Fucking Scottish Housebuying Mcbollocks

The BBQ Pit
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WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY is the process of buying a house in Scotland so completely and totally fucked and skewed towards driving house buyers out of their tiny mortgaged minds?

What fuckwit in his cunting wankstained empty fart-rattling bowel of a mind thought up this deranged process?! WANKERS! (I don’t really want to know who thanks very much potential googlers)

Here’s what has driven me round the arsewiping bend

>See a house - house says (for example) ‘offers over £140,000’ deadline 2 Aug 12 noon.
>You can only make an offer if a)you have had a survey done and b)you have finance in place
>When offers are made, you can only put in one offer, they are all anonymous and the seller picks which one they want. You cannot then raise your bid. Yep you read me right - you have to guess a figure, pay to make your bid, then you might miss out by a couple of grand you could have been willing to pay. Oh - and you can’t pull out once you’ve made an offer.

Its much much much more complicated than this, but I truly cannot be arsed/have the skills to explain this massive mire of misery, as I keep finding even more jewels of bureaucratic crap buried in our mountain of paperwork 'Och did we not tell you you have to wear a yellow shirt and hop on one leg singing Kumbaya while making the offer? Well its in the law, so you have to pay a penalty of 8 lashings and another £250… ’ oh just FUUUCK OFF.you thieving pestilant scourge of my bank account.

Its FUCKED UP. What it basically means is we HAVE to sell our place in London and wait until that has finalised and we have the money (and are effectively homeless), before we can even start LOOKING for a place in Scotland - which means we have to rent for 6 months, because that’s the minimum lease period I can find.

It seems purposefully designed to make people wall-bitingly furious. I’m now on my 3rd mobile phone (GGAAAAAAAAH smash x2), we’re too stressed to shag so I’M NOT GETTING IT DAMMIT, and I swear I caught the cats laughing at me when I dropped my breakfast this morning. Bastards.

aaaaaahhhhhh

Venting has made me feel much better. Thank you for your time.

Linky McLinky explaining the system

http://www.primelocation.com/legal-and-surveying/buying-in-scotland/

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[QUOTE=yingtongtiddleipo]
You cannot then raise your bid. Yep you read me right - you have to guess a figure, pay to make your bid, then you might miss out by a couple of grand you could have been willing to pay.
[/QUOTE]
Then you should have bid that other couple of grand, shouldn’t you? That’s the whole point.

I’m not denigrating the hassle you’re experiencing, but the non-legally-binding aspect of the English process is even more of a cunt of a thing. Having been gazundered recently, the Scottish legal lock-in is a much better system.

But I do think there should be one independent survey provided by a non-interested party (that you can ignore if you wish and have your own done) rather than one per buyer. Fucking scam innit.

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Currently planning to buy in Scotland after selling in ENgland.

IMHO the Scottish system is simpler, fairer, cheaper, easier and better in all respects than the current English system. Add a home sellers pack to the system and it would be near perfect.

Most of what you are complaining about is the transfer from the English to Scottish system. Buying and selling within Scotland is simple- blind auction around a guide price, no gazumping or gazundering and contracts that are immediately binding with an agreed completion date.

Need I list the major problems with the English system?

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Hi JJimm,

I hear you - and it would be gutting to be gazumped. Its coping with the mixed inadequacies of both systems that has my hair falling out on the pillow!

£250 to put a bid in (roughly). Each and every time. Then the heart-ripping process of waiting to see if your bid is accepted on the day. It can be truly heartbreaking.

I wish there was some way of combining the best of both systems.

and yep - it is a fuckin scam!!

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[QUOTE=yingtongtiddleipo]
When offers are made, you can only put in one offer, they are all anonymous and the seller picks which one they want. You cannot then raise your bid. Yep you read me right - you have to guess a figure, pay to make your bid, then you might miss out by a couple of grand you could have been willing to pay. Oh - and you can’t pull out once you’ve made an offer.
[/QUOTE]

I have to admit that the US system seems somewhat more fair than this. You make an offer (non-anonymous) and the sellers can then make a counter-offer. Granted, there’s some headology involved here as well, and you can get shut out by a higher bidder, but at least there’s some back and forth.

