Hi I hope someone can answer this question for me.
A man marries his second cousin once removed. Are the children of that marriage simply the nephews and nieces of the man’s siblings or are they the man’s siblings’ cousins as well? Put another way, do the offspring of the marriage call their father’s siblings simply ‘uncle’ and ‘aunt’ or also cousins ?
Sorry I meant to write 'first cousin once removed".
A man marries his first cousin once removed. Are the children of that marriage simply the nephews and nieces of the man’s siblings or are they the man’s siblings’ cousins as well? Put another way, do the offspring of the marriage call their father’s siblings simply ‘uncle’ and ‘aunt’ or also cousins ?
IDK but I would say the most functional term, due to ages, would be used for sake of simplicity and also not to raise any eyebrows outside the family, and when the kids were old enough they would be filled in but keep the original term as the public answer.
The chart here might help
I think they would call then Aunt and Uncle, but if pressed, will admit that they’re also cousins.
I think a familial term that’s more based on relative ages will be used.
I had cousins that were 30 years older than me (mom was the second to last of 10 and had me relatively late in life). I called them “aunt” and “uncle” because of their age relative to mine even if that was “incorrect”. Their children my siblings and I called “cousins”.
In the case of the OP I’m pretty sure the offspring of the marriage will call the man’s siblings “aunt” and “uncle” because of the age difference and because they’re also aunts and uncles (unlike in my situation where they really were cousins and only cousins).
Outside of family trees and someone having genealogy as a hobby I don’t think anyone would care. The people involved would know, at least those around and aware at the time it all occurred, but it’s likely to be one of those things not talked about that fade into history.
We need a new term to distinguish between generations of cousins
because your first cousin’s children (ie, a generation below you) are your
first cousin once removed, and your great aunt/uncle’s children
(ie, a generation above you) are also your first cousin once removed.
Or just accept that “cousin” is a general, nonspecific term for someone with whom you share a common ancestor and who isn’t a first- or second-degree relative.
Well, I usually do just that !
But sometimes you need to be less unspecific.
Probably.
Just to be clear, from a purely genealogical perspective (though I accept that the terms ‘aunt’ and ‘uncle’ would be more conventional) could one technically call the children of that marriage ‘first cousins twice removed’ to the man’s siblings?
Sure. And the relationship between the children of that marriage and the children of the father’s brothers and sisters would be “double-cousins”
That might be their genetic relationship, but their social relationship might be more “aunt&uncle/nieces&nephews”
Yes, i think you could use both terms. And i agree with others that for a variety of social reasons, aunt/uncle/niece/nephew/niblings are the terms that would get used more often.
Agreed.
What people call their relatives is not necessarily exactly the same way those relatives would appear in a geneology chart. Lots of people, for example, call much older first cousins “aunt” or “uncle” - but not all families do that. Even more probably call a much older first cousin once removed “aunt” or “uncle” but again , not all do that. I’ve known people who call one or more great-aunts “Grandma First name” and of course there are families where completely unrelated people are called"aunt", “uncle” etc. The way a person is addressed doesn’t necessarily include every ( or any) position they fill on a family tree - the second cousins once removed who married aren’t going to call each other “cousin-husband” or “cousin-wife”.
On the rare occasions when I need to do that, I call them “my mother’s cousin” or “my cousin’s daughter”.
Yes, i have a bunch of family i think of as “cousin’s kids” who are technically first cousins once removed. Although, my parents had a bunch of cousins (also technically my first cousins once removed) and i just called them cousin firstname.
This is how it works in my family.
Due to interruption by WWII, and an uncle who lost his first wife when she was young, then remarried a somewhat (14 years) younger woman, and had two more children with her, we have lots of people who are first cousins, but a generation apart, as well as uncle/nephew-type relationships, but very close in age.
We are also a close family, and visit one another frequently; great aunts and nieces, and second cousins, and such, have lots of contact.
So basically, if someone is a playmate, they are just addressed by first name, and if they are old enough to be a “grown-up” to you when you are a kid, then unless they are a Mom, or Safta, Zayde, or something, they are Aunt/Uncle Firstname. That’s it.
Only exception might be for sibs and half-sibs who are different generations, but we don’t currently have that, and haven’t for a long time. No matter if your sister was 22 when you were born-- you don’t call her “aunt.”
I can’t recall an argument or dispute ever over what someone ought to be called.