Do non-U.S countries have a "pledge of allegience"?

Pretty much zip.

Everything official (elected officials, the military, naturalization, etc) centers on an oath to uphold the Constitution.

As a special treat for Constanze, who seems to get horror-movie-type thrills from accounts of American popular culture – the Morning Exercises!!!

This was what we pre-school-prayer-ban baby-boomers started the day with (New York City and New Jersey university town):

formal classroom roll call
recitation of the Lord’s prayer
scripture reading by a student (student’s choice, but usually a Psalm)
Pledge of Allegiance
patriotic song
classroom and school-wide announcements

(I may have the exact order wrong, or missed an item or two. It’s been a while. Like half a century.)

Several of the above items tied in to educational objectives, such as having us read aloud or sing.

I had a teacher around fifth grade or so who additionally read us a chapter of a story book each day, to help us get settled down and attentive.

For a brief time in New York, when school prayer was first becoming an issue, we recited something called the Regents’ Prayer, composed on behalf of the state board of education and presumably intended to be non-denominational.

The sub-text of all this was that we were in school for some purpose worthy of official rites. At the end of the day, we were formally dismissed.

As I thought. I’ve understood the Pledge to be a symbolic statement, and that taking the Pledge doesn’t have any specific legal effect, such as granting you US Citizenship, or obligating you to serve in the US Military, and refusing to take it doesn’t revoke or void US Citizenship, and I thought that children could not be legally forced to say it as a condition of attending public schools.

In contrast to others saying schooltime recital of the pledge is fast fading from fashion, that certainly wasn’t my experience; I’m not that far out of school myself (public schools in New Jersey, in case it matters), and we were made to stand up, put our hands on our heart, and recite the Pledge of Allegiance at the beginning of every day from first grade (starting in fall 1991) up through 12th (ending in spring 2003).

(Or at least endure listening to everyone else doing it. I only gradually became aware of how creepy and distasteful this ritual was towards the end of high school, I think. Even then, the implicit pressure and years of instilled tradition was such that I still couldn’t bring myself to consistently demur from taking part; rather, I merely switched to saying it or not depending on who I had as my homeroom teacher on any given day and how much I liked them and cared about their opinion of me. (I suppose I imagined my quietly choosing not to take part would be seen as a grandstanding dick move. Though in retrospect, I doubt many of the teachers whose opinions I respected actually cared…))

Ah, yes, Opening Exercises. At my public elementary school in Manitoba in 1986-1991, we had to sing O Canada and God Save the Queen (in French!), and recite the Lord’s Prayer (Manitoba was apparently the last province to do away with the prayer).

When I changed schools to a private one (1991-1993), instead we all went into the assembly room for assembly in the morning, where there was generally a religious song of some kind (a different one every day) and a prayer. We only sang O Canada at special assemblies. Frankly, I could have done with more national anthem and fewer hymns.

From grades 1 to 12 (& proballly kindergarten) we were led in the Pledge by someone over the loudspeaker everymorning. In high school it was whatever student was in the office doing the morning announcements; before that the principal or one of his secretaries. I pissed off several different teachers by refusing to say it. None of whom had ever heard of the Supreme Court case. I had teacher in HS who was really, really offended by it (& really, really annoyed when she found out she couldn’t do anything about it). Whenever she subed for out homeroom reacher I wouldn’t even bother standing up. We even said the Pledge as part of our graduation ceremony. I just stood silently with my hands at my sides. I never felt an ounce of peer presure from any of my classmates though.

That was one of my objections to saying the Pledge (the other was that I found the idea of daily loyalty oaths disgusting). I did say the Pledge one time in HS. I was in the office for some reason one day when both the students who normally did the annoucements were absent. So the secretary asked me if I’d look to do them. Which I did. When it got to the Pledge I omited “under God”. Afterward she very nicely asked if I’d forgotten something. I said no, she said I left out “under God”. I told her I did that on purpose because there isn’t one. Her smile went away and she got very quite & pale. :stuck_out_tongue: Judging by her expression one would think I just sprouted horns from the top of my head.

