Dune Part 2 [Open Spoilers]

I don’t know how much of this was knowledge I imported from the books vs knowledge that was in the movie directly but the world that Paul is raised up in is one where the stakes of controlling your emotions is a constant life or death struggle of politics and from a young age, he’s received the best training in the world on how to deploy his emotions for strategic purposes. The hunter-seeker scene from the first movie showed the stakes of Paul using his training to stay calm and think strategically where the consequence of a mistake was literally his life.

From that lens, I thought Chalamet did a great job in conveying both his internal psychology and also how even such training can break down when faced with the extreme circumstances he was under. I found his acting subtle but perfectly legible in giving a sense of what his internal psychology was and why he did the things he did to accomplish specific aims.

I can see though, how without this understanding, his acting can appear wooden and inexpressive but I think that’s what makes the character/acting so great that you really have to hunt to find those emotions inside of him.

Right. Paul is the product of 10,000 years of eugenics intented to produce a literal superman, he’s been raised from birth with the understanding that he’ll one day be the leader of one of the most powerful houses in the galaxy, and he’s had Mentat training on top of that. (I don’t think they even said the word “Mentat” once in either movie, and they completely cut Thufir Hawat from the second film, which is a downright shame.) He’s not your average teen.

I’d say the gom jabbar scene also counts. Chalamet does a great job with his body language there, and the defiant stare he gives Reverend Mother Mohiam is golden.

Yeah, I understand that he is great at suppressing his emotions. What I am saying is that in order to suppress emotions, there have to be emotions there in the first place. I didn’t get any emotions there in the first place.

Playing a character who is emotionally flat is no different from playing a character in a flat manner. In order to make the performance work, you have to put layers in it. I just didn’t get the layers.

I saw Part 2 today.

General impression is I liked it and thought it was well done, and a good fit to Part 1.

Small changes that didn’t really matter:

The reason Paul drank the Water of Life. In the book it’s because he doesn’t foresee the attack on Lady Jessica by a trusted servant. In Lynch’s movie it’s something else. This movie has it be a Harkonnen attack on the Seitch. Ok, in all cases he felt the future murky and needed to see.

Status of what is a Fedaykin. In the book they are a special guard to escort and safekeep Muad’dib. They are his chosen guard. Lynch had roughly that. Here, Fedaykin are just the name of Fremen warriors.

The duel scene and plot with the non-drugged Atreides warrior. In the book, the plot is Hawat’s plan within a plan that is from Feyd to fake the assassinating attempt and gain power over his uncle. Here it’s the Baron’s plan to give Feyd a real display of ability and build the legend of his intended heir.

It appears that the Fremen culture is more sexual equal, such that Chani is a Fedaykin, and some of the seitch leaders (Naibs) are women. This doesn’t match the text of the book, but Herbert does characterize his Fremen culture as supposedly more egalitarian than galactic society, and the women are described as just as fierce. So this feels like a more faithful depiction of the stated ideal.

Gurney gets to kill The Beast Rabban. So he gets his revenge, unlike the book.

Sandworms ride lower in the sand. Given that we’re not really privileged to the mechanism of motion, that isn’t wrong, but doesn’t match Herbert’s descriptions as well.

Somewhat more significant changes:

The timeline is compressed. The book has Paul’s training as a Fremen and training the troops, then begin the all-out assault on Spice production takes 2 years. Here, it plays out in less than 9 months. This has the effect of making the timetable feel to short.

It also means Alia is only a fetus, and so plays no role in the confrontation with the Baron. Different from the book, but for this movie it works well enough, perhaps better since we’re not given a precocious toddler.

There are two subpopulations of Femen. The southerners are the religious faithful while the northerners are the skeptics. Stilgar is somehow a southerner in charge of a northern seitch.

This is why Chani and her friends are more skeptical of Paul and challenging of the deferral to myth.

Feyd is given control of Arrakis sooner. This puts him in control of the planet when the Emperor comes knocking. I rather liked the Lynch version where the Baron gets his heads up about how much danger he’s in when he floats into the chamber to meet the Emperor and sees his nephew’s severed head.

Mounting the sandworm and taking control is depicted differently. Paul does use the Maker Hooks to open the sandworm’s ring segment leading edges and thus keep the worm on the surface and control direction. The top-down approach, while looking flashier, is less consistent with the book description, and frankly doesn’t work as well for me. He should just use the hooks to mount.

