Dog training suggestions?

A couple of days ago, I got a puppy. She’s a 12-week old border collie/australian shepherd cross. I’m entirely new at this…I’ve always had cats, but never a puppy. She’s amazingly adorable and seems very smart to boot. I’ve had her 3 days and she seems darned near housebroken. She always goes to the back door and cries or scratches at it when she has to go. (I’m crate-training her…it seemed kind of mean at first but she seems to be responding well.)

I was warned that she might be a hyper dog when she gets older, but I saw both her parents and they semed kind of mellow. I was also told that neither of the parent dogs had ever bitten anyone their entire lives. I can’t see this as a hereditary trait, but I’m hopeful.

Should I take her to a dog training class? I’d really like to try training on my own, and she seems to catch on pretty quick.

But…how about teaching her basic obedience and tricks? I’m open to suggestions, and would LOVE to hear your stories.

Congratulations on your puppy. Name?

I would highly suggest doing an obedience class. You’ll just learn a lot more than trying to do it on your own, plus it will give you a chance to hook her up with some “dog buddies”. Doing training on your own can be difficult with your first dog and any “mistakes” can last a lifetime.

A dog training manual that is highly recommended on the the Malamute-L list is by the “Monks of the New Skete” - I don’t recall the title. If malamute owners recommend it, it must be good (Mals can be, well, interestig dogs to train.)

Your dog should be a good mix. Border collies are highly intelligent and do have a reputation for needing a lot of exercise. Same with the Australian shepherd. FYI - intelligence is good, but keep in mind that a bored dog is a destructive dog. Get her lots of toys an chewy’s, exercise often and keep those shoes locked up for the next 6 months.

I’d suggest reading some breed books on both breeds or surfing some of the breed websites. Another suggestion would be to join one of the Internet listservs devoted to either breed. If you can put up with the “My dog just got a BB/BIS/BOOS” (dog show brags), they can be a good resource and a font of advice.

Get her lots of exercise. Rember that every interaction with your dog is a training opportunity. Set time aside every day in these first few months to work on training, even it’s just 10 minutes a day. Please feel free to contact me if you have training questions. I have a lot of experience at it (training dogs and people).

And if she wasn’t sleeping, I’m sure my malamute/heeler mix would say, "A puppy, I want to play!

It’s simple

punish praise

dogs hate being put on so punish as infrequently as possible

dogs worship you so praise whenever progress is made

good dog is standard but any word will work.

More advanced than don’t crap in the house, don’t jump, or don’t bite, seek experienced trainers.

You aint gonna make that dog a retriever by yourself.

After a few classes you will realize that dog will do anything you ask, as long as you are willing to put in the hours training.

This is really more a matter of opinion, so I’ll move the thread over to IMHO for you.

Hie yourself to your local library and pick up two of the best books ever written, The Art of Raising a Puppy and How to be Your Dog’s Best Friend, both by the Monks of New Skete.

Huzzah! for you and your puppy!

The Monks of New Skete are a good source of info. Uncle Matty, (Matthew Margolis) has some good advice too.

A formal Puppy Kindergarten class is a great way to go with a first dog.

Your puppy, a border collie/australian shepherd cross, sheesh, this is going to be a tough pup. Way smart, like you said, but a cross of two of the smartest, hardest headed, high energy (not “hyper”, I hate that word) breeds there are. (Not to knock Malamutes, whistlepig, thay are in a class by themselves.)

On the upside, they are both herding dogs. Herders are bred to do what you want. As long as they respect you. No worries, just don’t let the little girl walk all over you, and you’re Jake.

And “A tired puppy is a good puppy.” Words to live by.
-Rue.

I have a border collie/lab mix, same situation as you, my very first dog. I agree with what whistlepig said. We went to obedience classes when he was a pup and it made a world of difference. There are other dogs to socialize with, and if you can keep your dog’s attention on you while 12 other dogs are milling around, you’ve accomplished something! Obedience classes were fun, everytime my dog learned something new I was overjoyed.

I’m not a big believer in the need for obedience school.
For one thing, unless you are very careful in the school, you have no guarantee that you will be training your dog to be the kind of dog YOU want, instead of the kind of dog the trainer thinks you should have, or he/she knows how to train.
Second, too many folk make the mistake of thinking a limited number of sporadic classes is all that will be needed to train their dog, and don’t do the required between class and after class work.

