Fox News and Milum

Milum has started this thread in GD, with the stated purpose of carrying on the “good discussion” from this thread. The topic? Why liberals hate Fox News. Milum has some ideas. I have chosen some of the more pugnacious examples and reproduced them below:

“Good discussion” my ass, Milum. This thread is shit. And the only reason you opened it was to stir up trouble. This is not a great debate. This is not a great anything. It’s shit. A steaming pile of useless, mindless, pointless shit. How do I know? Well, if you were serious about debating this, you wouldn’t have needed two posters to ask you to take a serious position on the topic. Here’s the final sentance from the “serious” proposition:

Are you fucking kidding me? Self-selected elite? Grand march towards socialism? What the hell are you smoking? When challanged on a point which appears to be presented with at least some amount of seriousness ("[A] shift in [the American people’s] prime source of information from traditional news to FOX…"), Milum responds by adding this challenge to a post which is no more than a summary of the thread up to that point, concluded with this zinger:

Poor baby. Can I help you with that cross, dipshit? Milum also gives a “response” to Soup_du_jour in the same post:

Soup’s post won’t be making any best-of threads anytime soon. But at least he gives a reason for hating Fox News. Which is what the OP asked for. But instead of responding to someone who answered the fucking question in his own damn OP, Milum dismisses the post with a sarcastic remark.

Finally, Chefguy and 'possum stalker arrive to inject some sense into this poor excuse for a debate:

You’re not doing yourself any favors with this one, Milum. What compelled you to post such a thread?

Every single time I’ve seen Milum post, he’s been full of shit, in tone alone if not in both tone and content.

Ooo! I don’t like it here in the Pit. Most of the people here seem lacking in the most elemetry of refindments. Hey you! You over there! You seen** cheddarsnax**? No, I don’t want to fight, dumbass , I just want to know if you’ve seen cheddarsnax…yeah? well UP YOURS TOO BUDDY!.. damn punk kid.

Hmmm…looks like everyone here is a young buck. Little boy bulls looking for a fight. Say boo and they’ll scatter like flies. Hell, I was a kid once…walking around saying “fuck” and puffing up and kicking stray cats… hey you…laying on the floor, you seen cheddarsnax? …no man I ain’t holding…Oh yeah? Thanks man, I owe you…(walks over to a disheveled guy standing unsteadily against the far wall of the pit.)

Hey cheddarsnax! (shaking hands) Boy am I glad to see to see you. You won’t believe the wierdos and crackheads I’ve meet down here in this godforsaken pit. So tell me man…whats up?

cheddarsnax: Oh hi Milum, good to see you. Yeah. kinda seedy crowd down here…uh Mr. Milum, I, uh, was sorta disappointed in what you said in Great debates. I…uh…thought is was…uh…shit.

Milum: shit?

cheddarsnax: Yeah, you know, like you said mean things to Chefguy and 'possum stalker.

Milum: Gee whiz ched, I didn’t mean no harm. Shoot I’m a bit opinionated but heck, I figger that most folks can defend themseves, besides when a man’s alone with a pack of ankle-snipping dogs you have to kick one every now and then to make your point.

** cheddarsnax**: Well Milum you certainly didn’t make any new friends with that post. Whatever compelled you to post such a thread?

Milum: You know cheddarsnax, when that Administrator cut off the Great Debates thread after she banned the Troll without so much as a how-you-do, I got mad. It just wasn’t right not to let good standing members continue to voice their opinions just to punish the troll.
So help me cheddarsnax, if I had it to do over I’d let the thread die and try to understand the points of my buddies the liberals. Friends? (smiles… extends hand.)

** cheddarsnax**: ( looks at Milum’s extended hand warily, then smiles and stands up and embraces Milum and says…) Friends.

And then the two newly found friends, one a fire breathing liberal, and one a mild mannered reformed conservative, walk together out from the dreariness of the dark dank pit and back again into the sunlit world of the Great Debates.
___The End

Let me advance a humble proposal.