However some of that is that these worms move much faster and don’t slow down when taking the thumpers. It is much harder to catch and keep up with these from the ground.

This method also makes palequins different than my imagination. Also harder to use. It’s easier for me to see carrying them alongside and raising them by ropes.

Paul’s water of life transformation… in the book Paul sneaks off and takes a drop on his own and falls into a death trance, and it’s a couple of weeks before Chani arrives to help figure out what happened. Lynch did his desert scene with the worms as a second attempt after his first version was too long. That scene encapsulated several scenes he originally scripted.

What I didn’t like about this version was how Chani’s tears were a part of waking Paul. I the book she realizes he took too small amount of the WOL, something foreshadowed during Jessica’s scene. Now somehow she’s part of the prophecy?

I did like the way they incorporated elements depicting the religious manipulation. That is a strong one of Herbert’s themes, so I enjoyed seeing it depicted. How events were characterized and interpreted to fit the prophesy was textbook.

I enjoyed that there was more depiction of the Emperor and his interactions with the Princess, the one he was grooming to replace him. And showing her questioning had more to do with the Syfy version than anything else, but I liked that showing Irulan as smart.

The final confrontations are where things are a little off to me.

I do appreciate when Paul and the fremen penetrate the Emperor’s throneroom, and the Sardaukar march of into the breach, and then Paul and the fremen enter as of nothing happened. So much for the elite troops.

Similarly when he commands the guests be brought to the main hall and kill the Sardaukar. He didn’t offer them the opportunity to surrender, just had them dispatched as of nothing. Probably right in front of the Emperor, to prove a point about how easy it was.

The fight with Feyd was great, except the part they stole from Serenity and Paul ending up with two major stab wounds. I hope antibiotics don’t violate the sanctions on technology.

But what annoyed me most was Paul surprising Chani with announcing taking Irulan as his wife, as well as Chani’s reaction.

In the book, Paul was explicitly making a play for the throne via marriage, and Chani knew that. Not only that, Paul made clear to Chani that the marriage was political only, that Irulan would never have his love or even his touch, and that Chani would be the mother of his children.

Plus, Paul came from the aristocrat society where political marriage was expected. Witness his own parents.

But Chani came from the Fremen world, where in the book men tended to die alot in duels as well as combat, so there society was comfortable with polygamy. Paul even had the choice of taking Harrah, Jamis’s widow, as a wife. And she ultimately became Stlgar’s fourth wife, sharing with others.

So the idea of Paul having a formal Wife for his Empire and a dual wife arrangement on the fremen side should have been well understood by Chani. I suppose the idea of her accepting polygamy or a secondary official role was less comfortable for Villeneuve.

I did, however, appreciate how Paul had an active role in kicking off the Jihad. The book doesn’t really explain other than religious fanatics take off and Paul can’t stop it. This movie shows the Great Houses refusing to accept Paul’s victory, thus he has to send his troops out to subdue and passify them to unify his rule. That’s a great extra. He fought so hard to avoid it to then have to trigger it anyway.

As for the Great White Savior, Herbert was deliberately subverting the concept himself. Yes, Paul is the Chosen One, but he uses prophecy and manipulation, and moreso Jessica does, as a means for not just his survival, but revenge and ultimately the Emperorship.

And the Bene Gesserit don’t get what they were hoping for in their Kwizatz Hadderack, as Paul can see where they cannot look, but he is not their puppet, not even sympathetic to them. He won’t bow to them, won’t serve their desires, and even withholds his genes from their control.

And the galaxy gets a bloody holy war that destroys lives by the billions. Yeah, be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.

Anyway, that’s my take.

Poison seems the greater risk, given their universe. Not enough to affect a battle, but maybe to kill him later. Though I suppose Paul can transmute any poison at that point, not just the Water of Life.

Here’s from the man, himself. It’s “HARK-onnen.” “Benny jesserit.” The weirdest one is “Chain-ee.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-DD6s5uiFM&

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX8WDrltM2I&

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HS5bvNau7k&

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX8WDrltM2I&

You think that fight—or any fight involving Feyd—was for the benefit of the audience?

I think you’ve got it backwards: the audience is there for the benefit of the fighter (Feyd) to amplify his own sense of importance. He doesn’t give two shirts if they can see what is going on, as long as they cheer for him.

From what I’ve read, Villeneuve decided early on that filming on location in the Jordanian desert with an actual toddler would have been a logistical nightmare, thus the compression of the timeline and the removal of Alia and Leto II the Elder. That’s probably also why he doesn’t intend to film Children of Dune.

