You know, in my ramblings I didn’t make the point you might be able use.
A lot of very nice people go through a phase at her age where they’re kind of immature, self-absorbed, and generally assy toward a parent. It creates tension, hurts your feelings, and does nothing for your relationship. Tell her to get a place with friends, so she can experience paying bills, rent, food, utilities and other expenses as a neutral adult thing that is not all mom’s being mean to her. After struggling on her own she’ll start to see what a brat she was toward you, and you can be friends again. If you want to live together later, once she’s grown up and you both have some boundaries, maybe things will be better.
Your daughter appears to be at a stage where she thinks she knows best without really having a true real-world knowledge base to work from. I have already mentioned I’ve lived with my mom twice since I reached adulthood.
The first time was after living on my own for about a year, and having 2 bad roommates. I had grown accustomed to certain freedoms but not necessarily appreciated all my mom had done for me.
The second time I had been married and divorced, had owned a home, and dealt with other people living in my home. I was more independent, but definitely more understanding of the value of things, the costs of household repairs, and the need for an equitable division of all costs.
Wow. A densely packed and disturbing statement there.
I was just reading all of this, not expecting to comment, liking the fact that there is some good inter-generational support out there that I was unaware of. At the same time, I can’t imagine living with my parents between age 18 and when I need to take them in—(I’m 43 so I have another decade or so I guess). I got financial help for sure, and I’ve always considered myself very fortunate for that. But it was understood that I had to make my own life and lifestyle once I left home. There was no finger wagging bullshit; it was just the next phase of my development. And my devotion to take care of them if/when they need it is no quid pro quo arrangement.
They have that because they raised me with love.
(and I put myself through law school, so I guess they really owe me)
I just recently moved back in with my mom after two years of living in my own place (only 20). Looking for a job currently and when I find one I won’t be paying rent because the understanding is that I’d be saving up to move out again.
You know, it might be my memory, but I don’t recall anyone saying “out at 18” in this thread and I’ve never known anyone to say that in real life, either. The OP has a 21 year old daughter, who has been working full-time and doesn’t think she should contribute to household expenses. While she occupies the only bedroom leaving the rest of the family to sleep in the living room and apparently not only believes her mother and stepfather should deny themselves extras as long as they are expecting her to contribute, but also has no problem expressing that belief. She’s not going to school and working part-time, going to school and working full-time to pay her tuition , or even working full time and paying off student loans. She wants to act as an adult ,have no curfew, and spend evenings out ( I presume that means overnight) , but be treated as a high-school student with a part-time job who works for spending money and is not expected to contribute to household expenses. She’s lucky she’s not my child. She wouldn’t have the option of living at home and contributing until after she had some real-world experience with roommates and landlords.
There’s nothing wrong with working toward generational upward mobility , and in fact, that’s what I wish for my kids. However, at some point, and I think the OP may be starting down that road, treating adult offspring as children is counter-productive. I’ll give an example. My husband has an acquaintance who continued to live with his parents, contributing nothing, after he was out of college and working full time. It’s true that he had a low paying job (which didn’t require a degree) and probably couldn’t afford to move out on that income, but it’s also true that living at home for free took away any motivation for him to get a better paying job. So he keeps this low-paying job for about 25 years, going on three or four week-long vacations a year, an equal number of weekend trips and buying whatever new electronic devices he wanted. His father retired and his parents then needed a small contribution ( a couple of hundred a month ) from him. Then they died within a few weeks of each other when he was about 45. The pension and social security checks stopped coming. He had to find a better paying job , and was only able to find work as a hospital orderly. He thinks the job is beneath him, as he has a college degree, but he hasn’t used it in 25 years, so it’s basically worthless. He resents that he can no longer afford to take so many vacations. He is envious of his friends and acquaintances , who earn much more than he does after having spent 25 years increasing their earnings. I don’t think his parents did him any favors - he’s certainly not happy.
I was forced to move out by 18 to make room for my siblings. Also because I was considered an adult at 18. My parents resonsibility ended then. I also had a brother that needed his own bedroom. I ended up buying my first home at 29.
My son stayed back twice due to a learning disabilty and he graduated at 20 so I only charged him 50 dollars a week. He was getting death benefits from his Dad. They ended at 18 so he started to pay. At 20 when he graduated he started paying half of everything. I bumped him up slowly as he went to 40 hours a week.
He moved in with a friend at 23 and at that point he was paying me 700 a month so he saved money by moving out. I also downsized at that time. He made the decision and it was what needed to happen. He was ready to leave the nest and it was hard to let him go but I knew it would be selfish to hang on to him.
He is 26 now and in his own home and nearby which is nice. I think for any parents out there that have adults living at home make them pay a fair rent. If they are working 40 hours they should pay for half and groceries. My son eats a lot compared to me. It also gives them incentive to save money by moving out. My son moved in with a buddy and his rent went down to 300 a month. He hated it so he got his own place but was prepared to pay his rent on time and at that point it was 750 month. Now he has a small monthly mortgage of 400 a month and his own home.
