Just as a point of comparison:
BudMillerCoors - 10 IBUs
Shiner Bock - 15 IBUs
Sam Adams - 25 IBUs
Pilsner Urquell - 28 IBUs
Sierra Nevada Pale Ale - 37 IBUs
Stone IPA - 77 IBUs
Stone Ruination - 100+
Stone Arrogant Bastard - Classified
I have Sam Adams in the fridge right now as a dinner beer. But what’s in my hand is a Chamberlain Pale from Shipyard Brewing of Portland, Maine. Runs about 30 IBUs.
Yeah, that pretty much confirms my suspicions. I’ve always thought Urquell had a more pronounced hop character than Sam Adams, but neither beers are ones I would ever describe as hoppy to anyone. Sierra Nevada Pale Ale is around where my hoppiness descriptor starts.
Yeah. This beer I’m holding I would describe as “mildly hoppy.” If you want a hoppy Sam Adams, try their new Hallertau Imperial Pilsner. That shit’s intense.
I’ve had it. I like hops a lot. (Stone Ruination, Three Floyds Dreadnaught, and Goose Island Imperial IPA are among my favorite beers.)I don’t like that much hoppiness in my pilsner. Even Victory’s PrimaPils, which is a hopped-up pilsener, although much more sensibly hopped than the Imperial Pilsener, is too much outside my stylistic guidelines for pilsener to enjoy. I don’t actively dislike it, I just don’t think it’s a great example of the pilsener style. Imperial Pilseners, though, are simply not my bag.
With you there, bro. The 3 remaining bottles of the stuff are likely to sit at the back of the beer fridge until I can foist them off on somebody or I finally pour them out. The problem is that there just isn’t enough malt to even remotely balance that amount of hops. Even for an Imperial Pilsner.
Come now, how hoppy can one beer be? I’m going to have to seek this stuff out, as I’m a dyed in the wool IPA fan and consume my fair share of McEwans (but never the scotch ale, that shit is foul) and other full out hop festival beers, but I don’t know if I can imagne too hoppy.
Travel to Northern California and visit Russian River brewing when they have their Pliny The Younger on. That is an incredibly hoppy beer.
Ruination is one of my favorites as well–and is definitely intense with the hops.
Other hop monsters would be:
Three Floyds Dreadnaught–as already mentioned
Alpine Exponential Hoppiness
Valleybrew Uberhoppy
Coronado Idiot IPA
and the list goes on–with most of the real hop bombs coming from the West Coast.
If you are like me, then it will take you a bit to get used to the hops–but then you won’t be able to get enough. If you want a great hoppy beer that has the perfect balance, in my opinion of course, then find Bell’s Two Hearted Ale. That is the nectar of the gods!
Somebody’s going to define IBU for me, because I don’t detect Pilsner Urqell as very hoppy at all.
I just looked it up. I’m guessing that what I am detecting as hoppyness has more to do with % alpha acids. Anyway, the hops in Samuel Adams has a flavor that I don’t detect in Pilsner Urquell.
If your Bockbier doesn’t go down chewy and leave chunks in the bottom of your mug, then it’s not really a Bock.
A true starkbier… if you can stand after eight, then you’re either a Giant, or there is no sate.
I used to buy it in Halletsville (14 miles from Shiner) for under $4 a six-pack, back before it was trendy. These days, there’s better beer for the money, IMHO.
Hear, hear. I made the same journey from American-style watered-down lagers to Shiner Bock to the wide world of great beers.
Shiner Bock also has a special place in my heart because it was the only beer served at Valhalla at Rice University. Valhalla is the grad student pub hidden under the stairs of the Chemistry Lecture Hall at Rice. Twenty years ago, a draft Shiner Bock cost 35 cents. (The bartenders are all volunteer grad students.) I was there a couple of years ago, and the price had increased to 50 cents. 
Me and my buddies drink Shiner because for the most part it stays HOT AS HELL in our part of Texas for most of the year, and Shiner is smooth, fairly light, and still has taste! Theres nothing worse than sitting on the lake in the blistering heat and trying to choke down a real heavy beer while your fishing.
IBUs are basically based on alpha acid content. Well, that and the amount of hops used.
Sam Adams Boston Lager is made with Hallertau Mittelfrueh and Tettnang hops. Both are Noble hops with an alpha acid content of 3.5 - 5.5%. These two hops are among four of the classic Noble hops that are used to flavor German lagers (Saaz and Spalt being the other ones.) Saaz is the hop used to flavor and bitter Pilsener Urquell. It’s also in the 3-5% alpha acid range. All these hops are fairly mild compared to American hops like Centennial (9.5-11% alpha), Amarillo (8-11%), and even the ubiquitous Cascade (4.5 - 6%).
