has a spirit ever been captured on camera?

In this day and age, we need to recognize that any person can edit any photograph. Hence, a photograph even a legitimate one (of a ghost) is not enough to convince anyone of the ghosts existence. Even if you gave me data on gravitic phenomenon in the area, electomagnetic disturbances in the area, and convection differentials in the area accompanied with a picture, it would not be enough to convince me because these things occur normally.

What would it take?

Most ghost stories include a reference to something odd happening in addition to all of the above phenomenon. Something moving across the room for example. Photos or images of this could be faked, so I would have to see it for myself. Then and only then would I admit that ghosts exist.

Until then, ghosts exist.

I don’t remember who but one of our very own Dopers has linked to some rather interesting pictures of hers. Whether or not they contain anything pertaining to the supernatural is up to the viewer.

Er, not so. Not so at all. To get the million you must demonstrate a psychic or paranormal power or ability, as defined in the randi.org document pertaining to the million bucks. Offering a photograph of anything, no matter how strange, and no matter what provenance you can attach to it, will get you nowhere.

I know Quercus meant no harm, and peace to him/her. However, the point remains: it’s helpful to raise the subject of the JREF Million Dollar Challenge in appropriate circumstances, where it helps to smoke out the fake psychic charlatans, and very unhelpful (to the JREF and all parties) to mis-represent the terms and conditions of the offer or to make people think they have a chance at it just with a photograph. They already get enough cranks and crackpots submitting absurd claims (i.e. claims which indicate the claimant has either not read or does not understand the terms of the offer) and they don’t need any more.

Many years ago my Grandfather related a tale from when he was touring an old Scottish castle. It seems Grandpa became separated from the tour group and while wandering about in search of the party, found himself face to face with a ghostly apparation. The spirit knew his name, that of his deceased wife, and other relatives from ‘The Old Country.’ They had quite a chat, according to Grandpa.

Knowing that everyone would think him daft were he to relate this tale without proof, he queried the spirit if he might take some photos of it. An agreeable sort, the spirit posed with a nearby coat of arms, some tartans, and finally with a broadsword while Grandpa snapped away in the dimly-lit room.

Unfortunately, when the film was developed, all of those slides were black, leading Grandpa to conclude

The spirit was willing, but the flash was weak.

Ducks and runs for cover :smiley:

Oooh, scary—a double exposure!

From the "Brown Lady’s own web site: “Although the photo appears to be a relatively easy double exposure trick, the question is still asked today. Why would two well known photographers, with an extremely good reputation want to fake a ghost photo? Their reputation alone make it highly improbable that they would do such a thing. But maybe they did, only they know the truth on this matter.”

Yeah.

The Spirit of St. Louis has been photographed. Same with the Mars rover Spirit.

So, how come, when you told your daughter, two nights in a row, that you were exahusted and going to go right to sleep, that she didn’t come and investigate the noises going on “all night”?

I’m especially wondering why she wasn’t curious about the noises on the second night, when you had already denied making any noises the first night.

Sounds to me like rodents in the walls and a loose shutter flapping in the wind.

To me, the odd thing about the story is that these spirits followed her and her friends to her apartment and then decided to stay. Then, after they lay dormant for two years, they start acting up again when she decides to move.

Why wouldn’t the spirits just pack up and follow her? They did it once already. Did the spirits become concerned whenever she left the apartment temporarily, such as going to work or the grocery store?

Flash 57, I wouldn’t expect anyone to really believe my story. If you had posted it I wouldn’t believe it.

When my daughter reported the sounds, of course I believed her. And when I said it wasn’t me, of course she believed me. But to jump from there to a decision “Oh it must be ghosts” is quite a jump. It wasn’t until I heard the sounds one night that I really felt they were real. I’m 62 years old and I know what mice and so on sound like. It was not like that at all. If there is such a thing as “ghosts”, then that is what it was. If not, I don’t know what it was. But I do know that my daughter and I did not imagine it.

Photographs of ghosts were first produced as a regular thing, it appears, by William Mummler, a commerical photographer in Boston who produced his first pictures in the 1860s. He generally produced pictures of people who had sat for portraits which included “extras”, hazy images of other people standing beside or behind the sitter. Sometimes the sitters would identify these people as deceased persons they knew.

The raitonale given was that Mummler had some special sensitivity that caused the images to appear in the photos. At the time the whole process of photography was mysterious to most people, and photographs were often granted an automatic validity and importance which was unwarranted. It is interesting in this connection that in Hawthorne’s novel The House of the Seven Gables it is the young dauggerotypist who serves as the voice of reason, and who provides the explanation at the end of the story.

In Mummler’s time pictures were not produced on rolls of film. The first cameras with prepared film were produced by the Eastman Kodak company decades later, and even then a photographer had to mail his whole camera in for processing. Rather, photographic negatives were produced on glass plates. When a photographer was finished with a negative, it was often the case that he would wash the plate clean so he could reuse it. Photographers who cleaned their plates imperfectly found that hazy double exposures formed when the plates were resued. Very likely this is how the process of producting “ghost” images was first discovered.

Mummler moved to New York City after a number of people in Boston noticed that “ghosts” in pictures he had produced looked precisely like people on the streets in Boston. Later ghost photographers were sometimes more creative in dealing with such embarassments. I recall seeing an old and incredibly credulous book on ghost photography years ago. In it was a ghost photograph which showed a hazy image of a woman in a tiara. A few days after the picture was taken, the sitter had found the identical image in a book; the “ghost” was, in fact, a living member of European royalty. The photographer had explained that the sitter had been blessed with a rare instance of “photographic clairvoyance”; that is, the camera had read her mind days in advance and taken a picture of the image that would be there when she saw the picture in the book!

