We are very clearly missing something. I very much bet that the revelation about Regalus challenging Voldy will tie into Snape’s own story. Remember, we have still yet to figure out what Snape’s biggest fear is, his Patronus, etc. and we know it will be important. Everything we see in this book of Snape basically paints him as a Voldemort wannabe. So obviously there are layers to his character beyond that which we’ve yet to encounter.
I’m probably way, way “out there” with my interpretation of that scene, but what the heck…
I most definitely think Dumbledore paralyzed Harry so that he could serve as a witness to the version of events that he wanted the outside world to believe, but also as a way of indicating, however obliquely, to Harry that his death might not be all that it seemed. Starting on page 591 of the U.S. edition (with irrelevant bits snipped):
To get even more out there with wild speculation, I wonder if the “Dumbledore” who died is really Snape, via a Polyjuice potion, and that Fawke’s grief is the result of Snape’s death in service to Dumbledore. It could even have been Dumbledore, in the guise of Snape, who took the Unbreakable Vow to protect Draco.
Regardless of the mechanics of how, I don’t buy for a second that Dumbledore’s really dead and gone. Not yet, anyway.
His name is Michael Howard. He may not be a Death Eater, but he is a Tory. That’s possibly worse.
First, let me say that I don’t buy the relentless heterosexuality for a minute. If any match was made in heaven, it’s Tonks and Ginny (once she’s of age, of course).
Here’s a little review I cranked out and shipped off to Mugglenet. I’m posting it here because it hits on some factors not yet named in this thread:
This sixth novel simultaneously moves its focus back to the Harry-Ron-Hermione trio and looks outward in a recognition of the impact of the larger wizarding world upon individuals. Although secondary characters continue to play a role, the emotional center is Harry and his close friends, and Harry and his mentor, Dumbledore. While it is refreshing to see Harry and Dumbledore actually interacting in an extended and meaningful way, this narrative choice renders characters such as Tonks and Neville, for whom the reader has developed affection, curiously flat.
This distance and drawing-in may well have been a deliberate decision on Rowling’s part, however, as it parallels Harry’s growing realization that he must increase his attention to his quest, and decrease the number of attachments that could be turned to his disadvantage. Though his final acts of loyalty to Dumbledore’s instructions show that he is capable of choosing the right act over emotionally compelling alternatives, his confession to Ginny of the conflict he would feel if he had to choose her death reveals his own recognition that love is his vulnerability as well as his strength.
Although some chapters read more like Harry Potter and the Expository Prose, the reader is given a great deal of explanation and back-story, as promised. Compassion and identification, always important themes in the series, are shown movingly both as Harry’s empathy for Tom Riddle’s childhood grows, and, significantly, as Dumbledore offers Draco every opportunity to enter into his protection. Harry’s report that he did not think Draco would have killed Dumbledore seems to be an important turning point for the series, and we can hope for further complex and sophisticated analyses of human interactions in the last book, saving the series from a reductionist good-versus-evil finale.
It is not clear at times whether details are extraneous or important, which of course is part of why the books function as mysteries as well as coming of age stories. However, it did seem at times that one or two additional lines might answer readers’ questions and add to, rather than diminish, the tightness of the plot. For example, Harry learns that members of the Order use their Patronuses to communicate with each other. We learn this, perhaps, so that Rowling can show us the form of Tonks’s Patronus. However, this then begs the question of why Harry does not send his Patronus to summon Snape when he and Dumbledore arrive back in Hogsmeade. A brief exchange in which Harry announced this intention and Dumbledore indicated that a Patronus could not get through the extra protections at Hogwarts, for example, would close this hole convincingly. The reader would not then be left wondering why Harry still thinks, like a Muggle, of running up to the castle instead of using the very mechanism identified earlier in the book as the best way he could communicate quickly and effectively with Snape.
