Last Friday we had a neighbor, a long-time alcoholic/druggie/parolee, probably a felon, go absolutely batshit crazy on us over the phone. He first called to get some advice on putting down his girlfriend’s aging sick dog, adding that he was “praying” for the dog and for my husband’s and my health problems. However, in an instant, it suddenly turned into a screaming swearing rant, demanding to know why my husband had given the neighbor’s crap (including a gun that nobody knew was in the crap) to the neighbor’s brother while said neighbor was in jail. The furious ranting went on and only got louder and more obscene (I had unwittingly picked up the phone to order supper about two minutes into it) as he screamed and didn’t allow my husband to get more than two words out. I went into the room my husband was in and told him to hang up, which he did. Of course the idiot called back, screaming more and bellowing that he was going to come to the house and drag my husband’s ass out the door and beat his ass. Somewhere in the middle of all this he demanded my husband sign an affidavit saying he did not give a gun to the neighbor’s brother (who went to jail on a weapons charge a few months after the exchange of goods – each brother spent time in jail recently. Dirtbags…). Husband seized on this and said fine, and we called the cops. He told them he had spent a lot of time trying to get the guy into rehab or AA, but only jail seemed to work, and would they accompany him to their house so he could swear in front of the cops that he didn’t do what he was being accused of.
They went to the neighbor’s house, and the neighbor and his girlfriend (mind you, all the participants in this mess are 50-60, so these terms seem absurd in themselves) both hid and refused to answer the door, pretending to not be home. The cops gave us their card, told us to call and they’d be there if there was any further trouble (they did get to the house quickly – it’s a nice quiet neighborhood) and left.
So there we were, trying to calm down and let the adrenaline wear off. But then husband found out that the neighbor had thrown a “F*** off, you fat c***” at me as a parting shot when husband had hung up a few seconds before I did, at which point I told him we were getting a restraining order. That was the last straw for him.
So, since I’ve never been involved in crap like this before, I need to know. What are the negative ramifications of getting said restraining order? We couldn’t get one until today, and the plan is to get one after lunch today, since I have limited time off available to me. It was a serious threat to my husband, and we sincerely want this piece of trash to not come near us or our house again. Frankly, I’m surprised that he hasn’t called back with his usual hangdog contrition act, but that’s usually just to apologize for yelling about something while angrily bitching to my husband. He’s been a terrible neighbor for almost five years, and there will be no loss suffered by finally cutting ties. We just want this to stop before it gets any worse. We have nothing to hide, so there’s no worries about anything like that.
Tldr: Criminal dirtbag threatened us, getting restraining order. Bad idea?
I don’t give a lot of credence to restraining orders since they only stop law-abiding people, and law-abiding people don’t need them.
Personally, I wouldn’t bother with it, mainly because I wouldn’t want to provoke another outburst. He already knows that you’ll call the cops on him, AND you have it on record that there’s bad blood between the two of you (should something happen to either one of you). And he seemed sufficiently scared/respectful of the police that he hid from them.
But you are certainly entitled to seek one if it’ll make you feel better.
I think it was good to get the cops involved, and I think you’d be wise to follow through and get an RO if you don’t want to have any kind of contact with this guy ever again.
He may “know” that stuff during moments of lucidity or clear and present threat from the cops, but felonious types are not known for good impulse control - as evidenced by his recent telephone rant. The next time he gets angry, he’ll rant again, and/or become physically violent. The restraining order might prevent the next episode, but it probably won’t. But if/when the next episode does happen, an RO will enable the OP to nail his balls to the wall using the full force of the law.
The first time he violates the RO, call the cops and file a complaint. DO NOT give him another chance.
I say do it and hold him to it!
Right, I doubt you’ll get one. Orders of protection are usually limited to those in a dating/sexual relationship, those who have a child in common, or those sharing a residence. You’re not going to get one for an obscenity-laden phone call.
Can’t you get his phone number blocked? Then just ignore any contact he tries to make with you in person. It’s a bit passive aggressive but it might allow him to cool off and focus on something else.
Per experience with North Carolina law, I’ll second this.
We found out the housekeeper was stealing from us, so we canned her. I went to the county magistrate for an RO to keep her off the property, and he said it wasn’t necessary, nor legally available as a remedy citing the same reasons above. As a minimum, finding her on my property she could have been liable for trespassing and criminal mischief; getting in to the house or outbuildings would be burglary.
IANAL and all that…
As has been mentioned, the RO doesn’t have a lot of value. The value is does have is that, once it’s filed, it does make it a little easier for the PD to get all over his ass.
Per the OP, there was an explicit verbal threat to drag the husband out the door and beat is ass. Is that not enough for an RO?
If Neighbor’s been in jail recently - it’s a little hard to tell from the OP - it might be that your getting an RO or threatening him with the cops could trigger his parole officer’s interest. I don’t know if that’s the case or how you should handle it but it might be a factor in why he and his SO hid.
Just a data point to keep in mind if the harassment doesn’t stop.