To be fair, isn’t the holy war and all its carnage the only path Paul and Leto II see as the way to save humanity?

In other words, as bad as the holy war is, the alternatives are worse than that.

Why was the audience there, though? Typically, bread-and-circuses routines are there to make the audience happy and less likely to revolt. But maybe not if the seating sucks.

We might imagine that the Harkonnens simply execute anyone with insufficient enthusiasm here, so anyone with a ticket is obligated to show up. But it seems a bit wasteful.

Only a wag, but, again, I’d say because it makes the little lord feel like a big man to have them there. Why does there need to be anymore reason to it than that.

All creatures will make merry… under pain of death.

We don’t see one but is there some reason they can’t have a JumboTron showing the action?

I know they can’t have thinking machines but a JumboTron is not one of those.

Personally, I think it is. Maybe it’s the Lynch influence here, but I think they should have been much lower-tech feeling than they were. I didn’t like the Harkonnen holographic tactical display, either. A computer doing a million operations/second isn’t nearly enough for an AI, but at the same time you don’t need Mentats if you have one. Or at least their training doesn’t have to involve calculations. I think they stay much farther away from the fuzzy line than what they showed (outside of Ix, at least).

Incidentally, one of the highest-attended pro wrestling shows in history was held in Pyongyang and attendance was compulsory.

I assumed the chanting guys surrounding the display were meant to be Mentats doing rapid-fire calculations to run the projection.

Right. Because prescience is binding on the future, Paul and Leto’s visions have doomed humanity to go extinct when the terraforming of Arrakis kills off the sandworms / be annihilated by the Thinking Machines that escaped to the edges of known space during the Butlerian Jihad unless one of them becomes the God-Emperor and guides humanity for thousands of years along a path that will lead them to scatter en masse across the universe and thus become too spread out to ever fully be eradicated (and to produce people and technology that are invisible to prescients thus making their future truly unforeseeable.)

Hmm. Maybe. There should have been a zillion levers and dials and things to control the display, though. Maybe they had those, though–I don’t recall.

Doesn’t that imply Paul could solve the problem by killing himself (before he gets on that path and has Leto II)? I think he would if he thought it would solve that problem.

(It’s been a long time since I read the books.)

To be honest, the biggest pet peeve I had with the movies is that the stillsuits don’t have hoods. I know it’s because Hollywood demands that the actors’ faces be visible at all times, but a stillsuit without a hood is going to be about as effective as a condom with the tip snipped off - you’re going to lose so much moisture via sweat and exhalation that you might as well not bother and just wear baggy robes to keep cool like Bedouins and other desert nomads do.

Stillsuits wouldn’t work anyway, so what’s more magic on top of the magic tech?

When Paul first starts having preescient episides, he has no control over them. As he becomes more spice infused, he begins to see alternative outcomes. But some paths are murky and have gaps he cannot see.

This is when he starts to see the possibility of the Jihad, and keeps looking for ways to prevent it. After becoming the Kwizatz Haderack, he has much greater preescience, but still can’t see everything. But his actions lock him into the path because of the religious fanaticism that the Jihad becomes the least horrifying path and is unavoidable by the time he has his duel with Feyd. The war will spread in his name even if he dies.

Paul remains committed to trying to find the best (least horrifying) outcome he can, but the political machinations drive a particular outcome.

Leto II sees what he calls “The Golden Path” requires transforming into the God Emperor in order to successfully control humanity long enough to effect the outcome for humanity’s ultimate survival. It’s later revealed that Paul saw that option and it was too horrific to him. But Leto takes one for the team and makes the sacrifice.

Understand that Herbert presents that war is coming because humanity has been stagnating, and nature only has one way to really stir up the genre pool - war. The social structure of the galaxy is broken, but hasn’t stopped grinding its gears yet.

Paul doesn’t want the death and destruction, but is powerless to prevent it. And it is the least horrific that he can manage - all other outcomes are worse.

Dune Messiah is about how Fremen culture is being destroyed by their own success. Transforming Arrakis and getting out from under the Harkonnens and Shaddam puts them in the seat of being the oppressors. And the strict discipline and other culture elements are being destroyed by the reduction in water strictness.

Children of Dune extends that further and shows how Alia has been corrupted and the religion of Muad’dib is corrupt and needs to be destroyed.