The theme of appearances versus substance is strongly reinforced, including numerous titles (such as “prince”) that are meaningless, Voldemort’s soul (apparently safe in Horcruxes, but unbeknownst to him, destroyed one by one) and Fleur’s firm response to Bill’s injuries. Parallelism abounds in Half-Blood Prince, such as the triad of Wormtail’s silver hand–Dumbledore’s wounded hand–and Draco’s Hand of Glory. In addition, cups, knives, wands, and coins abound; in conjunction with Trelawney’s obsessive (and accurate) card-reading and prediction about the tower (a Tarot symbol), they suggest that the reader willing to now re-read with a dictionary of symbols and guide to card reading and Tarot may be rewarded with additional parallels, confirmations, and insights. This week at least, however, that re-reader will not be me. I have passed on my copy to the next eager reader in the house.
Harry saw a phoenix in the flames consuming Dumbledore’s body. There’s something in that, but it hasn’t finished brewing in my brain yet.
I’m so mad at the fact that we saw almost nothing of Neville. He’s my favorite character–him and Luna–and I still cannot wait for him to kick some serious ass. He’s got his own wand and a bit of self-worth and he and Luna are going to do some serious damage in book 7. :mad: :mad:
Harry’s an adult now. I’m in awe over Rowling’s aging of his character. Really amazing.
I was really thrown off in the hundred-odd pages after the PM scene (which I agree was tickling) by the thought that it was really, really poorly written. It read like a first draft, or… it didn’t feel like JKR’s voice at all. At some point it smoothed out, though, and I was gasping for breath and shrieking and crying and generally making a scene as I tore through the last few chapters.
Okay,
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I posted some things in another thread so I won’t repeat them here.
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I’ll be very happy if Jo avoids swiping LeGuin’s schtick where both Ged and his shadow are “Ged” and have to join together in order for Ged to master it.
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Notice she’s doing parallels by threes rather than twos (e.g., Dumbledore’s hand–Hand of Glory–Wormtail’s silver hand; Harry/Snape/Voldemort’s childhoods and lineage)? This might get her out of some polarized X-vs-Y endings.
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Hey, the kids are going off to war. Ron and Herminone are now legal adult wizards. School may seem pointless until if and when they retuen Order & Goodness to the world.
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I agree that Snape and Dumbledore had an arrangement. this is paralleled by Harry’s arrangement with Dumbledore. What Snape knows how to do, but Harry doesn’t yet, is to tolerate without correction others’ misperceptions of him.
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Loved weepy, clingy Narcissa and contemptuous “I’d-send-all-my-children-to-be-cannon-fodder” Bellatrix. Can’t wait to hear Jim Dale do that in his Frenchified Lestrange voice. Loved Luna’s commentary. Loved Ron’s giant squid comment. Don’t buy Tonks/Lupin at all. Tonks is clearly queer!
I don’t buy the “Harry the Horcrux” theory. From all accounts, Voldemort tried his best to *kill *Harry as a baby. Remember that his original reason for attacking the Potters in the first place was due to the misheard prophecy: he was hoping to head off the prophecy entirely by killing its subject in infancy. Furthermore, if Harry had been turned into a Horcrux, why would Voldemort then try to kill him repeatedly at Hogwarts? He’d be destroying a piece of his own soul. Why not petrify Harry and keep him locked up in a cave somewhere instead?
Sorry to double-post.
Right. Because we’re now seeing all the stuff Snape talked about in the very first Potions lesson. Draught of Living Death, or something like that? (I’ve yielded up my copy to another reader at the moment.) Want to bet that at least one person has a faked death in Harry Potter and the Massive Plot Resolution? A la McCoy dosing Kirk at Spock’s pon farr festivities?
Ginny and Tonks? You’re raving- It’s been Ginny and Harry since post Cho, just as Ron and Hermione will also get together since the Yule Ball and her “well spotted”.
The teen romances read quite authentically. If JKR wants to put (or sees a need) a homosexual relationship in the book, she will. But that’s another thread.
I finished it this afternoon and my head is buzzing, I read too fast and need to go back, but it is in my daughter’s hands now.
