That’s better.
^^even tho i can provide that quote, it’s still arbitrary–Trayvon still was acting under self defense. bottom line is a 28 year old was stalking a law abiding minor and accosted him without provocation or cause.
link(from a lawyer, explaining self defense).
*
Trayvon Martin was a teenaged boy who was walking home from a convenience store. He was not engaged in an unlawful activity. He was in a place where he had a right to be – near the home of his father’s fiancée. George Zimmerman followed him, even after being told by the 911 dispatcher not to. Zimmerman left his vehicle holding a loaded gun and began pursuing Martin on foot. It is plausible to infer that Zimmerman, not Martin, initiated the attack. The tapes indicate that Zimmerman may have been the aggressor in initiating contact with Martin. Assuming the published reports are true, Martin, not Zimmerman, was exercising his lawful right to “stand his ground and meet force with force” by engaging in an altercation with Zimmerman*
Now you’re doing the same thing as Terr: drawing firm conclusions from a bunch of facts that are disputed and clearly open to other interpretations (as the editorial you quote also does).
In fairness this is terrible reporting; it’s not clear to me what order these things happened in, when the gunshot was heard (he SAW them separated, but did not see the shooting?) or even if Martin was alive when this kid saw them. I haven’t a clue what conclusion you could draw from this.
I am sure the kid’s official statement could be very revealing indeed but this article tells us jack shit because it’s lacking 98% of the information.
the only conclusion i’ve drawn is that a kid went to get skittles and a dude who admits he sure wished he could be a cop chased him down with a gun out and ended up killing him…
trayvon did not approach zimmerman. zimmerman approached trayvon…
the “ground” on which “one could stand” was occupied by Trayvon until zimmerman ran over to it.
just be the lay definition of the law, which is still silly, that’s the case.
i won’t and can’t attest to the details–but it’s been made clear dude left his car to chase down a kid because “these assholes always get away” and he was going to make sure this asshole didn’t.
which is when the trouble started.
zimmerman started that trouble…
Where exactly in that article is: “said they were already separated and Martin was screaming for HELP when Zimmerman went ahead and shot him”?
As I said, I don’t expect you to admit making stuff up.
absolutely. that’s the problem–we’re all left to speculate–because the police didn’t do a proper investigation.
that’s why this is so upsetting to everyone, i think.
but this is all we have for now…
i’ll repeat again, if you start a fight with a kid for no real honest or prudent reason, get your ass kicked and decide you need to kill him now, you’re still the aggressor, regardless of when the shot was fired.
The 911 tapes released by the Sanford Police Department feature the chilling sounds of Martin screaming for help in the background – screams that are silenced by a gunshot. Martin’s screams and cries for help indicate that, he was not a threat to Zimmerman when Zimmerman pulled the trigger.
please try again
Exactly the same conclusion you can draw from the witness who claimed Martin was on top of Zimmerman and “beating him bloody”, “John”: none at all. “John” was apparently so disturbed by what he saw that he walked off to his house and didn’t see the gunshot.
[QUOTE=Terr]
Where exactly in that article is: “said they were already separated and Martin was screaming for HELP when Zimmerman went ahead and shot him”?
[/QUOTE]
Assuming that they were separated, it’s pretty safe to say Martin was the one the kid heard screaming.
I mean, Zimmerman might have screamed, but it seems rather implausible. “Help! Help! I have a gun!”
Bull. There are screams of someone screaming for help. The only eyewitness to the fight says it was Zimmerman screaming. The dog-walker that YOU yourself brought up says it was Zimmerman crying for help. And when the police played the 911 tapes to Martin’s father he said the voice crying for help was NOT his son.
in case you need more:
“I heard someone crying — not boo-hoo crying, but scared or terrified or hurt maybe,” said Mary Cutcher, 31, who lives in the Retreat at Twin Lakes townhome community where the shooting occurred. “To me, it was a child.”
or this:
You know what they say about assuming…
http://www.eurweb.com/2012/03/zimmerman-told-police-trayvon-tried-to-take-his-gun/
In addition, an eyewitness, 13-year-old Austin Brown, told police he saw a man fitting Zimmerman’s description lying on the grass moaning and crying for help just seconds before he heard the gunshot that killed Martin.
And no, Austin Brown didn’t see the shot and has no idea what happened after he ran off to catch his dog.
Ah. So we can assume that witness accounts that support your contentions are accurate and/or truthful, but not the ones that don’t. Got it.
the responding officer is the one who determined this.
quote:
*Another officer corrected a witness after she told him that she heard the teen cry for help.
The officer told the witness, a long-time teacher, it was Zimmerman who cried for help, said the witness. ABC News has spoken to the teacher and she confirmed that the officer corrected her when she said she heard the teenager shout for help.*
the witnesses said it was Martin. the COP said “no, you’re wrong.”
You are aware that the police say that they have sworn testimony from her that contradicts this - http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/seminole/os-trayvon-martin-witness-tv-report-20120315,0,559932.story
Did you listen to the link I gave you? Apparently not. The police PLAYED the 911 tapes to Trayvon’s father. The father said it was not his son’s voice crying for help.
i guess it’s just not possible both could have cried for help. i guess it’s not possible that zimmerman, after getting his ass kicked, realized he was in over his head and called for help.
now all you have to do is disprove this:
*Trayvon’s parents, Tracy Martin and Sybrina Fulton of Miami Gardens, arrived at Sanford City Hall to hear the tapes.
Martin broke down and “cried like a baby,” when he heard his son pleading for his life on one of the audio tapes.
“You hear a shot, a clear shot, then you hear a 17-year-old boy begging for his life,” said Natalie Jackson, one of the family’s attorneys. “Then you hear a second shot.”
The first shot can be heard in the distance — “a warning shot,” said attorney Ben Crump. The second shot is much closer.
“It is shocking when you hear these 911 tapes,” said Crump. “It was far worse than they thought it was going to be.”*
http://www.kmjm.com/pages/thetonyscottshow.html?feed=146161&article=9917468#ixzz1qHma5nFN
as i said, it’s just IMPOSSIBLE both Martin and Zimmerman cried for help.
right? just IMPOSSIBLE.
You don’t get it. I showed you how the “witness account” that YOU brought up says it was Zimmerman crying for help and not Martin.
did you read your own link?
*
Mary Cutcher, a witnesses to the shooting, told WFTV-Channel 9 in a Wednesday report that police took only a short statement from her, despite repeated attempts to share what she saw at length.
“I said, ‘I know this was not self-defense. There was no punching, no hitting going on at the time, no wrestling,’” Cutcher said, adding that she felt the police investigating the shooting "blew us off.*
she said she heard martin and police said “no that was zimmerman” and wrote that in their report, which is what they are calling her “sworn testimony.” according to you own freaking link they dismissed what she was actually trying to say.
WOW. you’re throwing gas on your own fire…