Yeah, we brought this on ourselves. It’s our fault people were jumping to their deaths to avoid being burned alive and my fellow New Yorkers had to watch them go splat right in front of them.
Yeah, how DARE we even suggest that the terrorists were cowards. How dare we.
You take the cake, Ms. Sontag.
Former Senator George Mitchell said that no grievance, no matter how legitimate, can justify or excuse what the terrorists did. Right on, Senator.
So here’s a nice big F$%* You from me to you, Ms. Sontag.
(King Rat steels himself for the inevitable posters who will agree with that female jerk)
I wish that I wouldn’t give a shit what anyone in the “liberal intellectual elite” thinks about anything, let alone their attempts to score political points over a tragedy like this. But it still makes me a little angry.
BTW - Here are Susan Sontag’s qualifications for speaking intelligently on any subject:
Born in New York City
Studied at the University of California, Berkeley
Studied at the University of Chicago
Studied at and received an MA in English and in Philosophy at Harvard
Studied at St Anne’s College
Studied at Oxford
Studied at the Sorbonne
(Uhhh…yeah. Hello? Is it just me, or is anyone else seeing the words “Professional Student” on a resume?)
Author of Against interpretation, and other essays, The benefactor, a novel, AIDS and its metaphors, Illness as metaphor (apparently, she’s fond of metaphors), The Volcano Lover, and Alice in Bed.
So…tell me again why I should give a shit what she thinks, as compared to the crazy man down at the bus stop who says he was anally probed by the CIA last week?
This is exactly the same as blaming the rape victim who dresses “provocatively.” Utter garbage in either case. And an attitude that allows evil to fester in the world.
Because, you see, Susan Sontag went to Oxford and Harvard, among other schools, and has advanced degrees in a variety of fields, meaning that her opinions are more valid than ours. We need people like her to tell the rest of us what to think, because the rest of us are burdened by dealing with the real world, rather than having an ivory tower to issue pronouncements from.
Boy, you people are really set on finding someone to hate no matter what, aren’t you? Here you thought that you could vent your spleen on all Moslems or all Arabs, but then you get all these people who tell you that the terrorists are only a tiny percentage of either of those groups. So you need a new target. But, hey, here’s one intellectual who writes something incredibly stupid. There’s someone you can hate. Never mind that you have no idea whatsoever whether any other intellectuals agree with her. The point is finding someone to hate.
I realize that you will now fill this thread with your hatred of me. After all, it’s much more fun for you to hate someone who you can argue with, rather than someone who you could never possibly meet. Heck, you might even be able to meet me at a Dopefest sometime and personally beat me up, and that’s much more fun for you than just spewing hate pm the board.
Wow, that is really strange. Aside from Anthracite, who mentioned the “liberal intellectual elite” and only then as a group about whose opinion she does not care (Go Go Microsoft Grammar check! :)), I think the thread has been all about posters reacting to Sontag, specifically.
The only one making broad pronouncements about groups seems to be . . . wait let me double check . . . you.
Speaking for myself at least, and most likely the other two who have posted to this thread, I can emphatically say that the thought of hating all Moslems or Arabs never crossed my mind. I don’t know where you get the idea that I’m looking for someone to hate, aside from those actually responsible for the attacks (I also hate the practices of the Taliban, but I have done that since before September 11th), and I assure you that you will find no evidence of that in any of my posts. I am insulted by the insinuation that my disgust for Susan Sontag is caused by anything other than her vile words.
My comments were only meant to show my disgust with the column that was linked to. I also added in some derision for the idea that intellectuals such as Sontag have inherently more valid opinions than the rest of us. The column linked to displayed a brand of moral righteousness and arrogance that I found appalling. No doubt that there are other self-professed intellectuals that have differign opinions. But the idea that we should listen to this woman because of her academic credentials is especially laughable in light of the moronic comments she made.
So you think that deceiving ourselves about the nature of the enemy we face is a good way to prepare for conflict ? I’m sure the Taliban will find your attitude refreshingly “Custeresque”.
If that’s not the case, what’s your point ? This looks suspiciously like yet another right wing feeding frenzy.
Squink, my point is that I disagree, in the strongest terms, with Ms. Sontag’s column. I think that it is outrageous. That she has the right to express her opinion is not in dispute, and no right-wing feeding frenzy is desired.
“Right wing feeding frenzy” my ass. Fuck you. Susan Sontag wrote a bunch of fucking stupid crap, and we’re complaining about the fucking stupid crap she wrote.
If you’d care to agree with her that we deserved to get bombed, then say so, and we can complain about that. Either defend Susan Sontag, complain about Susan Sontag, or shut up. If you don’t agree, say so. But drive-by ad hominem attacks are kind of pointless.
And yes, I hate people who think America deserved to be attacked. If that makes me a jingoistic bigot in your eyes, then I suggest that you take a look in the mirror. Ever notice how the people who decry “hatred” are the first ones to be hateful towards people who disagree with them?
> Ever notice how the people who decry “hatred” are the
> first ones to be hateful towards people who disagree with
> them?
I have never said I hate someone on this board. I have never started a thread in the Pit. I have never used obscene language on this board.
anthracite writes:
> So who are you talking to exactly?
You. You were the one who brought up her college degrees. You were the one who first mentioned the “liberal intellectual elite.” You were the one who couldn’t just disagree with Sontag but also had to attack her academic and intellectual credentials in order to criticize all intellectuals.
Ya know, I hadn’t thought of it that way…I mean, these terrorists, they attacked a bunch of unarmed people who had been taught to obey them, then rammed a plane into a building…That was truely an act of bravery the likes of which the world rarely sees…
And they did it for no personal gain…Not even the ones who were noted for their drinking and gambling while in the US…I mean, its not like they lived these lifestyles because they were assured automatic entrance to heaven, or anything…
They died for what they believed in! the very definition of heroism and bravery…And I’m sure that if at anytime they didn’t want to do it, they would have been allowed to live full, happy lives comfortable in the knowlege that they hadn’t damned themselves for eternity…I mean, the alternative has to better for bravery to apply, right?
Yup, these terrorists did exactly what they were told to do, what they had to do, and what they wanted to do, overcame underwhelming odds, and killed thousands of people who weren’t hurting anyone, all for personal glory and a happy place in the after life…
I’d like you to present where I have been venting spleen on all Moslems or all Arabs. Or any, for that matter.
Then you made these bizzare statments implying impending persecution:
So since you were talking to me, you are now accusing me of planning on coming to a Dopefest to “beat (you) up”? That’s a nice bit of irrational persecution complex you got there, worthy of something I would say.
Then, you said:
That’s an interesting bit of telepathy there. :rolleyes: Can you present your proof behind this statement? Or is demanding you to back up your statements somehow attacking you?
It’s put up or shut up time for you. I’m not going to let you say or imply things that aren’t true about me, until you retract them. You better decide right now if you really want to get into this.
