies are in. The physical body, including the mind, is nothing but a ‘tent’ that we (our soul) dwell in.

Does the spiritual heart (as opposed to the organ that pumps blood) have any observable characteristics?

Presuming it does, are souls differentiable? Can one soul be objectively distinguished from another without resorting to standard objective criteria.

Would any of the presumptive characteristics of the soul or any of its effects be observable in anthropologically significant ways? Art? Music? Shelter Design? Ritual?

Would any of the presumptive characteristics of the soul or any of its effects be observable in the simple physical structure of the body?

Nonsense. Our parents raise us to be responsible and not wasteful. They have finite resurces to spend on us and want us to clean up the messes we make instead of trashing the house that they pay for. Parents who spoil their children are considered bad parents, and yet we’re pretty spoiled.

And anyway, the “parent” analogy only goes so far.

Sure. Your brain is your hard drive and CPU and your soul is the software that’s loaded into it. You soul includes your memories and that certainly is stored in your brain as data.

The soul exists in a spiritual dimension, quite possibly in up to 21 dimensional space, for some reason I get that number. Our physical heart just is a additional 3 that is added on to it. As such study of the 3d object is not going to do anything to study the other ?21?, just like studying the mars rovers is not going to tell you anything about the person controlling it. No matter how hard you look at the rover you will never see the controller. It is only after you stop looking at the rover itself and start looking elsewhere that you have a chance of finding the rest.

Our souls are meant to combine together into one single body, but for now they have been individualized. Soul ties, through love and lust can combine them together. By man distinguishing between them is impossible, but through the gift of the Holy Spirit they are distinguishable - this gift is called distinguishing between the spirits.

Yes and no. If you look into spiritual things with a heart to discover their truth, come to it openly then yes you will see great things, if you come with a hard heart, believing that the spiritual must prove itself to you then the spiritual will basically tell you to go take a hike. You have to follow your heart, which is your core being and the part of you that is in the spiritual dimensions, learn to listen to your heart and think with your heart, instead of listening and thinking with a device (mind) that was never intended to be the main way we think, but just a translator.

Again thinking with your heart, not your head and yes, You can see this in acupuncture and other alternative medicines where some people have learned to feel things like chi and energy channels. You might also be able to sense ‘evil’ or ‘good’ places.

In other words, don’t use your brain,just accept what your idea of the truth is, as you seem to think you know it all, and others don’t?