Don't we have an obligation as a society to look at ways to ban violent computer shooter games?

Great Debates
141

Well, actually, I think it’s entirely possible, yes. He accessed guns that are legal in the USA but quite illegal, say, in Canada. They were accessible to him solely because a family member had purchased them legally, and for reasons we will never know, left them accessible to a son she knew had mental problems.

Had those weapons not been legal, it is entirely possible Nancy Lanza would not have bothered to acquire them, and Adam Lanza, who would then not have been living in a house with an arsenal of firearms, might not have seen these easily accessible weapons as a means to his bizarre end.

Of course, it’s possible Adam Lanza would have gone to the trouble of acquiring the weapons himself, and had be been successful, we might be in the same situation. It is theoretically possible he might have found some other way to kill people. But I think it very likely that the simple availability and proximity of the weapons was a part of his decision making process, and that had they not been there, the awful switch in his mind that went to “murder” might not have flipped, or had it done so, his actions would not have killed as many people. Perhaps had he had access to nothing more than a knife, he would only have killed his mother, an awful thing but only 1/27th as awful as what happened. We’ll never know for sure, but it sure seems like a possibility. I mean, I think it is pretty well understood by now that when you have a hammer, things start to look like a nail. It’s human nature to frame the solution to problems in terms of the tools at hand.

Whatever you think the relative possibilities are in the Newtown case, it seems obvious to me that if you multiply them across the thousands of gun murders in the United States that at least some would not have happened had the weapons in question been harder to obtain.

It certainly is interesting that Americans have more guns than almost any other First World country and shoot each other more than almost any other First World country. It seems exceedingly coincidental, if there is no connection there.

I don’t know what the solution is, truth be told. I don’t know why Americans are so prone to shooting each other, to such a bizarre degree. Four times likelier than Canadians, I believe, despite being in so many other ways so similar to us. I so fervently wish you find a way to fix it. I love the USA, and want the best for you.

142

He did make some inquiries about buying his own guns, but he wasn’t allowed to buy them because he didn’t want to undergo a background check or abide by the mandatory waiting period. I’m not sure which of those things (or both) was the problem, but either way he decided he didn’t want to go through the legal hassle when he could get plenty of weaponry at home.

143

Gandhi. Because he’s armed with nuclear weapons!!

144

You joke, but seriously though. Gandhi *is *a massive tool. We’re all agreed on this, right ? Cultural victory in the Renaissance on an isolated island [SIZE=1]jer[SIZE=1]k-o[SIZE=1]ff[/SIZE][/SIZE][/SIZE]…

145

Oh, yes.

146

If you outlaw violent video games, only outlaws will have violent video games. And you’ll wish you had a violent video game when you get robbed at violent video game point

147

Gamestop reported a spike in sales on 11-13-12. Wonder what that was about.

148

He did parody my thread title.

Though not very well since I never used the word “ban” in mine.

149

After the Dunblane school massacre in the UK (1996), handguns were made illegal. We have not had another school shooting since.

We play just as many violent video games, watch just as many violent movies and listen to just as much violent music as the USA does.

Banning violent video games isn’t going to make violent people any less violent. Of course psychotic people are going to seek out these games. I wouldn’t be surprised if they were all gamers nowadays. You’ve just got your cause and effect the wrong way round.

Two proposed solutions then,

  1. Universal Health Care. Specifically free psychiatric care to spot individuals who are potentially dangerous and treat them.
  2. Make guns harder for people to get hold of.

Sure, criminals are still going to get hold of guns. But none of these killers were criminals prior to the shootings. If they didn’t have such ease of access to these weapons these events would never have happened.

150

There are a LOT of violent shooter games in Asia and yet, we don’t see mass shootings like Sandy Hook in Asia.

Interestingly, on the same day as the Sandy Hook massacre, a similar event occured in China. A man attacked 23 children at an elementary school but since there weren’t any guns to be had, he used a knife. All 23 kids survived but some lost fingers and ears because knives just aren’t as good at killing little kids as guns are.

I think they subdued the guy with broom handles and sticks.

151

Obviously in China the kids all play First Person Knifer games…

152

Indeed.

See the chart on this page.

As someone mentioned earlier it is often claimed that porn increases rape which is akin to games increase violence.

