Hi all. Long-time lurker, occasional poster here. I’d really appreciate some help from the brilliant grammatical minds here. Which of these two sentences is correct? Or are they both correct?
‘He gave me a look that was just this side of patience.’
‘He gave me a look that was just this side of patient.’
My preference is for the first sentence – with ‘patience’ being used in the sense of the overall concept, like ‘just this side of glory’ or ‘just this side of hatred’ – but I’m being told it’s incorrect. Is it?
Is it? sobs a little I really like it, and think it works in context, but maybe it’s a darling that has to go. I want to keep a slightly colloquial tone.
I don’t think the construction makes any sense at all.
In all the other quoted examples; glory, hatred, happy or angry going further gets you to the point of glory, hatred, happiness or anger. So what does it mean to be this side of being patient? Unless you mean the character is being impatient but striving to achieve patience. Or do you mean, "He gave me a look that was just this side of losing his patience.’
Yes, exactly - he’s striving to remain patient. So ‘just this side of patience’ means he’s barely managing to be patient. I suppose I mean ‘just the right side of patience’. Though that sounds clunky(er).
Thanks. It’s actually not a matter of it not being understood - my copyeditor just thinks I should use ‘patient’ instead of ‘patience’. I prefer ‘patience’, but now I’m wondering if I should just rephrase it altogether.
I do think it’s one of those things that probably work better in context. she says, clinging to straws
I think it sounds lovely. If you were to use another word like happy or angry, it would have to be “this side of happy”, not “this side of happiness”, wouldn’t it? So I would go with “patient”.
Source: bloody foreigner who probably has no clue about proper English grammar.
Thanks; that was my copyeditor’s point too, so great minds.
Not challenging - but having been reading grammar sites online I’m genuinely curious, if anyone knows: Wouldn’t ‘that was just this side of patience’ be an adjective clause in this sentence, modifying ‘look’? In which case, would you need to have ‘patient’? It’s not a ‘patient’ look, it’s a ‘just this side of patience’ look.
Sorry, didn’t see all the other replies! Thanks, everyone; I appreciate your input. (And thanks, Uniqueorn!:D)
I’ll probably end up keeping it, but changing to ‘patient’. My style in general is extremely simple and sparse, so occasionally I cling like a limpet to the odd thing that I love.
I’m genuinely curious about the adjective clause question above, though, if anyone knows the answer.
I think the problem is that, if you use patience, you are comparing two dissimilar nouns (look and patience), rather than describing the look with an adjective. A look is something that can be directly observed, while patience is an abstract quality. You can observe a patient look; you cannot observe patience directly.
Let’s take out the “just this side of” and compare the use of nouns and adjectives:
A look that was happy.
A look that was happiness.
A look that was sad.
A look that was sadness.
A look that was angry.
A look that was angriness.
Using the noun only works if the look is happiness or sadness personified. In effect, you are creating a metaphor. Unless that is your intent, you should go with the adjective.
Thanks for explaining in such detail, Colibri. I see exactly what you mean, but I feel like I must be explaining myself very badly. (And yes, I’ve been around here long enough to know that probably means the problem is me!)
Argh, missed the edit window. Basically, yes, I know, you wouldn’t say ‘his look was patience’ unless it was a metaphor. But in the example I gave, could ‘that was just this side of patience’, in its entirety, modify ‘look’ as an adjective clause? If not, what am I missing?
I think using “patience” is not wrong, exactly, but produces a meaning different than what I presume you intend. In effect, you are saying his look was patience itself. This could be OK if you actually intend that metaphorical meaning. However, by adding “just this side of” you weaken that comparison and pull your punches. So even if you intend the metaphorical comparison that wouldn’t be the best way to say it.
No, what I’m trying to get across (very badly, obviously!) is that the guy is very very close to NOT being patient. His look is ‘just on this side of patience’ because I mean the state of mind of ‘patience’. Which he’s only barely achieving.
Don’t worry, I’m not going to use it; you’ve all convinced me! But I am kind of wondering if I’m mad and the only person in the world that this makes sense to.
is grammatically correct but probably not what quite you mean to say. Which side is “this side”? If it’s the patient side, his look was just a bit more patient than patient. If it’s the impatient side, his look wasn’t quite patient – but why would that be “this” side?
His look was just on the patient side of annoyed is what you mean to say, but that reads even worse.
He gave me a look I’d seen before, and I knew his patience was running out.