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[QUOTE=Pjen]
Currently planning to buy in Scotland after selling in ENgland.

IMHO the Scottish system is simpler, fairer, cheaper, easier and better in all respects than the current English system. Add a home sellers pack to the system and it would be near perfect.

Most of what you are complaining about is the transfer from the English to Scottish system. Buying and selling within Scotland is simple- blind auction around a guide price, no gazumping or gazundering and contracts that are immediately binding with an agreed completion date.

Need I list the major problems with the English system?
[/QUOTE]

No you don’t need too - but I would be really interested in hearing your experiences. You’re planning to buy - have you started the process yet? Have you seen a property you like/made a bid? I’m ego-free when it comes to learning all I can about making this easier, and I’d welcome hearing how you’ve gone about it, and remained so keen on the system!

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[QUOTE=yingtongtiddleipo]
No you don’t need too - but I would be really interested in hearing your experiences. You’re planning to buy - have you started the process yet? Have you seen a property you like/made a bid? I’m ego-free when it comes to learning all I can about making this easier, and I’d welcome hearing how you’ve gone about it, and remained so keen on the system!
[/QUOTE]

It has taken some time to sell our place in England- we have been renting here for eighteen months. Once the house is sold, we will be on an even playingfield with other Scots. Without bridging finance there is no way to move between the English and Scottish systems.

We have seen a range of properties, but we are in no hurry. Rental is so inexpensive, we may just bank the capital for a couple of years.

Then it’s simply finding a place and bidding. Many properties are listed as fixed price- first come first served, and others will accept the first offer- the market is quite slow and there are not always more than one bidder. If the ads stste ‘Fixed Price’ or ‘Offers Around’ that usually means a paucity of interest in that property. Check to see which properties have been on the market for more than six months. There is a tendency to not lower the price but wait for an enquiry about the acceptability of a lower offer. Scottish solicitors seesm more willing to be honest about the reality of the situation than English ones. They see it as there duty to sell the house for the client, rather than to gouge the highest price. If you discuss the possibility of an underbid on a property that has attracted little interst, they will suggest whether it would be likely to be accepted. If you make such an offer on an ‘Offers Around’ property, they would probably fix a selling date and if yours was the only offer, then it would be successful.

Best of Luck.

Where are you moving to. We are in the Socialist Republic of South West Scotland.

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[QUOTE=Pjen]

Best of Luck.

Where are you moving to. We are in the Socialist Republic of South West Scotland.
[/QUOTE]

Thanks Pjen - all advice appreciated.

We’re moving to the highlands - specifically Moray. I really like Fochabers/Elgin, and my parents live in Nairn (close, but not too close). I want to avoid Inverness if possible, as I think I can get a better deal if I head to the east a bit more.

I think our choice of location has hindered us - our problem really has been a lack of properties to buy up there, followed by intense competition on anything that looks remotely desirable. The last property we looked at and made an offer on had 26 viewings and 13 offers (we found out after the fact - of course we wouldn’t have even bothered putting in a bid if we knew it was that popular - bids even came in from Australia and Switzerland). I’m also looking into the possibility of buying land and building a finlodge too, as my Dad and I have experience with building.

http://www.scottishfield.co.uk/news/fullstory.php/aid/287/Finlodge_1.html

On the upside I can rent a 3 bedroom house for £600 pm. So (everything crossed here) we’ll still be spending Christmas in Scotland.

Good luck yourself when you do come to buy.

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[QUOTE=yingtongtiddleipo]
Well its in the law, so you have to pay a penalty of 8 lashings and another £250
[/QUOTE]

Who gets this money?

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[QUOTE=acsenray]
Who gets this money?
[/QUOTE]

You have to pay to make an offer - its for a valuation survey, and solicitors fees. I think the solicitor pays the surveyor. In between counting his piles of gold!

You don’t really get lashings.

Well - not unless you ask nicely.

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Question: when you say “process”, is this legally mandated? Or just the tradition / established way of doing things?

Here in the US, most people go through a realtor, and thus have to follow a somewhat strict process (you can’t negotiate directly with the seller), but you are free to sell your house on your own and tell the realtors to get lost.

