I have a couple of co-workers who use fck and sht liberally throughout business conversations. Now, to be fair, this is within our “team”; I don’t know that I have seen them do it out in larger groups of colleagues.
Anyhow, I am uncomfortable with this because to me it’s vulgar and unprofessional, and uncalled for. I have jokingly made a point about it but it hasn’t changed anything so the next step is a Serious Conversation. I don’t want to go to our boss because it’s something I should work out on my own. One time I mentioned it in front of the group in reference to a long-term outside consultant whose office was next to mine who would use f*cking as an adjective, and another member of our team seemed to express that that was inappropriate.
It’s not that I don’t curse myself; in fact I curse like a sailor outside of work, as long as I am alone or around people who don’t mind. I have friends who don’t like strong cursing even in a casual setting and I don’t do it around them either.
So, am I unreasonable in feeling uncomfortable and, more importantly, asking them to rein it in at the workplace?
More generally speaking, is it fair or reasonable to ask others to defer to the most sensitive person on any given issue or preference?
The first job I had at the tender age of 22 was as a corporate manager. I remebermy first meeting with all men quite well. It was with directors and executive VP’s making near a half million a year. Not only did they drop the F-bomb liberally, they also dropped the C-bomb and a bunch of other ones some of which I hadn’t heard before.
Workplaces differ on this greatly. In about half the places I have worked, fairly liberal swearing is the norm in day-to-day conversations. It is somewhat less common in things like meetings.
“Shit” and “fuck” are becoming a lot more common these days in everyday language and it seems that this realm that you refer to may be the last bastion of the defense against Potty Language (aside from network tv). I say you have to examine your audience. I think words, by themselves are powerless. The meanings that we put along with them are not. A word is only as shocking as it is to that one person at that particular time. It’s this notion that’s so dangerous, because some people put an awful lot of stress on some seemingly innocuous words; in my opinion, it’s one of the basic flaws inherent in the way we verbally communicate (any linguists in the house?)
If i were in that meeting, within the group, I wouldn’t use such language (or at the very least, I’d try like a motherfucker not to be the first person to do it). Also, if someone did say “fuck” and someone even joked about turning them in for it, use of that word discontinues immediately. It’s such a simple and petty thing, yet it’s very real and, especially within business, holds power.
We preach to “say what we mean”, although often what we say is also up for interpretation to anyone within earshot. You may want to tell the group that you want to keep it professional, if at all possible. Doing so, might stress the bonds within said group. Then a dilemma emerges: is their use of language more of a stress than you bringing it up? Whatever you discern that answer to be should probably be your course of action.
I once sat near a guy at work who dropped f-bombs constantly. This was in the IT department of a big mutual fund company. I found it somewhat distracting because I associate strong profanity in an office context as evidence that a crisis or emergency or at least a heated argument is under way. I think hearing it at work in cubeville triggers my fight or flight response, while hearing it when I worked construction triggered nothing.
Yep, that’s where I’m stuck! Bottom line is regardless of what happens, I won’t ever use that language at work. I agree with you that they are just words, but at the same time it’s jarring to me and takes away from my concentration on what we are talking about.
I have also been in customer service type roles at this institution up until now. Combine that with the fact that it’s a small town, and I make all of my comments mild and non-commital, because you never know the relationships between the hearer and the person you are talking about, etc.
I am trying to think of something similar that doesn’t bother me but may skeeve someone else out, and I think I would be fine with watching my mouth out of respect for that person, even if I teased them. I don’t even mind being labelled as the sensitive one and getting that mentioned, as long as it keeps the cursing down.
Our team is all women.
Sticks and stones, right? Now, people calling each other names is of course beyond the pale, and using that kind of language with people outside the team isn’t a good idea until you’ve felt everyone out well enough to know who can take what. But internally? There’s simply no word – or phrase even – that says as much as the word “bullshit” in describing how you evaluate a couteroffer or price quote that’s based on the other side dicking you around instead of what’s fair. And for those of us who grew up somewhere besides the South or Utah, the f-bomb is the most effective intensifier around.
Of course, this doesn’t mean you need to use these words, no one will be bothered. In fact, most people won’t even notice. But it ain’t your job to be the thought police, nor the language police neither. Otherwise, people around you are going to spend energy trying to conform their language to your standards, energy they would instead be using to come up with creative ways of pursuing you company’s business goals. This is no joke – when you have to think actively about sentence construction, then that’s what you end up thinking about. There’s no additional room for inspiration.