One big thing I believe with a new pup is to spend as much time with the pup, and close to it, as you can. If you are watching TV or reading, get down on the floor. Let the pup nap curled up in your arms on the floor. I think this encourages bonding. At the same time, I strongly believe in keeping dogs off furniture.
Get in the pack mindset. You are the dominant alpha.
I’m a big believer in training the dog to walk both on and off lead. Some folk here will disagree.
Make sure the pup has toys (clearly distinguishable from clothes or valuables) to chew on. When he makes a mistake, correct him and give him the proper object to chew.
Do not let him get overly oral in his play with you.
Expose him to different settings, different people, and other dogs whenever you get the chance.
You will need to get that beast plenty of exercise.
Enjoy.

I have a new puppy, too! Here are my suggestions aside the good advice already given.

  1. Socialize him while he’s little. Don’t miss an opportunity to take him to the park or to the kids’ soccer games now. Let him interact with everyone, but especially kids and other dogs. When he plays nicely with kids and dogs praise, praise, praise him. Give him a slight correction if he jumps on people or gets too exuberant.

  2. Exercise is vital, esp. with a collie! Give him something to herd if you can. Got any sheep? :slight_smile:

  3. Also while he’s young take him off the leash and walk him. When he wanders off, issue a command (“Come” or “Here!”) and when he comes back to you, grinning, praise him and give him a treat. There’s nothing worse than a dog who will run off on the occasions they get loose. (Trust me, I know.) It’s important that they know that YOU’RE the one who decides where you’re going.

  4. Spay or neuter him as soon as he reaches sexual maturity.
    We don’t need more unwanted puppies in the world.

and finally

  1. Crate training really does work. And they will learn to love their crate.

Good luck!

Spydergrrl must be out walking her new pup.

Spyder, don’t worry about what people have said about the breed mix being “interesting”. That’s a good thing, you have the potential to have a great dog. I have a friend who has an Australian Shepherd who can fetch beers out of the fridge AND bring the beer back to the person who requested it. Let’s see a golden retreiver do that!

(Statement that golden retreivers are a good dog. Reference to golden retreiver I like. Reminder that breed preferences are individual choices.)

Dinsdale: Good point about making sure that if you go to puppy school, you have a trainer that teaches you to teach your dog in a way that you want to treat your dog. I had some friends who took their dog to a trainer who taught a lot of physical overcorrection and shouting. They weren’t happy with it. Ask your veterinarian or other dog owners you know or meet if they could recommend a trainer.
Please do the class training, if you aren’t used to training animals, it can be incredibly difficult to train an “interesting heritage” dog.

Dinsdale also had a good point about spending as much time as you can with your dog. At this time in your relationship, she should be with you every single minute you are not prohibited from having a dog (or unless you are doing crate training). Every minute you spend together is bonding/training time. Plus, the more time you spend with your dog means the better you know her.

PunditLisa makes a good point about socialization. Take your dog everywhere you can. (You need to tell us: City? Country? Where do you and the new hound live? How old are you? Rent? Own? Got friends with dogs?)

My malamute Bob was recognized within a 600 mile radius by hotels, bar patrons, friends, people on the street, etc. I am working with a new (to me) dog who didn’t have much socialization so I have been taking her to bars (we’re in Montana), hotels, stores (PetSmart invites this), friends homes, tying her to a parking meter while I walk into stores, fishing, rafting, every chance I get to get her out around other people and dogs.

Do the off-leash training as well as the on-leash (do the on-leash first!). FYI - This is one of the Great Debates of dog owners.

You asked for stories and I haven’t seen any yet so here’s one about the fun of having a well socialized dog:

Bob (my malamute) was on a road trip with a couple of friends and I. We stopped off at this middle of nowhere bar/cafe on our way to wherever. The waitress/cook/bartender saw Bob sitting on the toolbox of my truck and told me to bring Bob in. “Never upset the bartender.” is one of my mottos, so I did.

Bob wandered around the bar, met all the regulars, had a couple of pieces of jerky. When the waitress/etc. went to back into the kitchen to cook our burgers, Bob started to follow her. I said, “Bob, NO.” and he backed up and sat down outside the kitchen. The waitress/bartender/etc. would step out of the kitchen every minute or so and give Bob a scrap or piece of food (with permission).

A drunk came in with an accordian, sat down and started to play, badly. The cook/waitress/etc. came storming out of the kitchen and threw/cussed the accordian playing drunk out of the bar. On her way back she stopped by Bob and said, “Honey, did that scare you?”, then came out of the kitchen and gave Bob a T-bone steak.

