My point is that there are legitimate reasons some people cannot lose weight, but the majority of people can, and it wont be an accident. Saying because you, with a medical condition, cannot lose weight, and others with a medical conditon cannot, means that anybody that is obese shouldn’t even try is not truthful. Some heavy person with no medical condition keeping the weight on, other than lack of exercise and poor eating habits is going to read this post and go “oh, well, no point in exercising, it wont work”, maybe I have this condition too.
The truth is still the same as far as I am concerned. There is a small percent of obese people that have legitamate conditions that cause normal methods of weight loss to not work. (8% by your figures), and the rest of the 92% of obese people that have no medical conditions that can lose weight by regular exercise and diet. Studies that don’t exist withstanding, keeping it off is as simple as sticking with the diet and exercise routine. Again, for the normal person, I think you have proven that your situation differs, but that does not mean it holds true for every obese person. Especially if they do not have a similar condition.
I’ve been reading along silently, enjoying the civility of this debate. But one of the points that (if I’m getting this right) some are forgetting is that slackergirl is (I think) referring to the MORBIDLY OBESE.
There is a big difference between losing 50 pounds and losing 150 pounds. Mentally and physically. Do you know how overwhelming it is to know that you need to lose half of your body weight? Or the equivalent of another adult?
I work for Weight Watchers part time. And we see all ranges of people - people who need to lose 10 pounds, people who need to lose 100. And so many times I see the people with tremendous amounts of weight to lose fail. I obviously don’t know anything about them, so I cannot say for certain why they fail. But it is rare in the WW community to see someone at their goal who can say “I lost 100+ pounds!” And let me tell you, when you find someone like that, the wow feeling that you get is tremendous.
So when we talk about generalizations, and about eating less and moving more, that’s okay for the “overweight” folks. But I think what slackergirl is trying to educate us on is that the morbidly obese (whether they got their via medical problems, or whether their medical problems stem from their obesity doesn’t matter) are not often that successful in their weight loss endeavors. And if that community would realize that, well, then, when they drop out of Weight Watchers or gain back the weight they lost at Jenny Craig maybe they wouldn’t feel like such incompetent boobs.
I’d just like to add that you have all brought up some really interesting points and information. slackergirl, you seem to be real educated on some of this stuff - thanks for trying to spread the wealth.
Wow, I can’t read all the posts before I have to spit out a response.
The United States is FAT!!! You can’t blame it on this and that and say whaa, whaa, whaa. It is all BULLSHIT! You are only fat because you choose to be!
Anyone who disagees needs to visit a poorer country than theirs. Realization never hit me until I traveled in the spring to Bulgaria. I’ve been all over Eastern Europe, but Bulgaria was an awakening. I spent 10 days there seeing the sights around Sofia and I saw 1 (that’s ONE) person that was over 200 lbs. The financial postition of Bulgarians combined with the availabilty of meat (other than pork) nearly makes it impossible to put on weight. They also have very few cars and people are FORCED to walk most places. My Bulgarian 5’6" wife maybe weighs 105 lbs.
We are fat (myself included) because of the availability and low cost of FOOD and the ease of getting from point A to point B without a bit of physical activity. Admit it, we are a lazy country that eats entirely too much food. No more bullshit excuses.
Epimetheus, you’re both kind of right. My experience (obviously) is with morbid obesity. The depth of problems that exist when a person starts to gain weight increases right along with those pounds. All of the issues mentioned here are at their worst in the morbidly obese.
However, you’ll notice I didn’t say “the vast majority can’t lose weight,” I said that the vast majority who have tried (morbidly obese, or not) have failed over the long term. I said “the vast majority of us won’t ever get there either.”
from Losing It: False Hopes and Fat Profits in the Diet Industry by Laura Fraser (1997)
Just because it’s theoretically possible for most people to lose weight and keep it off for life, doesn’t mean they will. In case you haven’t noticed the problem is getting worse by the year. Almost all of those chubby kids that are in grade schools right now are going to grow up to be obese adults, and they are going to be miserable when they can’t overcome it.
Telling anybody to keep trying the same thing over and over without making it clear that most of the peers can’t do it either is cruel. It doesn’t matter how much they need to lose.
You’ll also notice that I didn’t say “anybody that is obese shouldn’t even try.” I said that they should try a couple of times, to see if they are in that category who are successful.
I don’t particularly care why most people fail any longer. It is a clinical problem to be worked out, and I hope they do, but people do fail all the time.
Going back to my original challenge, can you find a long term study in which the vast majority of the participants lost weight and kept it off?
Is 75% enough to call them a “vast majority?” 85%?
If they fail, and gain back the weight, it is not because the program is flawed, that is my point. It is a person’s problem that needs to be worked out. Commitment is compromised, not exercise in general.
The flaw is in society. I think it would be safe to say that the sheer percentage of overweight people in Amercia has never been seen before in history. The flaw is not in exercise or proper nutrition.
The only sure way to fix it is to prevent it. And that is not going to happen.
We are going to be a very large future America, untill the magic pill comes out, or the miracle surgery is discovered.
The magical surgery has already been discovered, and more and more people are flocking to it, unfortunately. It’s one thing when a 400 pound man on the brink of death has his guts rewired to save his life, quite another when a woman who has 60 extra mid-life pounds does it.
I notice that everyone seems to be talking about weight loss as a continuous process–you start at your initial weight and keep losing until you’re thin, with no breaks in routine. But what about a program where a person loses some amount of weight, maintains their new weight for a while (not sure what the criteria would be), and then repeats the process? Could that be more effective for the morbidly obese?
ultrafilter, I think that’s a pretty viable option, perhaps.
If you’ve got a long way to go, taking some breaks now and again could help mentally. Plus, you also learn the art of maintaining, which is equally as important as losing the weight in the first place.
For me, weightloss is something that I will be focusing on for the rest of my life. Sure, I’ve got the weight off now, but the skills I learned then will be with me for many years to come. So you don’t lose all the weight at once, big whoop. Maintaining at a lower than initial weight for a couple of months and then restarting has got to be better than going all out, then giving up and gaining weight back.
Perhaps what needs to be focused on is the long-term aspects of weight loss/health improvement. If you figure you’ve got to keep up the healthy stuff for 40+ years (or whatever, depending upon your age), then you know that patience needs to be had. Maybe that would help mentally.
I think what many of us are realizing is that there really needs to be a mindset shift. What is “success”, what is a “healthy lifestyle”, all of that. We need to quit being perfectionists and realize that when we screw up that it’s because we’re simply human. We just need to stand back up and try something else. But to always keep trying and never give up.