I think:
That Dumbledore is not dead–or that he will rise again, phoenix-like in some way. HP says that Dumbledore will never leave Hogwarts as long as someone there believes in him…I also question Harry’s vow to Dumbledore–I think that AD didn’t trust HP at the last. He ordered HP to go get Snape, no matter what–and then, when they were “interrupted” immobilized HP-- possibly fearing that HP would take on Draco et al. And let’s face it-HP wouldn’t have left AD there alone and weak.
I also wonder if AD didn’t find a way to split his soul so that he can return, in a good way (not by killing, obviously). I think that AD has the real Hocrux locket thingy with him, wherever he is (or got it to someone else-dont’ ask me how!).
Then again, AD HAD to die–every hero must go it alone, at least for a time–Harry is no different.
I still think there is good in Snape. I think that “more will be revealed”.
Lupin and Tonks are great! Good on them. I am puzzled about the changing Patronus, though. I do think that Snape is somewhat jealous, but also he is so stiff and formal that Tonks’ breeziness and in-your-face stuff would be offensive to him. He wishes he could be that free and easy, but cannot. Just a WAG.
Glad to see Fleur fleshed out and become a good character–and I found myself quite concerned about Bill. Ron seems stronger in this book (I mean characterwise-more fleshed out and individual, as does Hermione). I really love the Ginny/Harry connenction, but think that the ending was way too pat. So, she does the noble so the he can do the noble? Come off it–neither is bound to stick with that for long. I predict the wedding will stir a few pots. Neville should have been more to the fore, IMO. Alot could hinge on him-to use him as red herring would be crappy…
I found the ending to be lame–I mean the writing of it. It felt rushed and fake, somehow. One day of goodnes or light or whatever? How melodramatic.
I also found so much was not explained–it felt like there were so many things hinted at that either were not expanded upon or left hanging. Og knows that there are enough things already hanging from other books!
It was good, but I feel cheated in some way. Can’t put my finger on it–but the depth of story isn’t there. It’s hinted at, but not developed. This is the first one where I feel like it’s a product. I was more touched by Ron’s poisoning and Bill’s hurt then Dumbledore’s death. It rings false to me, somehow. I was moved by Draco’s dilemma–and glad to see that Harry felt for him in the bathroom.
Last thing: did anyone else feel that it took say the first 50+ pages for Dumbledore to get back in character? He rang really false for me in his doings with the Dursley’s–he has always struck me as someone who pitied them, not someone who would show them up the way he did.
So much to talk about!
That’s a large part of what I was talking about. Dumbledore’s dialogue seemed SO out of character, and the whole feel of the thing was just, way off.
Anyone else notice the little touchs of humor? JKR is playing with the whole phenomenom, IMO. At one point, Slugwhatever (the new Potions professor) is talking to Harry about Ron, and since he has completely ignored Ron, refers to him as Harry’s little friend, Rupert?
I love stuff like that.
I posted a long speculation etc in the other thread. I doubt that AD is dead–something may occur (this may be wishful thinking), but Harry does need to go it alone (like every other hero). I like the romances, although I think that JKR does not handle the end of relationships well–they all seem so arbitrary and awkward. Why couldn’t Dean have found a new girl, for example?
I also feel like there was just so much in this book–I need to reread it, but it’s in my daughter’s hands now.
I still think good of Snape and I also have more kind feelings for Draco. I wish there had been more of Neville and Luna.
I also cannot figure out where Molly and Arthur fit in–they couldn’t have been at school with James and Lily–so when were they there?
Glad to see Tonks and Lupin–I think she was really upset about Lupin, people just ascribed her grief to Sirius.
And that new werewolf dude is seriously messed up evil. Also, Tom Riddle is a psychopath and scares me now more than ever…
Yeah- I thought it was uneven and rushed. But then, I rushed right thru it.
I will read it again before I make up my mind.
Afterall, I didnt’ care the for the third movie, much–but I watched it again this week and like it immensely,so my jury’s still out.
Well, just finished. I pretty much cried like a baby with Dumbledore’s death, especially with the song of the pheonix, and when it disappeared. I didn’t really see any of it coming, as I try to stay away from anything that could be a potential spoiler.
