So if might makes right, then I suppose that if Israel ever loses a war to Islamic radicals, the Zionists should just shut up and take what they’re given, right?
Until there is a treaty, they have every right to keep fighting until they are satisfied with the terms of peace.
I would think that the legitimate grievance is obvious to anyone that read the post that you seem to be replying to.
But here are a few facts that might make things more clear (or not):
1880’s ~2-3% Jewish
1922 ~11%
1932 ~18%
1942 ~30%
In what way is an immigrant minority entitled to cut a country in half and take a larger piece than their proportion of the population?
I’m not sure why being an immigrant, who bought land and moved into a region makes you have any less right to the land. The fact that my parents were immigrants here make my claim to being of the US any less valid? Once they were there, they became part of the local community. How many generations back do you have to go?
Question- weren’t there laws in place prohibiting Jews from buying land in what is now Israel, which in effect kept them out in the early 1800s? In other words, if they were prohibited by law from being there earlier, doesn’t seem unfair to use it to deny legitimacy of the claim for land in the region?
My parents, too (well my dad died two years ago from complications of being slave-labor in the coal mines. Destroyed his lungs.). Mom is still chugging along, So no, it hasn’t been that long.
ETA: I wonder how many of us on this board are children of survivors. I seem to see it a lot. It’s a pretty remarkable number of people.
Answering for Terr, since he clearly dodged the question:
Terr: “Of course not! Jews are morally and legally right! Israel needs to be there because we can’t trust the Palestinians because they are all terrorists! Besides, we need that whole Judgement Day thing to happen and it cannot happen as long as the Jews don’t have their land. Israel has every right to fight for itself. Palestinians do not.”
So yes, altering things - other than removal of content extraneous to the discussion - from quote boxes is against the rules. But so is falsely attributing a quote to another user. YogSosoth did so in his post. By creating a quote - inside quote marks - for Terr he behaved as if Terr had actually written those words. Terr did not.
In short, this shouldn’t be difficult. Don’t put anything inside quotation marks - or quote boxes - that you wouldn’t be able to say that person actually said. Such behavior would get someone fired at any journalism position in the country (or should) because doing so is potentially damaging to the person being falsely quoted.
Asian-Americans? Isn’t everyone batshit obsessed with Israel/Palestine?
We came within a hair of nuclear war in 1973 over it (and many of us still remember the oil embargo.) This isn’t just some abstract matter of theological doctrine. This matters enough, to enough people, that world peace is imperiled.
I dunno, I’m not obsessed and would happily never think about it again if everyone else under the sun (99.999% of whom have no connection to the region) stopped obsessively bringing up their own mental pathologies on the issue. Ever consider that maybe it’s a fake conflict and wouldn’t exist if we didn’t encourage this trendy obsession by outsiders?
If the Israelis ever “lose” a war to “Islamic radicals”(why you use that term since they’ve rarely fought any I have no idea) then they’ll simply be exterminated.
Beyond that, since you keep insisting they have “legitimate grievances” and support them to continue fighting “their war” which you have termed to be “honorable” you do realize the people who started the war were unrepentant Nazis who’s stated goal was the extermination of “the Jews”.
Very well, why do you think should be continuing fight this war who’s stated purpose is to exterminate “the Jews”(not the Israelis or the Zionists, the Jews).
Beyond that, which Jews do you think they should be allowed to kill?
Israelis? American Jews? Anyone who claims to be a Zionist(which is the vast majority)?
BTW, that’s not meant as an accusation, but merely pointing out that those are the logic outcomes of the road you seem to be traveling down. I suggest you stop romanticizing it because I know you’re not gonna like where you’ll end up or the company you’ll find there.
Beyond that, I’ve asked before and I’ll ask again. Why do you keep contrasting “the Palestinians”(an ethnic term) with “the Zionists”(a political term).
If you’re trying to adopt the Palestinian mindset, they don’t use the term “Zionists” when discussing their enemy except sometimes when westerners are around. Ordinary Palestinians refer to them as “the Jews” and it’s not intended as a pejorative. It’s just how they think of their enemy.
Do you believe there is a faction of Palestinians who the Israeli’s could lose to that wouldn’t exterminate them? Suppose Abbas and Fatah got the military strength to take over Israel. Do you think they’re capable of just exterminating them or would they try to rule Israel but allow the Jews to live as (probably) second class citizens?
Isn’t Hamas the only ones who says they want to do that? Does Fatah have that in their charter?
By the way, I see that cite a lot about Hamas, and while I don’t doubt it, I’d like to see how its worded. Do you happen to have a link to an english version of the Hamas charter?
Moreover, if the links have been distant from each other and if obstacles, placed by those who are the lackeys of Zionism in the way of the fighters obstructed the continuation of the struggle, the Islamic Resistance Movement aspires to the realisation of Allah’s promise, no matter how long that should take. The Prophet, Allah bless him and grant him salvation, has said:
"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem).
And of course, Article 22 is straight out of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. Or Mein Kampf, if you prefer.
I was responding to a poster that characterized the palestinians as the world’s bggest crybaby poor losers for continuing to fight for something they lost in 1948. I was asking if Israel lost a war, if that meant Israel should just throw up their hands and stop fighting.
(read: I was too lazy to write out “quotation marks”)