Do girls still need special treatment?

I was looking thru our local parks and rec summer camp guide and I came across one summer camp called “Independent Spirit for Girls Camp” (bottom of 2nd page). Activities include “self defense, basic car maintenance, bb guns, archery, and the power of choice”. The camp is for girls 13-16 and girls also get a copy of the book “The Daring Book for Girls”.

My question is, why do girls still need this? Havent girls developed now to the stage they can compete head to head with the 13-16 year old boys? In schools around here girls are the student leaders and are winning awards in all areas.

Yet we still have this 80’s notion that somehow girls are discriminated and held back. Doesnt having to have a special class for girls sort of blow the notion that girls are empowered and can do whatever they want?

Is this still needed?

BTW, such a class really should be for both genders.

If enough girls are enrolled in the camp to make it profitable, yes. There is a need.

Let the market work.

This should end well.

Haven’t looked at any numbers, but I’ve heard a lot of talk that boys are doing a good deal worse than girls in schools these days. Too much online porn? Too much online gaming? School environment too feminine? I don’t know. But it sure seems like special treatment for girls just for being girls is not what we need these days.

Are there not similar “adventure” camps for boys?

And there is a factual answer to this?

We need online gaming and porn that is designed to appeal to girls. There is a reason that mostly boys are attracted to that sort of thing. It’s created for boys.

This very thread is about the plain and simple fact that boys and girls are attracted to things (online and otherwise) that send them down different gender-specific paths of interest and endeavor, proved by your argument. If the boys see school as “too feminine”, the solution might be to re-genderize the demographic, so both boys and girls see a school paradigm they can relate to.

As for the OP, the effort described is simply to acknowledge this gender difference, and offer a legitimate and acceptable means whereby girls can become boyish if they wish to. It gives one pause to wonder what the other side of the coin might be like – a camp for girly boys.

Since the OP is asking for opinions, let’s move this to IMHO from General Questions.

samclem, moderator

Sure. Boys have the boy scouts and what do the girls have?

The Girl Scouts? Pffft! Not every girl wants to be groomed to be a stay at home care taker. Some girls want to shoot guns and get their hands greasy working on an engine. What choice do they have?

I would have loved such a camp as a teenaged girl. I think I would have preferred an all-girl experience versus a mixed one, if only because the former is a break from the routine. And also because teenaged girls and boys distract each other when they are each other’s presence. Much of the drama that infects high school is the direct result of heterosexual tug-of-wars. A summer free from that shit would have been wonderful for a girl like me.

When you talk about a difference between genders, you assume that the difference within a gender is unimportant. This is how you get toy stores with pink and blue sections.

What we need to acknowledge is difference between PEOPLE and give everyone what they actually need rather than look at their gender and let that decide what’s good for them.

A single course, offered at a day camp does not equal ‘special treatment for girls’.

Space camp isn’t proof that nerdy kids ‘need special encouragement’. Both are ideas for interesting sounding children’s camp activities which, hopefully will draw parent’s attention/dollars.

Says much more about parents than children to me.

In a girl’s shoes (rather than those of a 45 year-old woman), I’d be interested in a summer camp for those things but feel it would be filled by boys pretty fast and have no room left for me. A separate one would ensure that wouldn’t happen.

Well that’s then thing. I think way too many people who set up these camps are still living in the past where girls where girls took home ec and the boys took shop and the girls didnt get the same chances as boys but in reality, these days they do.

Again, a class to teach basic auto repair both genders need that since nowadays most boys dont know how to work on cars either.

Venturing or Exploring are two possibilities.

What’s the “past” for you? I grew up in the 80s and 90s, and I didn’t have access to shop class or auto mechanics. Neither of my parents are into these activities. Just where would I have learned them, if not a camp like this one?

I’m glad you think gender roles have been completely abolished, but this isn’t true at all. Just recently I was telling some women coworkers that I mow my yard (rather than hiring a neighborhood boy to do it) and they both expressed surprise that I’d have the physicality to do such a task. My mother has never as much touched a lawnmower. You don’t have to explicitly be told “that’s men’s work” for the message to still be engrained in you. There are still plenty of “old school” people out there raising children with “old school” notions.

I don’t see how this is “special treatment”. Do boys not have camps along these lines?

We do. Every girl is free to watch porn or play war gaming, but most just don’t. That is not something that imposed on them by societal engineering.

Do you want, for some societal good, to force parents to re-direct their children toward some ideal of unisex personal development, in every one of the billion-or-so households in the world, with zero tolerance for a seed of resistance that can revert back to a gendered revolution?

You are missing the point. Even if 99% of boys burst in flames when they touch something pink and 99% of girls faint when they touch an Xbox controller, that still leaves the 1% who do not conform to the stereotype.

So when you decide how to tailor education to a kid, look at the kid, don’t just assume that the kid is the same as all other kids that share the same gender.

You’ll be relieved to learn that for the 99% this will have the exact same result. But it really helps the 1%.

(And of course in real life it’s not really 99% vs 1%.)

I was a Girl Scout for longer than I actually wanted to be, but while I didn’t particularly enjoy it I don’t remember anything about my experience as a Girl Scout that was “grooming to be a stay at home caretaker”.