If I didn’t push him he would never be well off today.
This is how my parents were as well, which is why I left home at 18 and never went back. 14 years later I am an attorney, living with my boyfriend, and am very close with my parents. I don’t know why people are so afraid of making their kids actually grow up. Forcing them to be adults does not mean the end of a relationship. Once they grow up and realize why you did what you did, your relationship will be fine.
Rushgeekgirl, your daughter’s comments about you being a leech and the way you and your partner spend money are totally uncalled for. And why the hell are you giving this entitled little snot your room when she’s not even paying rent? And you wonder why she doesn’t seem to respect you? Quit being a doormat and make her fend for herself. You are not doing her any favors by continuing to coddle her well into adulthood at your own expense. Your comments about her being your “best friend” are also concerning. You’re not her best friend, you’re her mother. It is your responsibility to ensure she grows up to be a responsible, independent adult. Your actions thus far are not getting her any closer to that goal.
What was said about me being a leech happened in a heated moment. It was awful, obviously, but in 20 years she’s never said such a thing. I do think she’s going through that rebellious stage, and it’s probably about time for her to go.
I’m not ever going to kick her out. I mean, not with the way she is now. If things were much worse I’d do it in a second, but so far this has been the worst. I’m not defending her, I’m still hurt and she knows it but we had a long talk about her moving out yesterday. She doesn’t want to go; she is just freaking out because adulthood just kicked her in the ass. I set her straight about how I felt and let her know I would not be treated that way. We went through the home finances and she saw how she DOES help us out, and it’s not just “fun money” we’re taking from her. We adjusted how we deal with the finances. Now instead of handing me money every pay period she’ll be responsible for the lights and phone. It’s about fifty dollars less most months and I HOPE it will help her learn to turn off lights.
Yesterday she paid it for this month so we’re good.
I have reason to let her keep the bedroom. She’s always had a bedroom. We had one until Mig’s brother came to stay. That’s how we lost it; not because of her. She’d just spent money painting it and getting it just the way she always wanted it. I didn’t want to take that away from her. Besides, the living room is big enough for us to share with my other daughter for now. I’m hoping Mig’s brother won’t be here more than a year then maybe we’ll get our room back. The only reason I mention it is she DOES have a bedroom whereas we do not, so she has it pretty darned good, at least given the circumstances.
And I’m sorry, it may be weird are whatever, but I do consider her a friend. We’ve been through a lot together, in a way have grown up together. I was so young and immature when I had her. It’s hard to explain. I’ve always been in charge, she knew her limits as far as friendship went, but she’s always told everyone I was her best friend, and I had the same relationship with my own mother before she died.
I still don’t understand your living situation - do you live in a house or an apartment? Do you not have any say on who stays in your house/apartment? How does a brother-in-law kick you out of your own bedroom? How do you not have any say in how long he stays in your house?
Yeah, I don’t get that either. If I’m the one paying the rent, I’m the one in a bedroom. Weekend houseguests or whatever can stay in the bedroom, but someone staying with me for a year? They can sleep in the living room.
And your daugther is 21, not 12. That’s great that she got her room “just the way she wants it” but she’s not in high school anymore. She doesn’t have any kind of right to her own room in your home, where she doesn’t pay rent. Many people her age are living on their own. She should still either be paying rent or sleeping in the living room. Her present lack of maturity is a direct result of you continuing to coddle her well into adulthood.
I am quoting my first post here. If we could possibly keep it on topic instead of trying to find some way to ridicule ME for my living situation it would be just awesome.
I am not a doormat, so I’d appreciate it if I’m not accused of this here. I have a satisfactory reason for using the living room as my bedroom, and I made the decision to stay in this room, I wasn’t forced into it. It has a door for privacy, the best A/C in the house and has been perfectly fine as a bedroom. It’s not her throwing me out, it was my Mig, when he said “can we fit my brother here?” and I *happily *said, “Yes, he can have our room because the living room is much bigger and more convenient”. That’s how a practical decision was made. Not once have I said my child kicked me out of my own room. I was using the fact that she has a bedroom as part of the measure of how she should contribute.
And once again, like I said early on and also recently downthread reiterated she does contribute, but she has recently started complaining about the amount. I thought it was fair at the time and still do, but since she’s having some money problems after buying that car I wasn’t sure if the responsible thing would be make her pay what she has and let her struggle for gas and lunch money or go easy on her. When I decided to lecture her she blew up and said things I believe now she regrets. This is not making excuses for her. She fucked up. She knows she fucked up. And now we’re moving on. She’s paid her share, late but it’s paid. I think it was a lack of communication and her being immature that caused the blow-up. After we went through the bills and I made it clear how I DO contribute to the household even if I don’t pay money into it personally. She had this vision that I sit around the house all day playing video games and eating bonbons, which is ridiculous of course. She has been ungrateful and she is immature for a 21 year old. So what? I’m supposed to throw her ass out? I don’t think so. Anger and aggressive action aren’t warranted here. I don’t work that way. Charts and diagrams, maps and lists. That’s how I got her to see how things are supposed to work in a household.
