Eye Opener

No one had called me back from multiple voicemails I’d left with the Long Island LGBT organization, the one that operates the transgender support groups I’ve attended in Bay Shore (young, well-attended) and Woodbury (more nearby, sparsely attended). No one had emailed me back from the emails I’d sent to the woman who teaches Women’s Studies at Old Westbury (where I was a Women’s Studies major 1985-88) and who also runs the women’s center on campus. I had put on my calendar a note to myself to get off my ass and follow through on both of these, to talk with the people involved and get the proverbial ball rolling on booking me to give some kind of presentation on gender, to be more of a local presence doing gender here on Long Island. Gotta build the author’s platform, you know.

So with the professor at Old Westbury, I obtained her office hours at least, with the notion that I could do this best if I could be seated across from her and sketch out some of what I wanted to present; I was figuring her lack of follow-through and lack thus far of enthusiasm was reasonable, she doesn’t know what my content is going to be like, why would she opt to have me present to her class just because I said I’d like to do so?

So next I called the LGBT folks. Similar assumption: they have no reason to rush out and try to schedule me to present my material when they don’t know as of yet what my material is. Seems like the thing to do is try to arrange a sit-down where I can explain enough of it for them to gauge my seriousness and the degree to which my perspective adds to rather than clashes with whatever they’re putting on. The receptionist took down some basic info including my telephone number and then said she’d have the programming director get back to me shortly.
I get the call maybe 45 minutes later. “So what’s this about?”, she asks. “Well”, I say, fumbling my way into it, “I consider myself to be a subtype of genderqueer… really I haven’t found much information about people like me in the materials that tend to be presented, and I guess you could say I’m trying to come out of the closet and be recognized for who I am, but that recognition requires people’s willingness to accept another gender identity. I have some materials and I gave a presentation at one local group which went over well, and I was wondering if I could make an appointment to come in and discuss, well, maybe I could do a presentation there, either in Woodbury or in Bay Shore”.

“Oh, well, we’re not really seeking any additional programming resources at this point but thanks anyway”.

“I don’t mean I’m trying to get a paid position or anything, I mean just the ideas themselves, I’d like to sit down with you folks as activists”.

“That won’t be necessary. Is there anything else I can help you with?”

“I…um…wait… I don’t seem to be expressing myself well. I have trouble doing this over the phone. I’m… I found it difficult to… sort things out for myself growing up and… and I promised myself long ago that I’d see that younger people would not have to deal with this all by themselves, and there’s still no voice out there that I can really recognize as a voice of someone like me.”

“So is there some specific service you want from us?”

“I…you… I assume you are concerned with social… liberation, justice… in the same ways and that if what I’m trying to do is… meshes with… that we’re approaching the same issues and concerns…”

“As I said, we’re not looking for any programming to add at this point. We have support groups that meet in Bay Shore and Woodbury that you’re welcome to attend and although you said you aren’t seeking therapeutic counseling for yourself, that’s what I’d recommend for you. Aside from that I don’t know what else we can do for you”.

I repeated that I felt that I flail badly at this sort of thing on the phone and she suggested I email her instead, so I took her up on it, and explained more completely how I viewed my own situation and how I felt that I had a gender identity that wasn’t on the radar, generally speaking, and that I wanted to do something about that. She wrote back once again saying that the best they could offer me was the support group that I’d already been to.
I went to bed that night with an old old frustration burning hotly new, that too-familiar feeling of “I can’t believe this isn’t of more interest than it seems to be, why isn’t anyone inclined to be grabbed by it the way other people’s issues grab me when I hear about them? Why the hell can’t I make common cause with people?”
I woke up the next morning with a different judgment on myself. I’ve been kicking myself pretty hard these past 5 years for not trying harder to connect with organizations like Identity House and discuss my issues with gay and lesbian and transgender activists and instead putting all my efforts and energies into connecting with feminists and discussing my issues as aspects of feminist theory and feminist movement gender politics. Oh, sure, I’ve given myself a pass for having taken awhile to realize the possibilities and potential in gender activism, of seeing msyelf as part of the LBGT spectrum. But there was all that sense that gee, I’d been there and that I should have been playing a part of the political scene in which the modern transgender and genderqueer identities have burst onto the scene. But this morning I sat up and realized "I really did go to Identity House. And I really did try to talk to people about how I was and what my concerns were. And I stopped going or didn’t develop a habit of going very often because my concerns did not mesh with the concerns of the people I met there, and they weren’t particularly curious about or fascinated by me as someone coming at this from a somewhat different angle than they were.

