All details that can be worked out, and which SHOULD BE worked out so that we ALWAYS err on the side of COUNTING EVERY LEGITIMATE VOTE.
Asshole.
There probably are situations where our ideals are impractical, certain exceptions, certain improbable situations that even our good intentions cannot erase. And so it goes.
But that’s not what this is about. This is about people using the power of the law to gain an undeserved advantage.
I’ve been working this pop stand for forty years. Lost some fights, sure. Got the living snot kicked out of us, sure. If we haven’t changed enough minds, well, all right, gotta work harder. If an honest count of the people says we lose, we lose, and so be it. That’s democracy, and democracy doesn’t make promises. You always pay for what you get, but you don’t always get what you pay for. Can’t handle it, take up knitting.
Take this Husted guy, review his recent antics, and you’re stuck with it, he is blatantly, publicly and baldly trying to jigger the elections in Ohio. Either so Romney will win or because Satan told him to, whatever. Couldn’t hardly be more flagrant. And he’s gonna get away with it. He might get his fingers slapped by the courts, but he’s a Name now, a player. The guys who write the checks purr with porky approval.
Losing is bitter enough, being cheated right before your very eyes is a whole 'nother.
An absentee vote where the signature doesn’t match isn’t legitimate.
Idiot.
Guy appears to be a cheating, possibly criminal arsehole. I’m not in Ohio, so me saying that probably won’t count for anything.
I will say that this is another issue that would be solved by a single, universal form of ID. There would be no confusion about what was used, or how it was recorded.
Okay, you blithering idiot. You just say that your suggested “solution” can have all the details worked out. Come on, I asked how you’re going to work out one detail. Surely you can do that, right? Let me lay out the reality for you since you apparently don’t know WTF you’re blathering about:
- American citizen.
- Votes via absentee ballot.
- Some bureaucrat in the office responsible for conductng the elections has determined that the legitimate voter’s absentee voter isn’t valid.
- By some miracle, the legislature has passed a law implementing your “solution” and the aforementioned citizen now has an opportunity to make an oath in person, as you suggested earlier.
- Said citizen is living overseas–that’s why there was that nifty absentee ballot in the first place for this person.
- Same citizen happens to be living a four hour train ride away from the nearest American government entity.
- There is no American government presence reasonably close to the American citizen. Who, then, will witness the oath/affirmation? Does this citizen just grab some random person off the street who, of course, has no connection with the US?
- What presence there is in the country in which the citizen finds himself or herself happens to take both US and host country holidays off, further limiting the time available to appear in person at a US government office.
Got the situation now? Are you clear on this? Can you process the English words that should now appear on your screen?
Here’s the question: How is that citizen supposed to make an oath or affirmation in person abou the ballot and how does the responsible office determine that oath/affirmation is also valid?
And you call me an asshole for asking a quite reasonable and logical question about what you seem to think is just a minor detail?
Wow, sounds great! What, do I brandish it in his face, force him into the sunlight, like Peter Cushing did to Christopher Lee, so that he dissolves into necrotic cocaine? Do I need my Armor of Democracy +5?
So I have this Amulet of Positive Identification, and sleazy power-mad assholes will suddenly turn into Maya Angelou? I can’t stand her, but it would sure serve him right!!
I admit I am a little concerned that all but three of the swing states have Republican election commissioners, especially in the wake of power outages, curfews, and gas shortages.
Oddly, in the midst of newly-created stringent ID laws, Republican Governor Chris Christie undermines “confidence in the vote” by allowing people in his state to vote by email or fax. I’m sure we’ll be hearing from Bricker post haste to wail and rend his clothing at his unfathomable fear. I hope he can survive it, poor dear.
If that’s how you think politics works, it would explain most of your otherwise incomprehensible posts on the subject.
I see my sarcasm has confused you. My years here have given me some insight on the travails of the humor impaired, so permit me to clarify.
