fourth way enneagrams and their application to daily life.

Can anyone help me out with a better explanation of this application of enneagrams to processes?

I have a student who believes in this system, specifically as it applies to cognitive therapy, and I’d like to understand what the hell it’s all about.

The example they give didn’t help my understanding. Specifically:

-How does air “push” ordinary food’s evolution?
-It seems that 3 is a completely random point to put a stop point for a process. Why not 4? It seems like a point which is separated from 5 by more of a chasm.

I’m not sure if I believe in the credibility of this system or not as my belief process got stuck at 3 and needs a “push” (maybe by a cold beer?).

p.s. Should this be in the cafe forum?

(/me reads link)

Uh… bwah? Umm. That’s special…

I think you need a hell of a lot more than a beer for any of that to make sense. Probably some heavy duty hallucinogens, and a lot of weed.

Short answer: Somebody made something up, without worrying about any hint of connection to reality. If you try to read anything into it, you’ll go mad.

I believe the precise techical term for this is “a load of hoo-haw.”

Ouspensky is pretty much forgotten today but he’s one of the seminal crackpots of the 20th century.

I don’t know whether to recommend that you pat the kid on the head or crack it against a wall. He may be young enough to be saved.

Just out of curiosity . . . how on earth does it have any relevance to cognitive therapy? Is your student using the term “cognitive therapy” to mean something different than its normal usage?

Just to clarify, my student is an adult. I teach EFL in Chile (home of Claudio Naranjo who I blame for this madness). I think I would beat a 17-year-old about the head with wikipedia if I caught him spraying this in my direction.

And as it relates to cognitive therapy, I am pretty sure he’s using the term in the general sense, “Cognitive therapy seeks to help the client overcome difficulties by identifying and changing dysfunctional thinking, behavior, and emotional responses (wikipedia).” What exactly that dysfunctionality is, I suppose, could be interpreted in different ways. In his case (i think) he means that doing things that are “against your nature” are destructive and only through being conscious of this and your TRUE nature can you hope to “evolve” (I think he’s full of it).

As I say, I’m pretty sure this is a load of hooie, but I’d like to know if there have been any documented cases of effective application of this so I can truly say I kept an open mind about it.

How could there be any such? It’s pure gibberish from beginning to end.

I checked Martin Gardner’s Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science. His conclusion:

Ouspensky doesn’t even make it to the level of scientific crackpot!

The Enneagram can be useful if you don’t take it too literally (as, alas, some used to do at an online community I used to frequent). In a number of cases I’ve known people who fit the types to a T, as in me, Reformed Four, my Mom-Two, Dad-One, crazy ex-girlfriend (unhealthy Six), and sensible ex-girlfriend who became regular friend (Seven), but in other cases I’ve had to admit that I couldn’t shoehorn someone into the typology. There’s substantial overlap with the Myers-Briggs, and like that system it has its strengths, weaknesses, blind spots, and inconsistencies.

If you asked me if there’s Nine types, no more, no less, carved into stone, I’d have to say no. If you asked me if there’s Nine distinct ways in which a person can get overly attached to their viewpoints, perspectives, and obsessions, I’d say yes-but other ways undoubtedly exist as well. The genesis of the system, questionable at best, doesn’t mean that the types don’t exist and that you can’t get something out it (as I certainly did-at my worst I was all the way down at the bottom levels (scroll halfway down page), but I have learned quite a bit about myself since then and no longer really consider myself a Four for the most part.