So now again this seems to be the case.

OK. Fundamentals. The stance I have taken towards “Society”, in its overweening unwashed entirety, is an adversarial one. I feel mistreated and scorned and subjected to some harsh and vicious shit and I have spun around and with anger am being confrontational. This here sissy hatred has got to stop. If nothing else, I get to speak for myself, I get to have a voice, and I get to say I am happy to be who I am and I am proud to be who I am.

So I blithely turned to folks I assumed would be my allies, and blithely assumed that I’d be embraced and accepted there even though I’m different from them, because they’re LESS DIFFERENT. But let’s stay blunt here: my intention is to change them. To have an effect on them. To alter their agenda. It is not reasonable for me to assume that other people are going to WANT me to change them, to have that kind of affect on them, to get them to set a place for me at their planning table. So this relationship is potentially adversarial too. And I have to approach all my potential allies and comrades and similarly aligned people that I’m trying to make common cause with without expecting them to lap up whatever I exude. I’m not saying I necessarily need to become more abrasive, but I need to not be surprised if they don’t immediately latch onto my ideas and priorities and instead are obstructionist and intolerant of differences and myopic in their now-institutionalized thinking on many issues.

I need to remember that, just as with academia and feminism, the individual people at close range tend to be people with job titles or positions within an organizational structure, and probably most of them are not theory-heads who spend enormous amounts of their time playing with abstract ideas about gender and expression and perception and feelings and whatnot and instead are more rooted in everyday pragmatic concerns, on which level my priorities may seem as alien to them as they would be to the local Chamber of Commerce or something.

I’d suggest making this only a presentation on the subtype of genderqueer orientation, a definition and issues facing the orientation. Making it about you personally, or saying you would like to use it to come out and be recognized personally probably put them off. They may have felt unsure of what you actually intended, and uninterested in giving you an audience to talk about yourself mostly.

But I have no experience in LGBT activism or orgs so my opinion probably is not worth much.

Thanks… yeah, honestly I don’t know if that would have played better or if, instead, I’d been better off stressing that I had personal individual connection-needs not being met my their groups and would like to sit down with someone one on one and then explained how my need to come out as a political category (and get it on the map) is indeed a personal individual need.

I’m leaning towards the latter, actually. I don’t want to start off putting people on the defensive about whatever programming they currently offer, from a professional programming-director’s sort of standpoint, i,e., “you don’t seem to be doing your job so well, let me add some stuff”.

I think that sounds like a very accurate and useful epiphany you describe. Rare is the organization (or person) who is going to take meaningful input from a total stranger on how they should do things differently.

I really don’t know how these types of orgs operate, but ISTM that, if this project is one you’re determined to see through, the thing to do would be to go work (volunteer, presumably) at this place for a while first. Get to know the people there and what they’re interested in, and, more importantly, let them get to know you, so they have some reason to give credence to what you propose. It’s definitely time-intensive; you can’t show up on Monday and initiate Project Alpha on Thursday. But, I think it’s what would work.

(Or not; again, I’m a little out of my depth in this particular field.)

I read the whole OP and I have no idea what your “issue” supposedly is, so yeah you might have a problem with explaining yourself clearly. I think you’re saying you’re gay but some kind of subtype of gay that is unusual? Or transsexual? It’s really not clear at all from your post.

ETA: It’s also not clear exactly what you’re trying to do or accomplish. I gathered you’re trying to get some kind of speaking engagement with a class about the unclear gender issue, or promote a book you wrote about it or something?