As we sat there for the next hour, ate our burgers and drank, the accordian drunk would stagger in, the bartender/waitress/cook would throw the drunk out and be nice to Bob. He ended up sitting behind the bar and everyone who came in had to meet him and buy him a piece of jerky (until I called a halt to the food).

I stopped in a couple of months later and the first thing the bartender/waitress/cook said was, 'Hey, where’s Bob?"

The moral of the story is, “If you have a well trained dog, you don’t have to listen to accordian music.”

:stuck_out_tongue:

I wouldn’t advise off leash training unless in an enclosed area. And when your dog is out in public, it should never be off leash.

That’s the truth, but I would never trade my malamute for the world. She does good. She’s house broke, learned how to sit, we’re kinda in/out on coming, the wrost thing about her is she gets a tad active when we have a visitor.

Whistlepig, I am a bit concerned about her being “interesting” (hyper)…she’s a damned
smart dog, and I’m trying to keep her as busy and happy as possible. I spend every
waking moment with her, and she is definitely a joy in my life. I’ve had her 5 days now,
and I can’t imagine her not being here. Bob sounds like an absolute sweetie.

PunditLisa:I’m trying to socialize her as much as possible. I’m a bit worried about
walking her off-leash…I have visions of her running off into traffic. God, just the
THOUGHT of it scares me. I’d love to have her off-leash for camping though…I hope it’s
possible. In the yard, she doesnt always come, but when I walk her outside the yard,
she seems to stick to me like glue. She stays so close that I often step an her by accident.

The “tired puppy is a happy puppy” philosophy definitely applies with her. If I wear her
out with a walk and a frisky game of fetch, she is much happier and a lot less active indoors.
She’s practically housetrained already. I’ve been following advice I’ve gotten…ignore
accidents and praise her like crazy when she does well. It seems to be working
wonders in conjunction with the crate training.

I think I may take her to puppy school after all though…not so much for her, but for me.
I’m used to cats, and communication with a dog is and entirely new thing for me. I’m thoroughly enjoying this, though, and it’s great exercise for me.

No, no, no! (OK, it’s really not that big a deal.) Camping with your dog off leash is asking for trouble. Too much is going on. You never know when a squirrel (or a kid) will run through your campsite. All the new and weird sights and smells can be too much temptation for the best trained dog. And most parks have leash laws.

There’s nothing worse (actually there’s a bunch of things worse, but this is pretty bad) than hiking along, minding you own business, and a dog comes around the bend and slams into you. Or, God forbid, growls at you. (Dogs don’t growl at me twice.) (“Oh, ha-ha, Spike is just being friendly. He won’t hurt you.”)

Lucy is a great camper and a wonderful trail dog, but she’s always restrained. A long leash in camp. (She can’t leave the site) And a 6 footer on the trails. (She’s also a Jack Russell and a bit of a spaz. Not “hyper”, just “excitable”. Really not the same thing.)

All that (^) of course is for public lands. If you camp on private land, do what you want. If you camp with a dog off lead, hopefully you want to run through the woods calling your dog. (And lots and lots of people camp with their dogs and never have any problems. These people are the exceptions. Or they just don’t notice (or care) what trouble their dogs cause.)

Having you dog trained for Off Lead is really a great idea, though. Just somewhere safe. (Like Cyndar said.)
(Sorry to jump on you like that Spydergirl. Through no fault of your own, you hit one of my (many) hot buttons. You’ll do fine with your dog.)
-Rue.

You’ll hear it a thousand times, but here’s to a thousand and one: keep in mind that what’s cute in a puppy can be annoying in a full grown dog. I have a friend whose dog growls horribly at anyone who walks in the door, to the point that I (who am rarely frightened by dogs) am worried to be in the room. I suspect when this dog was tiny that this behavior was dismissed as funny and cute. Not so cute now. Of course this is extreme, but there’s also jumping up and barking excitedly when you arrive home (both of which, ahem, I was guilty of allowing when pup was cute and cuddly and 8 lbs.), again, not so cute now.

As to crate training, I thought it was barbaric and mean until the incessant chewing of the little one got me to the point I had no choice. Now I realize that it’s his safe place. He doesn’t have to answer to anyone when he’s in there. Hmmm. Might have to get in there myself when I get home tonight.

Finally (as she climbs up on her soapbox), when you take on a pet, you’ve taken on a responsibility for possibly nearly the next 20 years of your life. As long as your dog is alive you will have to make decisions about where to live, how late to stay out, and what vacation you will take based on the dog’s need for a safe, comfortable, loving environment. It’s a big commitment, but one that many of us joyfully make. I guess I’m just saying that there are too many unwanted domesticated animals (dogs, cats, ferrets, you name it), because someone decided the responsibility was too great or they couldn’t be bothered with altering the animal, or they felt it was cruel to alter the animal. So spay or neuter, and be responsible for a home for your pet if you become unable to provide one. (Sometimes I think some people should’ve had Godparents for their pets too!)