Now I’ve got a feeling of mild depression at not having anything amazing to read. It’s such a high to read a good book that the let down of finishing it gets me down.
When’s the next book due out? I suppose it’s sometime in the distant future, like 2008 or something, but I’m hoping it won’t be that far off. Surely the author must have an outline prepared for it.
For now I’ve got to watch myself, just thinking of Dumbledore’s death gets me teary-eyed, and it’s not quite appropriate for a grown man to walk about crying!
Here’s a point that bugs the crap out of me regarding the third movie: When Harry first sees PP on the Marauders’ Map and goes investigating, Snape catches him out and Lupin sort of rescues him and “confiscates” the map. Lupin and Harry then launch into a discussion about the map and how, in the wrong hands, it could lead an enemy straight to Harry. While it is clearly explained in the book who Moony, Wormtail, Prongs and Padfoot are… it is never spelled out in the movie and so that conversation makes no sense. We aren’t shown how Lupin knows what the “spare bit o’ parchment” is, nor how Lupin knows how to use it. I’ve submitted that to IMDB because I think it’s such an egregious error. A key plot point left out by the director. Otherwise I love that movie.
I’m not sure if it’s been asserted in this thread or the other one, but I think Harry is the 4th horcrux. Also, “hor” is the latin root for time and “crux” would be cross or crucial. I think “horcrux” means something more about a critical time or cross of time (like how people’s paths intersect in life sometimes)…
I’m still working all that out. I knew AD had to die, I was just surprised it was Snape, although it seems obvious throughout this book.
I’m off to pick up on all the missed details in my second reading.
The people behind the films have indicated that the “Moony, Wormtail, Padfoot, and Prongs” thing will be revealed in the fourth movie rather than the third. We’ll find out if they fill in this plot hole in November. 
Dogzilla --I agree re: the map and PP. Also, Harry’s Patronus is never explained. That to me was inexcusable–it would have taken one line! I do hate when every i is dotted and every t is crossed, but honestly…it would have deepened the movie to have included both points.
That, and the fact that the hairdresser cannot seem to do Hermione’s hair to fit here character–the top half of her hair is stick straight, then wavy. It don’t work like that folks. :rolleyes: (very nitpicky, stupid point, but aggravating nonetheless).
More and more I think that AD will come to HP in a different form…
I loved it. Sure it had its share of problems and I admit that the use of ‘slut’ caught me off guard. I guess I may be sheltered but I would never imagine reading that word to my children.
I was also frustrated by the handful of typos which leapt out at me.
I do admit I have an unadulterated love for the twins, getting a look at their store was cool.
And I was blown away from Dumbledore’s death, sure I knew it had to happen, but it was so rushed that I was caught off guard of it. But before we keep complaining about how rushed it was, I think that kids will be upset by losing Dumbledore and she did not want to linger on it.
I also was completely surprised by Snape’s dispassionate kill. I had just assumed that he was good and would never kill Dumbledore. I have done a complete 180 and now look at him as purely evil. Though the arguments made here are compelling that he may have done this to cement himself with Voldemort by the instructions of Dumbledore.
As for how Snape can redeem himself, I think that he will come into play with the final meeting between Harry and Voldemort, we’ll see though.
They say the next book is 2 years off, I don’t know if I can wait that long though… feverish twitch
Me, too. I cannot bring myself to start anything else, but also cannot reread it, because it’s my daughter’s turn. I am listless and restless at the same time.
If memory serves, JKR has the final chapter under her bed–methinks it is probably locked up at her publisher’s by now!
She had it at her house, then moved it to a safety deposit box.
She has an interview with Perkie Katie on Dateline tonight.
I’m going to swing way out on a loony limb, right about now. Many people have hypothesized that the reason Dumbledore trusted Snape implicitly is because they had an Unbreakable Vow. I do think a vow is involved, but not between Dumbledore and Snape. I believe Dumbledore knows about the vow, but that’s because he was the one holding the wand (like Bellatrix). I think The Unbreakable Vow was between Snape and Lily.