I should have done it a long time ago, but I thought it was obvious. Live and learn.
As for how we live here, there is room, I am content having as much family as we can fit into our home, and I don’t excitedly wait for the situation to change. That part works just fine for me.
I don’t agree with how you’re handling this situation, or the way in which you’re handling your friendship/relationship with your daughter, but at least you sat her down and figured something out. What I’m wondering is whether you’ve gone through her finances and budget in order to figure out what she could be doing better? And whether she has a long-range plan (and motivation) to move out and grow up? Because if that latter piece is lacking, I hate to say it, but it’s your job to provide it. And the way things are right now, you’re not providing it.
I’m 28 and live at home. My situation is a little different than most people’s, though, since I stay at home more to assist my parents than vice versa. My parents are in terrible financial shape, and need the money I bring in to keep afloat, but I don’t pay a set amount; instead, I pay a couple bills that average out to roughly $300.00 a month.
This is to both our benefits, since this is cheaper than living on my own, but I resent it a little. I would really like to move out, but can’t because I’m concerned they’d lose the place, then there’s a good chance we’d wind up together again, but with my name on the lease instead of theirs.
35 Year Old only child chiming in. I never moved out and my parent’s don’t want me out. Originally I was here so someone would always be around for my grandmother and now I help my parents with things. I pay about 85 a week for a room, bathroom, internet, food and utilities.
I know I have it good and I am able to bring over anyone I want.
Are your folks signed up for elderly housing? I think they can apply at age 50? Sometimes the waiting list is a few years long but the apartments are nice and go according to your parents income. It is very little.
Just something that might help in your situation. Good Luck.
I wasn’t trying to ridicule you, either. It just appeared from your posts that you were playing the victim card a bit. It’s kind of like those parents whose children are terrors because they have no discipline, yet all they do is shrug their shoulders and claim “what can I do?” while continuing to refuse to discipline them. Your last post did shed some light on your situation though, thank you for sharing. I’m really glad you’re not sleeping on the couch in your own home, that was what bugged me the most.
It’s great that you were able to sit her down and explain why you need her contribution, although it still seems like you’re on the defensive with your daughter. For example, you mentioned that you went out of your way to show her that you contribute. Why do you have to justify yourself to her? She’s the adult, living essentially rent free in your house. You don’t have to justify a damn thing to her. The whole bit about having to show her that you need her contribution is also a little concerning. If she ever moves out of your place, is her landlord going to have to justify to her why he needs her rent? It just seems like she’s still not understanding the concept of having to pay your own way once you become an adult.
I really hope she eventually does get it, for both your sakes. Again, no one is ridiculing you. The way I read the posts, people are trying to help out of genuine concern.
I think mothers and daughters have a difficult time separating from each other. For some of us the only way we manage to untie the apron strings is through conflict.
You do word that so well. It is a growth process for both mother and daughter. It’s learning about what healthy love is between a parent and a child. And truth be told, there’s no manual to follow which will produce the desired results.
What we desire for our offspring can be part of the problem!
I had a similar situation for quite a while but time and trial and error resolved most of our issues. The important thing for me to remember was to never stop loving and remembering that loving doesn’t mean giving material things.
Many were the times when I was just standing by to help her pick up the pieces. It’s a painful thing for a parent to do. But young women can learn to cope if they know that they have emotional support at home.
The big fear for me was wondering if we allowed her to finally chose her edgy lifestyle she would flounder and fail. It’s a realistic fear in some situations. Had I succumbed to it I would have prevented her from gaining the strength and coping skills she learned from her hard knocks.
Chin up, Mom. Time can change a lot of things if you have a healthy sense of direction and good intentions. It’s courageous and wise to ask for others’ assessments, I think.
They have a mortgage on the place we live in, with twenty years still left on it, so I don’t think that’s an option, but thank you for the advice. I’ll eventually have to just move out, and help out where I can, but leave it up to them. I owe them a lot, obviously, but I have to live my own life as well.
My situation was kind of opposite. I was forced to live at home until I was 29. My mother paid for everything.
It was kind of an “empty nest syndrome” kind of thing. My older sister went off to college, so my mother freaked out and forced me to go to college near home. I hated living at home, so I told her if she wanted me to stay, she’d better pay my bills. If she ever gives me crap about the living arrangements or forces me to pay my own way, I’m dropping out of college, getting a full time job, and moving out.
Looking back, this was probably a dumb thing to do. I didn’t get my BA until I was 27 (my friend got his Ph. D. before I got my BA) and by the time I got married and finished my MA I was over 30. Now I’m almost 40, and I have just completed my adjunct experience about 2 years ago.