When one of our brethren in these boards asks a question that appears to be directed more toward garnering justification for facts assumed by the question than toward actually having an honest debate, the appropriate course is to let someone else step into the septic pit to do battle. Our friend’s “why do liberals do one thing or another” questions exist for the sole purpose of getting fellow posters to tacitly admit that liberals do indeed do one thing or another, not to try to find out why that might happen.

It is like flinging feces back at the residents of the monkey house–it entertains the Hell out of the monkeys but you end up covered with monkey shit. Arguing questions that assume a false premise is not a productive activity. Don’t do it.

It’s the “politics of personal destruction.”

Or, as GWB might say, “Heh.”

Why not just debate Fox News without having to define what an undefined class of people (liberals) thinks? If being conservative means sucking up to Republican leadership, I’m a liberal. If being a liberal…

What’s a “liberal”? Is it anything like a heffalump?

Thanks, cheddarsnax, this is a well deserved pitting.

Milum, you did not provide any substance to support your assertion that Fox News is unbiased. In fact in your first post, you didn’t even take a position. Instead you phrased your attack as a loaded question. You may not see this as a problem, especially if you are a fan of the “debate” style of Bill O’Reilly. In real debates, however, it is necessary to state a view and support it with actual evidence.

Your second post (“Resolved…”) is actually a substantial improvment, despite the sarcasm. You stated an actual viewpoint, namely that “FOX refects a basic need of the american people to extract accurate information from the outside events…”

Why is it necessary to state a viewpoint? If you never state a view, you are never wrong. You, in essence, risk nothing. You ask your opponent to defend a viewpoint, while you never attempt to defend your own, since you have not stated one. It is a rather dishonest debating tactic

Stating a viewpoint is only part debating, however. You must also defend your viewpoint with facts. In some cases, you may even be required to give evidence that your facts are true. If your opponent makes an argument which is contrary to your own, it is necessary to demonstrate that either (i) You opponent has faulty premises or (ii) your opponent used faulty logic.

Note that demonstrating means making a convincing case for, or otherwise showing. It does not mean simply asserting.

Does that clarify the issues for you?

Milum, insead of saying you know this already, how about showing me by putting it into practice. Will we see you back in The GD thread?


So, Milum, have you stopped beating your wife?

This is cracking my shit up, for obvious reasons.

Milum is a prime example of a pop-con.

Pop-con is the political equivalent of pop-music.

This little bit from the Weekly Standard editor David Skinner nicely sums up "pop-con"ism as opposed to some of the other, more thoughtful and realistic form of conservatism.

Milum is a pop-con.


remeber, you heard it here first

Hmm. Thread’s locked. I guess not.

So far, it just sounds like he’s full of crap.

Okay. Here’s a better reason why I hate Fox News.

An interesting Op-Ed appeared in the Washington Post a few days back. Apparently, watching Fox News makes you less informed about current events.

(A pseudo-registration is required to view the article.)

Fox News does a markedly poor job in informing its viewership of what is going on in the world, which is what a news organization is supposed to do. That’s good enough for me.

Interesting numbers, Soup. Thanks.

Damn** short**, you were right, the damn feds have closed the damn thread. Hmm…I guess I’ll just hav’ta stay down here in the damn pit until the damn question at damn hand recieves some sort of damn resolution. (hey! This is fun!)

Ok boys and girls, gloves off. On the advice of others here I will draw back, rephrase the question, gather some selected opinions from self-important people that many of you people call cites of facts, and then return again to this vulgar pit throwing beer bottles and kicking tables. See you in the PM. ---- Milum

At some point, Milum, you might pause to wonder whether there is a reason why people keep calling you an idiot.

It’s because we’re all stupid liberals who hate him for shining the light of truth in the dark, murky recesses of our cowardly, America-hating ways. Yessss, we hates nasty Milum, we doesssss, gollum, gollum…

Milum is a pointless, boring bullshitter. Don’t pay attention, and maybe he’ll go away.

Yep… I agree with the above posters. Besides if Fox News is unbaised and balanced and center… wow… give me Goebbels again for some nice right wing stuff.

Christ Milum… what Socialism in the US ?

Wow. It’s been a while since we’ve encountered anyone as self-important as you…