Like so many, you keep returning to the same theme, that somehow the argument is really about the validity of voter id, if you can just prove that point, you win. But the argument is about using voter id as a cover, like a sheer negligee on a leprous whore. Its about corrupt and power hungry politicians using that issue to grant themselves political power that is not legitimate.
Your response suggests that the strict voter id requirements will somehow solve that problem. Kick out the prop, so to speak. But that will only work if they stop, that will only work if they cannot come up with something else. Can you offer us some reason to believe that? Or will you fall back to pretending that what we are really against is voter id, rather than the malicious use of the issue.
Its like we are trapped in a room with a meth-addled chimp pounding a simian version of “Chopsticks” on a grand piano, and you want to talk about how we are opposed to pianos.
Any such problems in the future, do bring it up, I’m here to help.
Yes, actually I do believe that taking action to make it easy for people to unambiguously identify themselves would help to stop crooked politicians exploiting those ambiguities.
For some reason, you’re against that simple solution that most countries (sadly not mine though) have employed.
I can condemn crooked politicians again, if you like. Crooked politicians are bad. Faking, stealing, or denying votes is bad. Breaking electoral laws to benefit your side is bad.
Excellent! Then all you have to do is list for us the many, many ways that Republicans behind these efforts are bending over backwards to make such id easily available to our least advantaged citizens.
No doubt, you have literally dozens of these to offer, so take your time, don’t let the crickets bother you.
Look yonder, a strawman!
That the Republicans aren’t doing enough to get ID to everyone doesn’t mean that the idea of universal ID is a bad one.
“Not doing enough”? You have a genius for euphemism.
Last night, I met a chap who believes that the Secretary of State of Ohio will refuse to certify the results of the election, if Obama wins the state.
I don’t think that would happen, even if Ohio happened to be the make-or-break state. I don’t think their SoS would flirt that closely with high treason.
I’m open to conspiracy charges of lesser magnitude. I can buy that their SoS might be complicit in a bias involving vote counting, or is engaging in voter suppression. But does anyone else here think that anyone in that high a position would involve themselves in corruption of that kind?
Has anyone thought about the possibility of the poll workers who are supposed to help the voters fill out provisional ballots being Husted’s cronies? What happens then? Will there be lawyers watching the poll workers? It is sad that America has come to this. My wife will be a first time voter and sadly, this is how she will remember the voting process. As Thomas Roberts from MSNBC said, and I quote, “is this 2012 America or 1912 America?”
The man is a monument to raw cynical chutzpah. Katherine Harris of Florida is a shrinking violet by comparison. Have you seen the pictures of people waiting in line for hours and hours to vote early?
I’ve been watching his shenanigans for weeks now, and my chin is developing a callous from jaw-dropping. Apparently, they can only hope to win Ohio by cheating, by artificially restricting the Dem vote count, one way or the other. There isn’t even a shred of plausible deniability left, he simply doesn’t care.
Conservative, my ass! Barry Goldwater will rise from the grave, puke his guts out and swim out to sea to sink.
THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT VOTER ID. PLEASE TAKE THAT CONVERSATION TO THE OTHER THREADS THAT EXIST ABOUT THAT TOPIC. THANK YOU.
Yes.
It’s like a giant game of keep-away, with the voters in the middle. The republicans are using the law to keep the vote away.
It may be legal, but it sure ain’t right.
At no point did I mention, at all, Vote ID laws. You did.
I am discussing things like GOP employee/contractors throwing out registration cards. I am discussing billboards being put up with incorrect voting information. I am discussing the Ohio state government attempting to alter the voting times at the last moment specifically to exclude early voting.
You, of course, try the eminently valid “But they did it too!” tactic, which of course is a false premise.
Yes, there have been organs of the Democratic party that have used questionable judgment.
But comparing, for example, ACORN’s record to this years GOP efforts is like comparing a flaming book of matches in the fireplace to the curtains, furniture and walls being on fire.
You know this, of course, but you blindly refuse to accept what you cannot defend.