But the audience for Fox News basically is an angry mob.
I’d rather we not talk about my dad that way, thanks, even if he is a (moderate, primarily with the party because he’s Catholic and pro-life is pro-life, he votes for the pro-life PA Democrats when he can) Republican.
“Well, first thing will happen, Mom will fucking kill you!”
Yep. Sure does*.
Quote from Marley:
True but there is a long historyof violence associated with picket lines, especially crossing them. Setting up a picket line and then encouraging the picket line by saying things like:
opens one up to a lot more criticism than someone who does a story on T.V. The fact that Sharpton a) created the picket line b) spoke out in threatening ways at the picket line and c) stood by while his deputies made even more threatening statements at the picket line put Sharptons actions in a totally different light than what Beck did.
Even with the differences, I am not sure that Sharpton should be liable for the Freddy’s Fashion Mart killing. I think Sharpton is a total tool and probably had a good idea that someone would end up hurt but I don’t think he thought someone would get killed. At the same time he *created *the mob and then *incited *the mob…
Slee
*I have no idea why you brought up abortion, unless you think I am some sort of right wing abortion nut. I am neither right wing nor against abortion rights.
Yup - Sharpton is a total scumbag and was partially liable for the Freddys sad events.
Yup - Beck is a total scumbag is is partially liable for the right wing hate and what evolves from it.
The two do not cancel out or excuse the other.
Do you have a cite/link to Beck spewing hate? Hate on the level of the crap that Al Sharpton spews with regularity?
I watched the video that the killer in this case had linked to on stormfront*. Beck (whom I have never watched until this thread) goes on about FEMA camps, stating that he doesn’t think they exist. He then goes on about a bit about Obama giving money to community health centers, some people who do not want the government to pull money from doctors who object to abortion, and the government limiting deductions for charitable giving. The thrust of this is that the government wants more control and that once the government gets control they do not let go.
Well, as far as I can tell, he is right. The government is continually wanting more control (both left and right**). Once the government gets control it almost never gives it up.
During that video I did not see him once call for armed insurrection or anything violent.
Stating that the government is always trying to take more control != stating go out and shoot someone. It is not even close. Unless there is a great deal more that Beck said, I don’t believe that he has any responsibility on this one.
Slee
- I did not go to stormfront to look that up. Another poster to this thread posted the link earlier. I hope that I never have to wade through any posts by the idiots at stormfront.
** As far as I can tell, the left wants to control the money and the right wants to control the morals. I’d prefer it if both sides stopped trying.
I’ve never seen Sharpton spew hate. Beck does it pretty much every night. So does Hannity, so does O’Reilly. Fox News is pretty much the Hate Channel.
If ya think he spews you should read his message board. Open calls for putting “liberals” into death camps, treason trials of members of Congress for official acts that could never meet the Constitutional definition of treason with the death penalty as punishment, and carefully written posts advocating the murder of unnamed elected government officials (only because clear advocacy of murdering said is against the rules, you can come as close to the line as you want as long as you don’t cross it, even if there’s no question that you are in fact advocating murder). Fucking. Scary. Shit.
CMC fnord!
I see it.
This is exactly what is murky in some cable news and radio shows. When does free speech become incitement?
I believe the Klan’s free speech should be protected like any other group. Individuals should be able to access books and material with any view point from any extreme group. I question whether the racist and other extremists with views grounded in ignorance should be given the legitimacy of a national cable news broadcast. Some people might believe the world is flat, but I don’t think their views should be legitimized with a public platform to offer a counter opinion to valid scientific theory. This conveys a message to the public that a flat earth is a legitimate theory. The media have more power to shape public perception than many people want to acknowledge.
Glenn Beck is given air time on a cable news channel with mass public reach. He uses suggestion instead of directives. The entertainer excuse doesn’t absolve Beck from responsibility for his show, either. War of the Worldswas entertainment but a significant portion of the population thought it was real.
Clinton and Lieberman have long given up their anti-video game crusades when they realized the public (and the legislature) wasn’t buying it.
I think the big question is imminence, not incitement. If a host goes on TV and spews a little of paranoid, ludicrous drivel, is a violent response from his viewers imminent? I’m not convinced of that. If Beck speaks to an armed and angry crowd and whips them up into a near riot, then yes, there might be a case for preventing imminent lawless action. When he’s talking on TV to a bunch of couch potatoes, I am not so sure violence and danger is imminent.
That’s only from a constitutional and legal standpoint, not an ethical one.
Should they? No. It’s a stupid thing to do on the part of the network, and they’re trading on the vanishing distinction between news and commentary or entertainment on TV. But I’m not convinced the law should intervene.
This goes to show that entertainers have always pushed the boundaries on mass communication, and also that a lot of people are stupid. But if you want a comparison to people like Beck, I’d skip Orson Welles and go to Father Coughlin.
My point was that they did it in the first place. And if the public bites on this one - and they might if Seung-Hui Cho had been a big FPS player, for example - I’m sure they’ll be at it again.
I just can’t blame Beck- much as I’d like to pin something drastic on him, this guy was a nutcase who’d have been set off by Daylight Savings Time if it hadn’t been anti Gun Control propaganda. I can only say what Media Matters said to Lou Dobbs, which is when openly white supremacist groups are cheering you it’s probably a good idea to back up and reconsider your viewpoints", though I don’t see Beck taking stock any more than Dobbs did.