…keep on ignoring the context of my quote. My response was appropriate, and not specific to you. Your version of the conspiracy theory is actually funnier and more baseless than the one in the OP.
And all the actual evidence says “NO.”
It isn’t a message to the 4Chan meanies. It was a message to the people in the industry, on the periphery of the industry, and those that are thinking about becoming part of the industry. Dismissing that as a “feel good” gesture is moronic.
If anything its attitudes like yours that are worse than those of blindboyard and his ilk. At least there prejudices are out in the open. We know they are morons.
Feel free to keep harping on about how bad a game Depression Quest is. You are entitled to your opinion. I’m not going to disagree with it. But in the context of the current conversation you are standing on the sidelines along with the bullies throwing stones, accusing the other side of worshipping an emperor with no clothes. As the Hamster King says: “The quality of Depression Quest is immaterial.” We get that you don’t like it. But this isn’t about a “bunch of people so desperate to show how evolved they are that they’ll praise any piece of shit that comes down the line that they can pass off as socially important.” The narrative you are working too is simply wrong.
No, moronic is pretending that it means anything. Hey, maybe next week you guys can get 2,400 signatures to stop that Kony guy.
Yeah, God forbid anyone call out a shitty game for being a shitty game. Oh, but it’s about depression and the person who made it was harassed so let’s treat it like it’s a Real important Game.
It’s entirely important if you’re discussing why it received fawning reviews, even reviews saying ‘It’s not a fun game or a well made game but it’s So Important.’ (note the single quotes there as a paraphrase). I understand that no one wants to just admit that it’s shit. It seems crass to admit it when talking about harassment. So we have people on this very thread saying ‘I never played it and never will play it but some reviews said it’s Really Important so…’
Listen, if no one can defend why it’s a worthwhile game beyond “But it’s about depression!” then that’s the definition of giving it high praise only because they want to be seen praising something as socially relevant. You want to give “evidence” that this isn’t the case? Fine, show me the reviews praising the facets of it that aren’t “It’s about depression”.
And that’s the problem: you think your magic fucking 8-ball is a good source of evidence, or failing that, whatever SooperSpeshul Mindreading Powers you’re exercising to tell why people are giving the game favorable press, instead of taking them at their word when they describe specific value they find in the game.
To put it gently, fuck your Magic 8-ball, it means nothing. NOTHING!
Genuine coverage of a game =/= “free advertisement”. Game journalists might not be the most serious bunch, but they don’t look at what they do as advertisement. In fact, I can’t think of a faster way to get me to bin an email from a PR person than by starting it with “Can you help us get the word out…”
If that was all that was happening, no one would care. The problem is not that people are calling Depression Quest a shitty game. The problem is that its creator has been the subject of an ongoing campaign of smear and harassment for weeks. Death threats, rape threats, hacking, theft of personal information – the attacks on Quinn have been so outrageous and over the line that the actual quality of her game is immaterial at this point.
And, in any case, if your claim is that reviewers aren’t doing their jobs, then your beef should be with THEM, not Quinn. Why is SHE the focus of the GamerGate rage and not the reviewers who gave her good reviews?
…the evidence that this isn’t about this isn’t about a “bunch of people so desperate to show how evolved they are that they’ll praise any piece of shit that comes down the line that they can pass off as socially important.” If you want to know what Gamergate is about, read the OP. If you think that what the OP wrote is so ridiculous that no-one could take it seriously: then guess again. It isn’t about what you want it to be.
As I said your full of shit. The attacks on Zoe have bought about a fresh wave of attacks on many other people in the industry. A gaming journalist quit a few days ago because of this. The industry needed to make a stand and draw a line in the sand to say these attacks were unacceptable. If doing that stops at least one more person dropping out of the industry then that is a good thing.
You are missing the point. Gamergate is **about **the harassment. Not just Zoe and not just Anita. You can attempt to reframe the issue as much as you like. But the issue isn’t the quality of the game, but the issues that people have to deal with if they want to work in the gaming industry. This all came to a head because of the attacks on Zoe, but it certainly wasn’t how it started, and it isn’t the only attack that needs to be addressed.
Can you be specific which fawning reviews you disagree with? And what you think they got wrong? And why these fawning reviews are representative of the industry?
“The quality of Depression Quest is immaterial.”
Gamergate is not about Depression Quest. If you want to review it then you would be better off opening a thread in the gaming forum. But if you want to slag off the reviewers, then at least make the effort to call out specific reviewers rather than making generic and open claims.
Given that you’ve never played the game and won’t play the game, your opinion on the validity of its reviews is even more worthless than anything I (who actually has played it) would have to say on the topic.
Who said I was speaking for GamerGate? Your problem is that you’re so upset about one issue that you want to lump every other criticism into the same thing. Hence people’s inability to separate the quality from the game vs its reviews from the harassment. Which leads to criticism about the game being responded to with “It doesn’t matter because harassment!”
Not to the topic I was discussing but it seems that dodging that is all people have left. Actually addressing it would lead to admitting some uncomfortable truths about its praise. Understood.