Like I said in my previous post, Pilsner Urquell tastes slightly hoppier to me than Sam Adams, so it must be some other flavor in the beer that you have an aversion to.
edit: Now that I actually think about it, Sam Adams is also dry hopped so, while it would not increase the bitterness or hop flavor in the beer, it will make it hoppier on the nose. Perhaps that’s what you’re responding to.
To the poster who asked about Shiner Bock:
I have been drinking beer now for 40 years and usually have my “beer frig” stocked with over 50 brands of beer (rotating as to what exotics are on sale). I like to think I’ve never seen a label for sale I haven’t tasted at least a bottle of, with five bucks a bottle being about my limit for a one time tasting and then only rarely in this price range and when one comes highly recommended. (Remembering what I have and haven’t tasted seems to be the current problem.)
For what it’s worth, when I want a beer to watch TV, a movie, eat a pizza with or to sit and chat with a friend, I find myself more often than not, pulling out a Shiner Bock. Of course when I want a beer to make love to, one on one with no interruptions then I’ll choose something more robust. I like Dogfish and Sierra Nevada products a lot these days.
So for what it’s worth that’s my effort to describe to the original poster’s query regarding what a Shiner Bock means to an old time beer lover, and a guy who hasn’t touched one from the big three in decades. Shiner is everyday beer drinking enjoyment for those who actually enjoy beer more than marketing campaigns.
P.S. If you’re worth your salt at beer tasting, in a private setting have someone set up a blind taste test of Shiner Bock and Ziggy. Serve them both in the large mouth “schooner” style mugs where you can get the full aroma. On the way into them both, you’ll likely get a similar sensation. It is not until you finish your first swallow that you realize that Ziggy has left the building. There is zero and in fact a bit of a negative after taste (or totally missing taste) of the Ziggy as you finish the swallow. The Shiner Bock will remain constant and dissipate at a much slower rate. So after you’ve had a few, Miller’s Ziggy might fool you on the way in but not on the way out. In short I would equate Ziggy as bock beer for people who really don’t care for darker beers - at all.
I’d be curious if others notice the same. I have explained this loss of taste after the swallow to several people and all I get is a blank stare in return. Try the test some time for yourself.
Don Anthony - Dallas
Expert Subjective Reporter
neorxnawange hit it on the head.
It’s more flavorful than Bud, Miller or Coors, but it’s not too assertive either. It also has the distinction of being a Texas beer, which will get a beer a fair degree of sales by itself.
Personally, I think Shiner’s seasonal beers are where their real strengths lie. Last year’s “Frost”, which was a Dortmunder-style lager made Shiner Bock taste like old dishwater, and the 199 Pilsner is pretty good as well, although not quite up to what our Czech friends make.
Shiner’s Oktoberfest is gross however… whoever thinks that Oktoberfests should taste primarily like roasted specialty malts and not Munich malt is seriously mistaken. Shiner’s Oktoberfest tastes like a watered-down porter or something.
Still, there are much better beers made in Texas. Try anything from Franconia, St. Arnold’s or Live Oak for excellent examples.
The “allure” of Shiner Bock mentioned 'way back in the OP was probably affected by memories of its advocates. People looking back to more carefree times in Texas–college days, perhaps? Drinking it with Tex-Mex & Barbecue. In that Texas heat that might be remembered fondly in snowbound climes. (As a Texan, I’ll stick with air conditioning in the summer; but it’s 58F right now.) And that cheap Mexican pot…
I prefer Shiner Bohemian Black Lager to the Bock; and their Hefeweizen in the summer. The seasonal Shiner Cheer has peach & toasted pecan flavors–subtle & mellow. The Spoetzl Brewery products don’t push any envelopes–but are widely available & inexpensive down here. They aren’t my choices at our local Flying Saucer–which even tempts me beyond Houston’s OwnSt Arnold’s.
But I’m using the resurrected thread to recommend Buried Hatchet Stout from Conroe’s Southern Star Brewing Co. A real kick in the head…
Because it’s decent beer you can get at the gas station. And goes down better in the Texas heat than a darker, heavier ale.
And don’t underestimate a Texan’s pride in his/her home state and anything pertaining to it. I think that might be just about the only reason why Lone Star is in business.
Dog, you bark the truth.
Anyone who’s all "Why drink piss-water Shiner when you can drink <darkheavytastybrew> has never sat in 108 F heat (not heat index, just the straigh-up temperature) and tried to drink a <darkheavytastybrew>. Not everyone can get to air-conditioning, don’t forget.
Besides, it’s a great beer to cook with.