The only part that made a lick of sense to me was the bit about God being invisible.

Being Wisconsin (home of Joe McCarthy and Ed Gein) our kids’ school was forced to “lead those students who wish to participate in The Pledge, and to play the National Anthem”.

Being Madison, Wisconsin, the local grade school rushed through the “Optional Pledge” (most kids “opted out”), and started the day with The Star-Spangled Banner over the PA system… as played by Jimi Hendrix.

I said it every day until I was in HS and they added “under god” to it and I never said it again. Stupid and, in its own way, demeaning.

:smiley:
Seriously, the last time (and AFAIK, the only time) France had a pledge of allegiange, it was to the Marshall Petain (along with a song titled “Marshall, here we are”).

You can see how the concept wouldn’t fly well over here. I suspect it’s the same in a number of other European countries, the idea of having schoolchildren (or whoever else) recite a pledge being associated with dictatorships.

(apart from that, I’ve other issues with the concept of asking children to pledge allegiance to a flag, their country, or anything at all for that matter)

Does anyone here understand “pledging allegiance to a flag”?

Seriously, a flag? Not the country, not the people, not the democracy, not the leaders… but a piece of cloth?

I have never understood this…

I’m an American citizen, but I don’t understand it either.

The American flag is one of the most visible and ubiquitous symbols of the nation. The flag has, for many people, an iconic importance far beyond its mere physical nature as a piece of tricolored cloth. Soldiers have died in battle to protect the flag, or to recapture it from foes. Read the Pledge again:

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

The flag is thus implicitly a symbol of “the country… the people [and] democracy” (but not national leaders, who go unmentioned - appropriately, IMHO). The Pledge was first published in a children’s magazine, and was originally intended for children. No one expects kids to pledge allegiance to a Constitution which they might not even be able to read - but anyone with eyesight can see a flag. The poorest school district can afford a small flag in classrooms and auditoriums. Nowadays, people of all ages might say it. The Pledge is a patriotic ritual that can, concisely and simply, give people an opportunity to demonstrate a shared commitment to the nation and its ideals, as symbolized by the flag.

I fully understand that not everyone agrees, and that’s fine. I will defend to the death your right to refuse to say the Pledge, and to ridicule the flag. Knock yourself out. It’s still a free country.

FWIW, the Philippines has such a pledge, too: Pledge of Allegiance to the Philippine Flag - Wikipedia

The latter version is said at my public school prior to the playing of South Korea’s national anthem. This is done at matriculation, commencement, first semester ending ceremony, second semester beginning ceremony, and the monthly student assembly. The way it’s done is the students stand in line by classroom, the announcer for the event commands “Attention! Face the flag!” and then a recording of the pledge is played. The recording of the national anthem is just the music and the students will sing the anthem. For the “big events” the students also sing the school song. I’m actually impressed that most of the students know the both songs.

For the weekly school teaching staff meeting, the staff stand, face the flag, place their hands on their heart, and then drop their hands, and finally take their seats. The pledge is not recited.

I’d say those were oaths to the population that the person uttering the oath would support and defend the constitutions, not an oath of allegiance to the document itself.

Who and when? I would assume that the officers who ordered an operation to capture a flag were disciplined for such gross stupidity, so there should be a record.

The wikipedia article about medal of honor recipients in the Civil War has numerous examples; search “flag” (List_of_American_Civil_War_Medal_of_Honor_recipients).

Yeah, but you guys OWE us, big time! First we save you from the Kaiser, then Hitler, then Stalin, and lately the World Bank Rapist! (I’m tellin’ you, France woulda been next, with the sexy accent and the short French maid outfit…)

Is it too much to ask for you to go through the same meaningless empty ritual just like every American school kid is browbeaten into?

I guess I was thinking of the flag as it is today, not as a tool like it was then.

HazelNutCoffee: If you’re interested, here, are both versions of the pledge along with some files one may download for it. The first version of the pledge is:

The second version is:

An MP proposed one once. It has all of the sense and random capitalization of an email forward about how taxes are illegal: