No way she can top Cuba Gooding Jr’s shout-outs, or Jack Palance’s push-ups.
I don’t feel qualified to respond to this thread, because I didn’t see the speech. I’m inclined to believe that it was probably annoying, because I find Halle Berry pretty annoying (absolutely, stunningly beautiful and sinfully well-dressed… but annoying), however the extent to which she claimed (or did not claim) credit for improving American race relations, or whatever, is over my head.
I just wanted to hijack a little bit and offer, in response to gobear’s thoughtful and articulate post, this book for your consideration…
It’s a good read, and kinda fits the topic, right?
And why wasn’t he nominated this year? I mean, c’mon. Snow Dogs, people, SNOW DOGS!. He was robbed, I tell you.
And they say there are no good roles for African Americans today.
I’ve got nothing to take away from Halle. Is she ever gorgeous !!!
I’m not up on the celebrity scene and had to ask my wife who that stunning actress was who was playing in Swordfish. I thought to myself I’m sure to see a lot more of her. She is perfect.
I had no idea she was African-American until the pre-Oscar hype surfaced. That alone makes me question the racial significance of her award.
Now if it had been Whoopi Goldberg, who probably should have received the Oscar for best actress several times in the past, that would merit consideration for a racially significant event.
Oddly, yes I can picture that. Not in those words, but in the underlying, perhaps partly unspoken reality, yes.
What I find even more interesting is how the brief mention, or even a more extended mention of the reality of race sets people off far beyond other words or phrases. Rather reflects on the society, does it not?
See my GD posts just now on observational bias. The OP might want to reflect on it.
Otherwise, I should only be restating gobear’s perceptive comments.
Symbols dear, symbols. That and this sounds like, hmmm, envy?
Not at all. The election of Mandela helped leverage a sea of change in SA, similar events have symbolic value which can leverage further change. It should be easier, as after the first black Miss America, for non-racialized judgements on winning to be made. That is the reality, whether a number of posters here wish to acknowledge it or not.
(Mind you, I don’t particularly care for the woman)
No way she can top Cuba Gooding Jr’s shout-outs, or Jack Palance’s push-ups.
Wow. I’m flabbergasted. I just can’t bring myself to believe that everyone in the academy is still so racist that they either passively or actively sit around and say “we must pick the best actress, but I sure hope she’s right”. As much as I disagree with a lot of their choices, I have never thought that they were making them on the basis of race.
And yes of course, I’m jealous of other’s success…isn’t everybody? Especially other actors…but I think that if some young black actress in high school was watching last night and said “WOW, things are gonna change around here now that Halle Barry won an Oscar” she’s sadly mistaken.
jar
GAH…WHITE.
I sure hope she’s WHITE.
fff
Huh? Because Whoopi’s “blacker” than Halle?
So it’s not “racially significant” because Halle is not coloured enough?
I’m beginning to see why this is such a big issue after all.
This was the least incidental comment in the thread to me, cheezit. I’ve always had the same response to discussions of this nature, but have never been able to state the point as eloquently as you did. I guess I kinda figure, “Sigh. That’s the desired end-state, all right. Please, Og, get us get to the point where nobody feels the need to apply labels, even for the worthy cause of correcting injustices past and present.”
Well if you can believe old greeny didn’t know she was black…
Yeah Coldy, the USA ain’t Nederlands, although you guys are not lacking issues yourselves you know.
As to the “point” of cheezit et al, the reality is that despite 70 odd years of stand out performances, blacks didn’t get the recognition for lead roles. That is only just now changing. Only just now. When it is truly banal, then the mentions will drop away.
To think otherwise is to live in a fantasy world.
This is such bullshit. If you think you can convince me that you’d have any fucking idea what the hell your reaction would be if you were in her place, you’re full of shit. For one thing, you will never be in her place. Even if you somehow someday manage to win an Oscar, you will never be the first black woman ever to win a Best Actress Oscar. Just because Halle Berry was fully aware of the symbolic importance of her award, of the place she now holds forever in hollywood history.
As far as I’m concerned, her reaction was absolutely appropriate, because it was her reaction. She’s the only one who gets to say what that might be.
So just shut the fuck up, OK?
Well, to be accurate, the first African-American to ever win an Academy award was Hattie McDaniel, as Best Supporting Actress in Gone with the Wind. Yes, Mammie. Probably somewhat controversial as it was a hideously stereotypical role, but it was still a milestone-and this was back in what-1939, 1940?
I’m not a big fan of Berry-from what I’ve read about her, she seems like a flake, but since I didn’t see her speech, I can’t comment.
As far as the Oscars being life time achievments? Give me a break! How many wonderful, talented actors/actresses never won a goddamn thing? Harrison Ford, Omar Sharif, Lauren Bacall, etc.
And look at some of the hacks that have won.
But, so she was excited and a little gushing. Oh well. What can you do?
They’re actors-they’re supposed to over-inflate their importance. WE know it’s not a Nobel Prize. But don’t tell THEM that!
Well, I for one, am down with it. I noticed that at least two of the recipients thanked their lawyers. Yahoo!
And Halle Barry can cry on my pasty fat white middle aged shoulder any time. There, there, congratulations woman!
Neither can I.
Do you think there was never a racial barrier in the awarding of the Oscar. I think there probably was, at one time at least.
I also think that racism is usually overcome through a long slow progress where barriers to success grow progressively weaker. Eventually we reach a point where the barrier grows weak enough that someone with enough talent (or whatever) can break through the barrier.
Now it is possible that the barrier was weak enough in this case that just about anyone could break through it. Hell, maybe the barrier was gone altogether by this point. This isn’t something we can measure with any degree of certainty.
However, we can at least say this: Halle Barre is the first person to prove that it is now possible for an African American woman to win an Oscar for Best Lead Actress in a move. She has proven that this barrier is no longer impenetrable.
And she shouldn’t celebrate this because … ?
Because it annoys jarbabyj, apparently.
Colounsbury: I didn’t mean to suggest that my country is free of racism. It isn’t. It just seems to be less of an issue over here. I could be wrong, but I don’t think I am.
Bullshit.
If she had gotten up there and said, “Fuck whitie!”, that would have been appropriate, because it would have been honest? I don’t think so.
And I’m not saying that would have ever remotely happened, but your argument is relying on the content of the speech, not the fact that it was honest.
Regardless of all of that, I too think she was well within her rights to make a speech. I do think this was a noteworthy achievement on behalf of “nameless, faceless wom[e]n of colour” everywhere. All I’m saying is that when you thank you’re lawyer in an Oscar speech, you’ve gone too far.
She made a fine speech and then pushed it right over the deep end.
Were you, by any chance, listening to Howard Stern this morning? Only he claimed she did it for Shirley Hemphill.
well, actually I think that subconscious picking/not picking begins in the casting area. When I look at movies (in general), in many, many cases, there’s no particular reason for a specific racial characteristic, yet when the actor chosen isn’t white, there’s specific comment. For example, Denzel Washington’s casting as the reporter in Pelican Brief. No reason why the part had to be white, nor was there a reason for damn near any of the other characters being white (with the exception of Julia Roberts who was described in the book as having red hair, of course it could have been dyed). And yet, most of the others were. From all the presidential staff, all the lawyers, most of the reporters, and nearly all of the folks at the law schools. Ditto the casting of the young woman as Jeff Goldblum’s daughter in Jurassic Park II (tho I suspect her agent didn’t really do her any favors for that one)>
So, when you look at the body of work that comes out of Hollywood, **most ** of the parts could actually be played by people of any race (except for historical figures), but apart from those films that seem to be directly intended for black audiences, most of the characters are played by white actors, especially most of the ‘good’ or main roles.
No, no, you’re absolutely right. I threw the red meat comment in just as a sort of public comment. The Dutch are far more balanced than North America.
BTW, I really am looking forward to my next Amsterdam trip. Expense account and all.