No need to say it, I already know… “Please, please, please stop talking about this. It’s immaterial!”
Bullshit. I’ve read the reviews, and I’m not convinced you have; instead, you’ve basically called the reviewers liars, based on two pieces of evidence:
They disagree with you; and
Your Magic 8-ball.
Those are both super-shitty pieces of evidence, and you should be embarrassed to bring such weak game.
The alternate hypothesis is that they found value in a work that you didn’t find value in. That’s what Jragon is happy to admit, and that’s why his personal reaction to the game, essentially identical to your personal reaction to the game, isn’t stupid: he doesn’t universalize it and then assume that anyone who claims a different reaction is lying.
And get out of here with that lame bullshit about how your suspicions of respected writers is the same as my suspicion of user reviews that mention raping Quinn. If you can’t see the difference, you’re a goddamned moron.
No, nobody thinks that 100% of the negative reviews are 4Chan dumbshits. But the huge number of reviews for a very small indie title is suspicious, as is the huge number of reviews that fantasize about raping the developer, don’tcha think? It’s almost enough to make one think the user-review system is unreliable for this game.
…this thread is about Gamergate. Since your very first post in this thread you’ve been trying to reframe what Gamergate is about. But your initial assertion was bollocks.
Now which praise are you talking about? Can you be specific or not?
I was previously when I quoted the Wikipedia reaction piece.
This thread is about GamerGate which is a direct spin-off of the Five Guys thing which was directly related the press and reviews regarding Depression Quest. I know it would be nice if you could just silence any criticism with “Irrelevant because harassment!” but life doesn’t always work out that way.
That said, Blindboyard started the thread so I’ll let him determine if my input is germane or not to his thread. If he prefers I not mention it, I’ll stop.
…which specific review do you take issue with and why?
Who is trying to silence your criticism?
You can keep criticising as much as you like. But it is irrelevant to the issue at hand. Telling you that what you are saying is irrelevant is not an attempt to silence you, its telling you what you are talking about is irrelevant.
If Depression Quest had been a game you had actually enjoyed and was what you regarded to be a good game, do you think GamerGate would have still happened?
You are your own person you know. You don’t need someone elses approval to post on a messageboard. I’m sure blindboyard doens’t approve of my posts, but that won’t stop me posting here.
Indeed. Some of Jophiel’s criticisms are within the realm of legitimate criticism: he doesn’t like text-heavy games, for example, and if I don’t care for them either, that’s helpful information. He finds the style of writing to be inelegant, and if I find that I agree with him in general about writing styles, again, that’s some good criticism.
In a similar fashion, some of the positive reviews are helpful. People with depression have said that the game succeeded at describing some aspects of depression, and if I’m interested in seeing what a successful description (according to these reviewers) looks like, that’s helpful. Several reviews have described the mechanic of offering several choices but making the most sensible choices unavailable as a way to illustrate the crippling effects of depression; if I like such mechanics, that’s a helpful aspect of the review.
Both good and bad reviews may be constructive.
BUT THOSE AREN’T THE REVIEWS WE’RE TALKING ABOUT.
Some of the reviews have fantasized about raping Zoe Quinn. Those are not constructive reviews unless I’m a big fan of being a slut-shaming asshole. Some have mentioned wanting to eat burgers. Those are not constructive reviews unless in my emotionally stunted bitter state I think that transparent references to being a slut-shaming asshole are the height of wit. Some reviews just say that the game is garbage (and theoretically some reviews might just say the game is awesome). Those are not constructive reviews unless I choose games based on Internet polls.
Too many of the reviews of this game are obviously not genuine, but rather are written by anonymous jerkwads on the Internet.
THOSE ARE THE REVIEWS WE’RE TALKING ABOUT.
Jophiel, when people tell you reviews aren’t the point, you’re missing the point. The reviews that are constructive, whether positive or negative toward the game, are fine (although I think you’re an idiot for having a Magic 8-ball tell you that reviewers who disagree with you are lying). It’s the reviews whose only content involve sexual references that are what we’re talking about.
blindboyard is a useless sack of shit MRA troll with a massive inferiority problem. Any constructive, or even entertaining discussion in this thread arises not because of him but despite him.
“Harassment is bad.”
“But what if they self-published a game I don’t happen to enjoy?”
“Harassment is bad.”
“But what if they have had sex?”
“Harassment is bad.”
“But what about my video-game journalism conspiracy theory?”
“Harassment is bad.”
“But what if I hate PC bullshit?”
“Harassment is bad.”
Outside of maybe a few serious crimes, nobody deserves death threats, etc. Nobody. That’s why nobody is interested in using this as a serious example of anything. You may have opinions on the video ge industry or whatever, but an ordinary civilian who is being seriously harassed is not the right platform for them, and trying to tie it all together on a boring-game-five-guys-journalism-PC- slut mess isn’t working.
No one has claimed otherwise (I’ve only said this like a dozen times now) but since this is all that can be repeated, over and over, I’m happy to leave you guys to repeating it. Have fun, maybe go Like a Facebook status later to show you mean business.