One of them started this war by kidnapping hundreds of civilians into enemy territory, and could end the war at any moment they choose by releasing those hostages. So I think the blame does lay squarely on one side here.
Would that stop the war, though? I thought the Israeli government’s goal was the complete elimination of Hamas.
What is especially concerning to me is the prospect, described in detail in this recent New York Times Magazine article “The Unpunished”, of the ongoing rightward shift in Israeli views enabling continued radicalization of, and impunity for, anti-Palestinian extremists.
ISTM that people like Ben-Gvir and Smotrich are not easily dismissable as accidental one-off failures of governance. They seem to represent an ongoing pattern of “extremification” that is committed to ever more catastrophic oppression of Palestinians, in the service of ever more radical views of Jewish destiny in Israel.
Even if Netanyahu and Smotrich and Ben-Gvir are indeed summarily banished from the political scene within the next few months, what happens next? Will they be replaced with more moderate leaders representing an Israeli consensus against ongoing oppression of Palestinians? That consensus, if it exists, doesn’t seem to have been able to stop Netanyahu and Smotrich and Ben-Gvir from getting into power in the first place.
If the deal on the table was the release of all the hostages (ie, not this bullshit “oh we will agree to release 30 hostages and/or bodies and then trickle out more if we feel like it, and in exchange you completely pull out” nonsense), then yeah, the government would have no choice but to accept.
That is the goal, and I think that withdrawing early would be a colossal mistake that would ensure another Oct 7 (and another Gaza war) in the future; but I also think that Hamas could force Israel to make that mistake if they were actually willing to release the hostages and negotiate.
Hamas bears the blame for the kidnappings and mass murder on Oct 7th. But Netanyahu and his allies bear a big part of the blame for empowering Hamas, and an even bigger part of the blame for discriminatory and brutal policies (allowing settler violence) towards Palestinians for years, and for fighting against any sort of long term peace.
And they bear much of the blame for Israeli forces’ mistakes and misdeeds in this war.
Sure, I agree, and those are the reasons I want to see them out of office and, for some of them, in jail.
It isn’t equivalent to a war crime, though.
Such as they are, yes; but again, nowhere near equivalent to terrorism or war crimes.
I’m not nearly so sure. Decades of oppression and tolerance for settler violence may not technically be a war crime or terrorism, but it might be just as bad, morally speaking.
I don’t necessarily think this is a pattern. The only discernable pattern I can see is Netanyahu going to increasingly desperate measures to remain in power. The next election will probably be massive as far as determining the knock-on effects of this. He’s certainly given legitimacy to the far right parties, the only real hope is that he’s also damaged Likud enough that the center to center-right parties usurp them in the future.
Do you think Netanyahu would abide to those terms, or would he just say, “We’ve got the hostages out, now its time to finish the job,” and keep on with the war?
They said exactly that weeks ago, don’t know why it’s been spun differently now. Hell, 61% of Israelis agree that Rafah must fall, no matter what.
Biden has declared that what is happening in Gaza is not genocide:
Well then, I guess that settles it.
But perhaps, President Biden, perhaps you could see how some folks might think it is a genocide? Seems to be a pretty hot topic of discussion so I’d be curious as to your specific reasoning why this situation in particular doesn’t qualify. You said “let me be clear” so by all means, go ahead.
Biden is absolutely wrong about this. What Israel is doing is the intentional genocide of the Palestinian people with the goal of eliminating them from their homes in Gaza and the West Bank and increasing Israel’s domination of the territory.
The more he doubles down on his support, the more consequences he will face later this year.
Anyone who doesn’t vote for Biden because they don’t like his stance on Gaza is just gonna love the other guy’s approach.
“I don’t care if the leopards eat my face, as long as they eat the Israelis’ faces first.”
This is a fair comment, but it ignores why people might vote this way. The Republicans are a lost cause - it doesn’t matter who the next candidate is, they’re not going to give a shit about the Palestinians. There is hope, however, that the next Dem candidate might do something more than blindly sign off on whatever Israel wants to do.
People voting against Biden because of his stance on Israel realize it doesn’t help in the short term, but hope it will help long term. I don’t agree with this approach, but I understand the reasoning.
This comment, on the other hand, maybe seemed witty when you typed it.
When the other guy wants to destroy democracy in the long term it obviously stops making sense.
Well, if you completely ignore everything Biden had done to moderate Netanyahu’s approach and ensure that aid gets into Gaza, then I understand why you wouldn’t like him.
Those of us who live in reality, on the other hand, have seen this:
This assumes that there will be a long term for the Palestinians with Trump in charge in the short term. Which seems highly questionable.
Here’s yet another reason why Israel is called (among many others) a flawed democracy1
Yeah, that’s why I disagree.
I’ve linked below a worthwhile article to get a little more understanding on where some Muslim-Americans are coming from. “Imagine thinking it’s a good argument to say to a community that has lost 30,000 people, ‘Watch out for the guy that’s going to ban you.’ You’re really asking me whether I’m going to take a ban or a genocide? I’ll take a ban.”
Again, I think it’s wrong thinking because Trump isn’t just talking about a ban; he’s just fine with genocide too. But it’s reflective of the deep anger they feel toward Biden. I’m going to be a lot more pissed off at a friend who punches me in the face than I will at some random drunk asshole.