While correlation is not causation we see that both rape and violent crimes have been trending down for the past 20 years or so.

Again, correlation is not causation but IF porn and violent games spur people to commit crimes (rape/violent crime) then the people opposed to them need to show this is the case. That rape/violent crime have been on the decrease suggests video games and porn are not to blame. That or they need to show that some other mechanism has been dramatically reducing violent crimes and the numbers would be even lower if not for porn/video games which give an upward push to crime.

When you consider the HUGE prevalence and consumption of video games and porn (and other media such as movies) it is difficult to point to them as the cause of violence in our society. Hell, look at other countries such as Canada who are similar to the US in their consumption of these products (funny Tweet I saw on this). They do not suffer the same violence we do…not even close.

In short, the problem lies elsewhere. Complex problems generally have complex solutions. Simple scapegoats will not solve anything.

153

Maybe we should be blaming this guy for the incident in China.

154

Only cuz this is how it works in Call of Duty games (NRA should take note).

155

Well, I play Skyrim a lot; so I suppose sooner or later I’m going to strap on a horned helmet and shout at people.

156

60 years ago? Comic books? Puh-leeze, I like to drag out the show stopper for these discussions.

“The effects of ‘The Beggar’s Opera’ on the minds of the people’s have fulfilled the prognostications of many that it would prove injurious to society. Rapine and violence have been gradually increasing ever since its first representation[…] young men, clerks in offices, and others, disdaining the arts of honest industry, and captivated with the charms and idleness of criminal pleasure[…] and men of discernment, who have been at the pains of tracing this evil to its source, have found that not a few of those[…] have in the course of their pursuits been emulous to imitate the manners and general character of Macheath.” – John Hawkins. In the year 1776. About an opera.

Blaming the world’s problems on entertainment is not new, and basically never pans out. You could argue that entertainment is a reflection on the society that created it, which makes all the violence a somewhat disturbing commentary on our society. But I don’t think there’s much of a feedback loop back in the other direction. If there is, the feedback loop is more likely people playing them and working to change society than it is reinforcing what created it.

No, you’ll probably just take an arrow to the knee.

D&R

157

Might have yes,but the guy was such a nut I’d rather get shot than have a guy do something alittle more nefarious say, like say pouring few gal’s gas down the theater’s slant & lighting it.
If he really wanted to kill,not owning a gun might not have helped.Maybe he would’ve pulled a Kleibold and planned for a yr. The whole argument of banning is null cuz we been talkin’ bout it since B4 that mentally ill Laurie Dann scool shooting.That was in EARLY 80’s.

158

Hundreds of millions of firearms have been sold in the US… etc.

It’s hard to kill lots of people quickly with a sword… etc. :smiley:

159

This is very silly. It probably would have also killed fewer people because nobody would have sat there while he poured gasoline all around the movie theater.

Meaning he’d plan for a year and still use a gun.

160

Naturally, but I’m saying the glamour of violence itself is really nothing new.

It’s gun violence these days because that’s what modern folks by and large do their violence with. If cops and robbers, soldiers and rebels, jealous husbands and avenging ex-cop vigilantes who don’t take shit from nobody still settled their scores with sabers, that’s what would be on TV - it sure was what was on Ye Olde Minfstrels’ set list and on the theatre stages. Hell, swords still have a truckload of glamour to them if’n you ask me.
And when they settle their scores with handheld plasma railguns or particle disruptors, that’s what will be on holovid. Nothing new under the Sun.

[QUOTE=Gray Ghost]
Haven’t played it, but isn’t there a level in one of the Modern Call of Duty games where you have to join in a massacre of civilians at a (Russian, IIRC) airport? The game does allow you the option of skipping the level, and your character doesn’t survive it. I’d guess that was somewhat similar, but I’m really grasping at straws here.
[/QUOTE]

I’d missed that one the first time around: you’re actually not required to take part in the massacre in the infamous No Russian level. I mean, you’ll always be there, but nothing whatsoever compels the player to shoot. You don’t get penalized if you don’t, the terrorists your character is trying to fool don’t react or turn on you if you don’t, etc… ; and you don’t get anything *for *shooting civilians either.

The level itself was also very much regarded as a bullshit shock stunt by the majority of gamers I know, for what it’s worth.