Alternatively, they’ll just think you’re a fuckin’ prude and will stop including you in bullshit sessions whenever possible so that they don’t have to be so circumspect. And if someone asks why they tend to have informal meetings without gigi present, their response will inevitably be “Fuck 'em if they can’t take a joke.”
I don’t know, the guy next to me with his finger shoved up his nose is making me uncomfortable, is that harrassment?
I am so tired of people whining about being offended by each and every little thing. Profanity is simply language used to make a strong point. If someone doesn’t like the language, don’t use it. However, just because YOU don’t like something, that is no reason for your co-workers to change their behaviors.
Harassment Training? Harassment is “give me a blowjob or I am going to fire you” if something else offends you, get the hell over it.
You may want to bring it up in a dispassionate sort of way. Don’t say you are offended or uncomfortable, just say that you feel that its unprofessional and unnecessary. But that you can swear like a sailor when the occation demands and if this is the occation…
I had a job like that once. As long as it was “make the girl uncomfortable” they swore. When I made them all uncomfortable by swearing a blue streak, they didn’t like it and we all agreed to stop.
Well of course they have to say that. Or, in another idiom, it’s all cover-their ass bullshit. But that don’t make it so. One can imagine a person, not the OP, so sensitive that he issues outrageous demands on the others in the workplace because so many things make him uncomfortable. Like, y’know, wearing orange or something equally indefensible. And such a person might in fact be able to change the way things work. But he’d still be a prick.
Really? It’s OK for someone to stare at your crotch or tits or ass and that’s a comfortable workplace for you? It’s OK for someone to talk in explicit terms about the sex they had or will have or would like to have with you?
Thank you, Cliffy, for the other perspective. I am aware that I am on the brink of beyond the pale when it comes to what is acceptable to me. I don’t even engage in the inevitable “This is what men are like” discussions since I try not to make those generalizations and try to treat people as individuals regardless of gender, etc.
I cuss a lot at work. I’m trying to remedy that, though. I’m able to effectively express myself otherwise, and this whole liberal swearing thing is a relatively recent phenomenon for me. I think it’s got something to do with the crisis-oriented nature of my work. Nothing better expresses the feelings of an IT Guy when a critical server crashes at a critical moment (as they are wont to do) than a shouted FUCK!, followed by a trail diminishing profanity. Pounding the keyboard adds emphasis. I used to be out in the Cube Farms, but now I just shut the door to my office so nobody can hear me.
A comment too about the urgency of what we discuss. We are developing a new financial system for our institution. While we have overall deadlines and such, we are relatively self-directed and out of the public eye. We have the luxury to work as we need to and don’t face immediate deadlines or pressure.
While I don’t feel the circumstances should have too much bearing on what decorum is followed, I feel this particular situation is one where we have the luxury to take the time to do things right and we aren’t facing the stress of a regular job at this point. Plus, I don’t know if we need to be describing someone else’s f*ck-up. To me, work is a fake environment to some degree and I’ve learned to describe things much more gently than that, while still getting the point across.
I must admit to whispering a shiiit (very quietly) if I have forgotten something or something falls through, but I am sure it’s not audible to anyone!!
*Most *of the time I’m quite restrained at work, though I’ll admit to dropping the f-word in a meeting the other day.
But frankly, it was warranted, and it’s nothing compared to what I came out with when I was describing the situation to my husband afterwards.
I think it’s unprofessional to come out with swear words in front of co-workers, but essentially forgiveable provided you don’t swear continuously like a wounded pirate with Tourettes. On the other hand, I can’t imagine any situation where it’d be acceptable to swear in front of clients.
I’ve got “business Tourette’s” myself, and most of my co-workers are the same way. If they aren’t using it in a sexual way, you may have no recourse. Sometimes you need to tell those fuckin’ cocksuckers to fucking knock off that shit or you’ll kick 'em in the balls, the assholes.
I have been known, under stress, to let go with some colorful language, so I have a forgiving attitude about that sort of thing. If it were something heard constantly, I’d have a problem, but an occasional outburst of frustration is fine, and to be expected. We are dealing with computers here, after all.
My husband works in a prison, so you can imagine that his language is somewhat colorful. All of his co-workers seem to be the same way. He’s a bad influence on me-- I fins myself swearng much more than I used to do.
But at my job, no one swears. I have to be very careful-- it’s not an issue of punishment, it’s that my co-workers don’t swear (beyond the ultra-irritated “Shit!” on occasion) and I don’t want to offend them.
I don’t think the OP should complain, or ask them to stop. I think that their co-wokers probably would stop if asked, but they would be either a bit derisive or uncomfortable in the OP’s presence after that.