Yeah, that kind of thing. Something else, though. Unclear in post because there’s no short choppy phrase I could use that you’d recognize. ETA: (and because I’ve explained it elsewhere on this board a few dozen times)

About the fact that there’s no short choppy phrase that I could use that you’d recognize. I want there to be one. (Having the short choppy phrase is easy: I make one up. “Gender invert”. See? But you recognizing it, knowing what it means? Requires introducing the public to the notion).

OK, but like me, the people you’re pitching this idea to probably haven’t read your “few dozen” posts on the SDMB that explain whatever this issue is that you seem unable to summarize succinctly, so you should really work on that if you want them to be open to letting you come talk about it to their class (or whatever forum you’re shooting for). You need some way of introducing it that invokes some understanding and possibly empathy right off the bat, otherwise all they’re hearing is some guy rambling about how he wants to come talk about some vague issue related to gender. Of course nobody is going to go for that if they don’t know what you’re talking about.

Not to offend, but if you cannot explain yourself better than you have here, I don’t think you’re yet ready to be making any presentations, to anyone.

So work on that instead, is my suggestion. And if you know you’re not good over the phone, quit phoning people and trying to interest them. Write it out. Have a few uninvested people proof read it and see what their take away is. If it’s not what you intended, and I doubt it will be at first, then try again. And keep trying till you get responses like, “I’d invite you to speak, based on this!” Be prepared it will take some time. Once you’re getting this kind of interested response, THEN send it to the organizations you’re interested in reaching.

Wishing you good luck, don’t be discouraged, just keep trying till you get there!

It seems like you’re expecting gravitas by virtue of being able to pick up a phone and identifying yourself as an ally, when these folks obviously don’t know you from Adam (or Eve.)

Lots of people are trying to sell themselves nowadays. Writing blogs, opinion pieces, self-published books. Trying to do the motivational speaker circuit. Indulging fantasies of being interviewed by Terry Gross and Diane Sawyer. Being a spokesperson. I’m imagining LGBT/gender academics and activists are regularly bombarded by folks who want to use them solely as a path for their own advancement, rather than scholarship or the community’s interests.

Honestly, when I read your OP, AHunter, the first thing that came to mind is your repeated use of “I”. It’s all about you and your story. Your identity, your struggle. Why exactly do you think you and your story are that important or unique? What are you offering these people that they don’t already have? That’s what I would ask myself, if I were you.

Google “elevator pitch.” It sounds to me like that’s what you need – a short and succinct explanation of who you are and what you want to accomplish.

That’s kind of my take on it as well. Since I took over as hostess of a broadcast public radio show on transgender rights, my inbox is flooded with people making pitches about how my listeners need to hear their story, which is unique and interesting and special. Not to mention all the times I’m buttonholed at parties by people who want to come on the air to tell their story.

But that doesn’t mean it’s unique and interesting and special to more than a few people. And many topics can be so fine-grained that they are really of a focus between one person and their therapist. For me to have someone in the studio and interview them means that their story needs to have some special connection which is going to resonate with my audience. For instance, next show I have a local transgender homecoming queen who was recently the subject of a protest by the WBC, and a counselor who set up a very successful GLSEN program at a local high school.

Yup, this exactly. It really doesn’t matter what the issue is, if you can’t communicate what it is and why we should care in less than thirty seconds, you might as well go tell your cat about it.

Also, when approaching an organization, it’s always much better to find out how you can fit into their structure rather than asking how their structure can serve you. For example, if AHunter called and said “Do you have any events at which I could be a speaker?” it would be a thousand times more productive than “Please set something up for me so I can tell your members about how you’re wrong.”

Or, to summarize it in President Kennedy elevator pitch format “Ask not what your LGBT group can do for you, but what you can do for your LGBT group.”

Same here.

Many of us think we have a powerful voice and story. So what? Networking, doing the grunt work, writing, helping others get the word out, just plain working and working hard are how you generally get a chance to interact with and influence organizations. It’s not just about showing up and being given a microphone.

Lots of people want the sexy accolades. Lots of people want to start a movement and get recognition and respect for their issue. It’s hard work, and if your situation is idiosyncratic enough, there’s no movement to start. A movement of one is not a movement.