No, first, it’s not a threat unless there is some imminence to its being carried out. A threat of physical violence, delivered over the telephone, doesn’t count.
Second, orders of protection (and this is the more usual terminology, rather than restraining order) are creatures of statute (generally the domestic violence statutes). After all, judges can’t just go around limiting, on an ex parte basis, people’s otherwise constitutionally protected rights to go as they please or to initiate contact with others. So you have to meet the well-defined eligbility criteria.
If you do not have one of the familial/domestic/intimate relationships set forth in the statute, you’re not going to get an OP. Well, you could if you were being stalked, but until this most recent phone call, the parties have voluntarily been interacting, so the past contacts were not of a stalking nature.
That information may be inaccurate depending on where the OP is. For example, in my state orders for protection are different from restraining orders (called harassment restraining orders) in length of time they are active, requirements to get one, and penalties associated with breaking one, and both are different from no contact orders.
HROs here have no relationship requirement.
Thanks, everybody, for all your advice and thoughts.
When the officer was at our house, I did ask about the efficacy of a restraining order, and in his word, they are “a last resort”, so I suspected this may be the case. I knew I could get good info here, plus a little advice is appreciated.
Although he has long been an annoyance, this was a new level of hostility. But on the one hand, I know that Mr. singular has nothing to fear as far as getting his ass beat. The dirtbag would be reunited with the dirt posthaste, with a renewed appreciation for the skills he knows the husband has. Even with the effect of whatever meds he is currently abusing/missing, he is not a physical threat.
On the other hand, I am a little concerned about what this particular step (RO) might result in, as far as unhinged reactions, so there is a part of me that is a little relieved. The fact that he hid when husband immediately showed up with the police leads me to think he could be intimidated enough to back off for a good long time, as I’m pretty sure he’s on parole and doesn’t want to risk that.
So I honestly hope I won’t have any need to update this thread. But again, I do appreciate all the info. Those of you with available fingers to cross, join me in crossing them and hoping for peace in the neighborhood.
You really have to talk to a lawyer.
In my state (NJ) a restraining order falls under the domestic violence statute. So in order to get one there has to be a relationship such as Kimmy defined above. You can not get a restraining order against your neighbor.
Now there are other types of judicial orders. A judge can set a no contact order as a condition of bail on certain offenses. A judge can issue a no contact order after a conviction on certain offenses.
The domestic violence order is much more powerful. The initial order is issued after hearing just one side. The ROs are filed with the local police department. If probable cause is found at the time of an incident the local PD can arrest and the offender sits in jail with no bail until he sees a judge. With other types of judicial orders jurisdiction is with the court and the county. They generally will not be arrested on view.
But things may be much different in your state so you will have to look into it.
I’d check on your state’s Castle Doctrine. And price a Remington 870 12 gauge with an 18.5 inch barrel, magazine extension, and a box of #00 shells. Oh, and any time in the future if this guy makes any sort of threatening noises at you, in person or via phone, contact the police and file a report.
I’d also recommend getting an inexpensive digital voice recorder and a recording earbud. It’ll work with almost all phones and will clearly record both sides of the conversation.
Note that this advice is not valid in California, Connecticut, Florida, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania, or Washington where all parties must give permission to record calls.
ETA: IANAL etc…
We are covered in the recording area. I always have my iPod Touch with me at home, so any call can go on speaker & get recorded. I also have the camera at the ready as I pass his house on the drive home, just in case he pulls anything outside. (He has caused a few accidents by drunkenly lurching into the street before.)
Of course, the phone recording thing is moot, as all calls will go directly to voice mail. All conversation is out of the question. A friend of his came by to pick up his tools yesterday & mentioned how very sorry said dirtbag is about the whole thing, getting only a grunt in response.
In a way, I am glad the dirtbag mouthed off to me. That’s the thing that made it irreversible to Mr. singular, & l am grateful for that.
Actually, restraining orders are granted to those with plausible cause to feel threatened and are not a last resort, just paperwork. Neighbor, coworker, bar patron can get one if they state their claim believably enough through a petition to the judge filed at the courthouse.
Know that they are not magical force shields that are going to protect you from anything. What they are is a good solid part of a paper trail showing previous grievance should you be threatened again. And if you are threatened again the problem has already been established (and is on record) and responding officers can put the offender in the back of the cruiser to put a stop to the current situation, rather than having to treat the incident as a new or not escalated enough occurrence. (Even though they’ve answered calls at that address before.)
As Groucho Marx would say, it couldn’t hoit.
But who can make the request? In my state a civilian can only petition for an order of protection (OP) if its for a relative or intimate relationship. However, a district attorney can request an OP as part of a criminal case for any victim of a crime. They are actually routinely awarded while a criminal case is pending.
Instead of going to court and getting an OP, it would be much more efficient for singular1 to gather evidence and call the police, and have them make the arrest and deal with the OP request in court.
If the police won’t arrest him, chances are you’ll lose the court case anyway. There is really little advantage to petitioning the court for an OP yourself.