But that isn’t what they are being asked to do is it? They are not being offered the exact same deal as you. They are being told that they will not even receive
close to the exact same deal as you had. Are you willing to accept, retroactively the deal they get? If not, why not? Are you willing now to pay retroactively more for the benefits you receive? If not, why not?
What I was aware before from him was his promises to follow anti-science and stop the creation of clean jobs.
It must be a coincidence that Koch is also one of the ones financing the busing of tea party supporters to the areas where the supporters of the union are gathering.
I got a nickel that says somewhere within thier dark empire, there’s a lawyer working out how they can take those expenses off their taxes. Oh, shit! Rand’s not here, is he?
I bemoaned their expressed intention to obstruct EVERYTHING and NEVER work, but that’s ok, they’ll pay in 2012. That’s how it works. The voters have the last say.l
I said I was a government employee. I never said what branch of government.
Nothing Walker is doing will affect anyone who works for the employer i did.
But those that do would not suffer to pay a bit more for their benefits.
And they would lose their collective bargaining agreements. That’s why the unions are unhappy and that’s why the democrats left the state.
Why is it that you are ignoring the actual part of the bill that everyone objects to? I’d say it’s because you just want the democrats to be cowards and the unions to be whiners because that fits your [del]preconcieved notions about how things really are[/del] expertise and wisdom, but I’d still like to hear your answer.
But see, pkbites was law enforcement. They aren’t up for gutting.
I used to work for our state’s retirement system. Oh, the benefits that the law enforcement officers and fire fighters (LEOFF) get. As a rule, then get better benefits while working (better health insurance, more sick days and paid leave, more employer-paid retirement) and better retirements than other government employees. They are not part of your city, county and state government retirement plans. Usually, teachers also have separate retirement plans so that they can be individually rewarded/boned by their school districts to the tax-payers content.
The case can be made that LEOFF gets better deals because the job is so hazardous. I agree with earlier retirement for LEOFF. But I’m not sure they should be treated so much differently than other gov employees, such as getting to keep collective bargaining while everybody else has it taken away. If collective bargaining is too costly or not needed for other government employees, then I expect the LEOFF should not need it either.
Surely you agree, pkbites?
Perhaps if we called it “private free market” rather than “collective” bargaining?
My wife worked for the IRS for over 2 decades. The last few years, the copays went up and the coverage got worse. Lots of employees were broomed too. It was not the sinecure that outsiders claim.They did not make a lot of money either.
Only about 15 to 20% of teachers against him. Firefighters and policemen are overwhelmingly Republican and even THEY are turning against him.
The bit about most teachers being conservative comes from NEA polling. Not sure how the number you are referring comes from, but in any case I think firefighters and Police know instinctively that if the Republicans succeed in removing rights for other workers that it is likely that they would be next.
Not so long as they behave themselves.
It’s bidness. They will come for them when thyt feel secure that the first deed has been accomplished.
Walker cut some taxes and diverted funds to create an illusion of a fiscal crisis. A guy who will do that will not let the rest go.
But not you. Got it.
No, you don’t got it. I said it would not have killed me to pay more for my benefits.
Right, but that’s not the reason the dems left. Repeating it doesn’t make it any more correct. You are avoiding addressing the reason that they left. You could say you’re running from it. Like a coward.
And here’s a brief history of the tactic. Honest Abe Lincoln? More like Scaredy Cat Lincoln! Am I right?
The Democrats left because they don’t have the stones to represent their constituents at the state capitol where they are supposed to. They also don’t have the honor to accept that they had their heads handed to them last November. They also don’t have the brains to realize this tactic is not going to work, it will backfire, and Walker is going to be triumphant. If he’s not I’ll gladly come back here and eat crow.
So they should just accept the fact that Walker and the republicans are going to needlessly take away the collective bargaining rights of most unions involved with the state government out of honor.:dubious: Uh huh. As long as it makes sense to you I suppose.
Not even with paid busing could the tea partiers get enough supporters of the governor to make a good enough show of numbers compared to the opponents.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/02/19/us-wisconsin-protests-teaparty-idUSTRE71I3J820110219
But it not like the Dems in the Wisconsin legislature are trying this every other week (nor did the GOP when they were minority). My outrage-o-meter allows each party (per state) one pass every decade or so on this sort of thing.
My meter is similarly calibrated for filibusters in the U.S. House: it’s okay every once in a great while, but if a party were to start filibustering every other bill that came in front of them, things would be way out of hand and something would have to be done.
Oh… what’s that? Really?!? You say the GOP used the filibuster like a cheap, tea-bagging whore in the last Congress? That’s outrageous! What happened to the scoundrels?
**THEY GOT ELECTED INTO THE MAJORITY???
***HOLY SHIT!!! *this country is fucked up!
But look on the bright side–at least it stopped their filibusters!