I’m not saying there is no audience, but it sounds like there isn’t one that’s ready made and on a platter.

It really just sounds like you want to talk about yourself at great length and in exhaustive detail.

Trying to dress it up as a “presentation on gender” or serving the community by defining a new gender subtype is just baloney. It’s all about you. Why do you think anybody would be the slightest bit interested a speech where you expound on the minutae of your gloriously byzantine gender identity? I’ve tried to read your “dozens of posts” on your gender identity, and my eyes glaze over. I still don’t get what you think is so unique about about being an effeminate man. If it’s more than that, tell me what you are in as few words as possible and I’ll gladly read it.

I suspect the LGBT lady knew exactly who you are and was trying to get rid of you as politely as possible. It sounds like you’re the guy who goes around insisting that people listen to him talk about himself and has absolutely no interest in anybody else.

You’re really not making it clear what you want to do and why someone would want to give you a platform for it. It sounds like you want an LGBT center to create a completely new program for you to speak about your identity because it’s important to you. You haven’t articulated why other people would benefit from this or want to hear it - you want people to hear it, but that doesn’t mean they want to. You don’t even seem to have articulated what it is that you want to say, I have no idea what your gender identity is or why it’s controversial after reading this. Like the other posters are saying, you at least need some kind of elevator pitch so that people have at least a basic idea of what you want and how it benefits them to have you do the presentation you want.

This sounds like you’re being adversarial, confrontational, and self-centered (ten uses of “I” in that short paragraph). None of those are good ways to convince another person to do what you want.

Well, I am rather self-immersed :slight_smile:

Point taken, y’all.

Oddly (perhaps), me realizing that the relationship is adversarial (in the sense that what I want from these organizations does not necessarily mesh with what they are interested in doing or providing) may make it easier to progress in a less off-putting way.

& yeah, jsgoddess (and Green Bean), I suppose at some point I need a more concrete sense of whether anyone else would benefit from this. The motivation has always been that other kids like me should not have to deal with this in isolation. If there are no other kids like me, it’s just an unnecessary ego trip and I should hang it up and move on. So maybe that’s where to start: ask them if, based on their experiences, they have found it to be true that people like me come around and can’t find resources. And explain how such centers weren’t very useful to me when I was 19, 20, 21. Make it about the people who would benefit.

It’s funny. Normally, it’s better to tell people they are not a special snowflake, but sometimes, dammit, your snowflake is just special! :slight_smile:

I think it’s very possible, even likely, that others could benefit, but maybe not enough others for a group to dedicate any of their resources to it right now. Seeing a problem is the first step. Figuring out if it’s a widespread issue is the second, and it often extremely hard.

Getting involved in a group you want to influence is nearly always the way to start. Good luck!

(bolding mine)

That’s a great goal, and would be a valuable contribution to the community.

As we discussed on the other board, the problem is not in what you are and what you want to do, but how you present it. Hopefully my suggestions there will help you express yourself more clearly and concisely.

I don’t think your idea of asking TPTB in the organizations if there are other people out there similar to you makes a lot of sense, however. They’re not going to be thinking “oh yeah, people like you totally come around asking for resources and we just tell them they’re shit out of luck, la de dah.” They probably don’t even realize they’re overlooking a particular constituency.

Work from the assumption that there ARE other people like you out there. You’re a woman who’s comfortable in her male body and has no intention of transitioning, right? There must be others in the same or similar situations. It’s possible that folks like that don’t even reach out to these organizations because they’re not dealing with publically transitioning or whatever. Maybe you can find some men and women who are in the same boat - and remember to focus on the similarities between you, not the differences.

Thanks, Green Bean (also you, jsgoddess). This is useful feedback and you’ve given me useful ideas.

For what it’s worth, I have run into other people online who say they are a woman in a male body or vice versa but have no desire to transition. So they exist.

I’m actually surprised there’s not some forum or Facebook page out there for this subgroup. I assume you checked people who would consider this a form of transgenderism and not genderqueer?