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Those are my ancestors, a race who invented golf and distill a beverage that tastes like smoked peat.

I’m only surprised that it is as easy as you make it sound.

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[QUOTE=Absolute]
Question: when you say “process”, is this legally mandated? Or just the tradition / established way of doing things?

Here in the US, most people go through a realtor, and thus have to follow a somewhat strict process (you can’t negotiate directly with the seller), but you are free to sell your house on your own and tell the realtors to get lost.
[/QUOTE]

I think its much the same in Scotland (if anyone knows better feel free to say), but I think its still pretty rare to handle a sale yourself.

Thanks for the post btw - I’ll look for private sales too now.

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The up- and down-sides of varous house selling methods are quite fascinating.

I’ve always thought that the practice of auctioning houses, fairly common in Australia (at least when i lived there), is a reasonably good combination of transparency and fairness.

There is a viewing period (usually a few weeks), during which interested parties can view the house, get valuations and inspections done, etc., etc. Then the house goes up for auction. The seller has the option of setting a reserve price, and if the bidding doesn’t reach the reserve then the seller is under no obligation to sell, but can enter into private negotiations with the highest bidder to see if they can agree on a price.

If, on the other hand, the bidding does reach the reserve, the seller is then undr obligation to sell the house to the highest bidder for the amount of the bid. The highest bidder is also obliged to hold up his/her end of the deal.

The advantage of the system is that it locks the seller into selling once the house reaches a certain price, and he can’t just back out if he feels that he might get more next week or next month. And, by having all the bidders together, it allows each potential buyer to see what others are willing to pay, rather than making the sort of blind bids that the OP is worried about.

Of course, there are potential ptifalls too. For example, there have been cases where the realtors or the owners place dummy bidders in the room in an affort to drive the price up. This can, of course, backfire, but in a competitive market it can also artificially inflate the price of the house.

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[QUOTE=yingtongtiddleipo]

>See a house - house says (for example) ‘offers over £140,000’ deadline 2 Aug 12 noon.
>You can only make an offer if a)you have had a survey done and b)you have finance in place
>When offers are made, you can only put in one offer, they are all anonymous and the seller picks which one they want. You cannot then raise your bid. Yep you read me right - you have to guess a figure, pay to make your bid, then you might miss out by a couple of grand you could have been willing to pay. Oh - and you can’t pull out once you’ve made an offer.
[/QUOTE]

Eh, it’s been a while since I bought but I’m not sure that’s all 100% true. First that’s just one way it can be done, as others have mentioned you get fixed price (i.e. first person to stump up the cash gets the house).

Second, not all sales go to an auction showdown. If you offer lots of money for a place the owners can agree to sell you it, as long as they haven’t already offered it to someone else. Normally when someone makes an offer the owner (or their solicitor) contacts other interested parties and gives them a deadline to make an offer but it’s possible to talk to the sellers and some will give you a feel for what would be a ‘done-deal’ price. Of course they might still invite other offers and you might get out bid.

As far as I know the offers aren’t anonymous, or certainly don’t need to be. A seller is under no obligation to take the highest offer and may take a lower offer from someone they liked better. More normally people might take an lower offer from people who’s moving timescale matches theirs better.

And yes, you do miss out, I think I went through five offers before I got one accepted but on my final offer I changed solicitors and I think that helped a lot, the first set where shocking.

Your solicitor should know how much is a decent offer, and they’ll also have an idea of how much other interest there is. If you’re willing to pay the extra few thousand and there’s other people interested then you’ve got to make the higher offer.

I also don’t think you need to do things through an agent, but the chances are you’ll screw something up if you don’t. It’s also possible sellers will not deal with you if you’re not acting through an official.

Finally, although you’ll need to pay solicitors fees up front you don’t need to get a survey done. I’ve seen plenty of places offered on ‘subject to survey’, this would make your offer less inviting than other offers but it’s perfectly possibly.

SD

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Meant to add:

However it works it’s still a stressful process and there’s so much that can get screwed up.

So best of luck to yingtongtiddleipo and everyone else selling or buying a property anywhere.