Anyway (climbing back down), how wonderful and exciting, Spydergirl, and I wish you many happy years together! It’s awfully terrific to have someone in your life that loves you that wonderfully and completely.

Off-leash training is very good for dogs because there will probably be times when the dog gets off his leash for some reason. I wouldn’t do it where there was traffic and a lot of distractions, though. I have a soccer field connected to a nature preserve in my backyard which are the perfect places. The key to training off-leash is to have a sure-fire method of getting them back. Puppies will usually stick close anyway, but I always have my box of BilJack treats with me. All it takes is a few shakes of the box to get Buddy to stop in his tracks and come running.

We have always taken our dogs camping and they’ve never been leashed. However, we go to privately owned farms to camp…and I’ve never had any of my dogs run off. I would have to REALLY trust the dog to stay with you AND to not menace other campers to let her go without a leash at a public campground, though.

Good luck. I’m jealous about your dog almost being housebroken. After 2 months of CONSTANTLY praising Buddy the Amazing Beagle, he STILL pees on occasion.

Cyndar:
Good point about doing off-leash training only in an enclosed area. Another place to check to do off-leash training would be baseball fields - anywhere that has too high of a fence for your dog to jump and has only one entrance. Always, always, always, reward coming back to you with a treat and hugs. Even if you want to lose your cool because she didn’t come back exactly when you wanted. When you’re dog comes back, they think, “I came back!”, not “I didn’t come back on the 1st, 2nd, 3rd call; therefore I should be punished.”

Spydergirl_87:
I wouldn’t do off-leash training yet. You two are too new to each other to expect her to come back because you said so. Just work on the short leash behavior - it will provide you with many more training opportunities (Sit, Stay, Come).

After you get to know each other better, start working with a longer leash. You can get the retractable leashes, a cheaper alternative is to get 20 feet of cord with a carabiner at each end. As you walk, feed the cord out, then tell her what you want her to do. The leash can reinforce “Come”, because she can be 20 feet away and you can still make her come to you.

Don’t be too concerned about her being “interesting” or “high energy”. It means more work on your part, but you will have a better dog than an un-interesting or low energy dog.

You’ve opened a great thread, and I hope we are all of help. Please do tell us if you live in a city, a town, where you go to walk, or anything we can do to help. I’ve private posted with a couple of the respondents and you have some great resources here. And we all want to help.

Whistlepig

Buddy the Amazing Beagle. Oh, there you go. Beagles are notoriously slow housebreakers. If you got Bud-man at two months and it’s been two months, you have about… oh, let’s be conservative here… 5 more months to go. (So to speak.) Maybe not till he’s a year old.

Or he could be reliably housebroken next week. You never can tell.

-Rue.

PunditLisa, that post was supposed to reasure you that Bubby’s doing about average for a Beagle. For any puppy really. (Spazmo-Dog Lucy took a real long time to housebreak.)
-Rue. (who really thinks Buddy should be named “Lox” or “Philadelphia”) (Beagle/bagel… it’s like a joke, only less funny)

I live in the city, in smallish house with a HUGE fenced yard. I walk around the neighborhood streets, so she’ll have to be on the leash. As for off-leash while camping, that’s going to be a wait-and-see type of thing. If she sticks close, no problem, but if she doesn’t,I’m going to tie her up.

One couple that we go camping with has a wandering dog. It’s not uncommon to notice him missing, and he’s at the next campsite visiting. Once, he was gone over an hour. It was me that went looking for him. (he was at a campsite at the far end of the campground, gleefully making new friends and mooching food.) His owners weren’t concerned at all…“he always comes back eventually”. That seriously bugs me.

Actually, I just got home from the emergency vet clinic. The puppy stepped or pounced on a sleeping cat’s tail, and kitty spun around swatted the dog. Right on the eye. It happened so fast, I had no time to intervene. She’ll be fine, she has a scratch on her cornea, and the vet said not to be terrribly concerned. I’m putting ointment in her eye every 6 hours for the next week. She slept through practically the entire vet experience.

Arrrrrgh I hope they start getting along soon. The cat is fine until Pepper gets within about 2 feet of her, then the growling starts. They’re never together unsupervised, and I just turned my head for a second…yargh! Poor pup!