It is said that the greatest single blow to the reputation of ghost photographers came after World War I. There is in London a cenotaph honoring war dead whose remains were left overseas. A picture was circulated showing a crowd of “soldiers” hovering around it. It was eventually found that the crowd was, in fact, a football team, all of whose members were still alive.

Double exposure photography seems to have done a lot to develop the image of ghosts as being white and hazy; often in accounts of sightings people have said they didn’t think that a figure was a ghost until it disappeared, but even in magazine illustrations of such stories the convention of a transparent, ethereal image is used to depict the ghost.

There are, of course, plenty of supposed ghost photographs which do not rely on double exposures to create effects. Some photos from 19th Century seances appear to simply show photos cut from magazines pasted on walls, sometimes with a little gauze attached to their edges. And, now and again, there have been pictures which are genuinely enigmatic and impressive.

In the 1960s one of the major American television networks–I believe it may have been NBC–produced a special which included footage shot in a supposedly haunted mansion or castle in England. There was a time lapse sequence in a desserted hallway where the hands of an old clock can be seen to spin around as a bright streamer of light crawls slowly across the floor. What was causing the light, and what was causing it to move, was supposedly unexplainable.

This is, of course, not what one normally expects from a ghost picture. Similarly, American Photo once printed a photo of supposed ghostly phenomenon–its only one in the magazine’s history. It shows children on a bed. Over their heads is an unidentified streamer or bolt of light, which appears to be casting a shadown on the wall behind them.

Since about 1990 there has been a vogue for pictures of “Glowing vortices of energy”. These generally take the form of a bright loop down in one corner of a photograph. Fate Magazine held a photo context in which all six winners were pictures of this type.

Such “vortex” pictures are readily explainable as pictures of camera straps. In many “Instamatic”-type cameras the user looks through a window, not through the camera lens. This means that if the camera strap gets in the way of the lens, it may not be apparent to the user. Such cameras typically have a very intense flash, and the strap can reflect this flash when the picture is taken. One such picture which I found identified on a website as being without question of an “energy vortex” was so clear that you could plainly see the weave of the camera strap.

There has also been excitement from time-to-time about apparent double exposures taken with Polaroid-type cameras. It is supposed to be impossible to double expose a self-developing picture; the first exposure causes chemical changes on the film’s surface which makes a second exposure impossible. The magicians Penn and Teller not only demonstrate in their book Cruel Tricks for Dear Friends that such a thing is possible, but provide apparatus for doing it.

Is this the “energy vortex” you meant?

…like, say, woven nylon? :rolleyes:

OK. Did you go and investigate the sounds at that time? It’s one thing to hear strange noises, investigate, and come up with something or nothing. It’s quite another to hear strange noises and simply assume that they are supernatural.

I’m not doubting that you and your daughter heard noises. Old houses make a wide variety of noises. I’ve heard old heating system that can sometimes make sounds like a blacksmith hammering away at his anvil all day, complete with pauses and an irregular beat. Anyone who hears it would swear that there’s a human hand at work.

OK Flash, you mentioned “old heating systems” so I’m going to have to do a bit of bragging here. “Old heating stytems” are hot water heating systems and I have plumbed two homes, a laundry room, and a bathroom. I learned how to do it from a book and the nice men at Home Depot. Those old clanging/knocking noises one used to hear in the pipes were caused from pressure. I put a device in each pipe (I forget the name–I could look it up in my books) to absorb those pressure shocks/noises. I just want to make it clear that I am not some dumb/nutty felmale that “believes in ghosts”.

But I also need to make it clear that I did hear the sounds of “all hell breaking loose” in that 300 year old home that night. And furthermore, that I would hope that anyone reading this on the internet would be sceptical, as I would be.

As I said, my daughter had heard the sounds of what sounded like furniture being moved around and the sounds of walking back and forth. This old home was built around a large stone fireplace that opened into a dining room and three bedrooms, and then the upstairs attic room where I slept when my daughter heard the noises. When I heard the noises they woke me up in the middle of the night and seemed to be coming from the fireplace, about 3 feet from my bed, which then opened again into the upstairs attic room. For me the noises were angry arguments–like I said “like all hell had broken loose”. I use this phrase because there was definitely an emotional connection to the experience–it is hard to find words for. And I thought to myself. “Oh that’s what Jane (my daughter) heard”.

In my “normal” life I am a very curious person and prone to investigate everything. As I sit here now, I can tell you that I sure do wish I would have snapped to attention that night and perhaps even written down what I was experiencing. Now from the replys that this thread is getting, I can see that my take on what happened is not going to make me very popular around here, but…

If it is possible that intense emotions are in some sense real and leave some sort of lasting impression, I believe that my daughter and I experienced that in a way we do not as yet understand. When those noises woke me my impression in that state half way between sleep and awake was: “the ‘commotion’ is real but it does not concern me”. Or, one might say my ‘critical’ mind was not yet in control? I realize that most people will think I was just dreaming, but I know I was not–after all, I have been dreaming all my life and I know the difference.

Plenty of that sort of thing here.

Anyone have an idea what could cause this? I’ve seen the same effect in a roll of Christmas pictures one of my sisters took some 30 years ago.

You’re kidding, right? To a photographer, these are obviously prepared multiple-exposure photos. A pinpoint source of light in a dark environment – a flashlight will do – is moved around while the camera’s shutter is held open and the film NOT advanced afterwards. Or the light is steady while the camera is moved. Do it again with a gel in front of the light to change color. Street and advertising lights in a business district at night work well. Using stuff like nylons, curtains, etc., moved around in front of an open shutter, slightly underexposed, produces filmy, nebulous effects. One exposure may be taken normally, with a flash or short-time shutter, and the whole mess comes together.

No, not kidding. As implied earlier, I’ve seen similar streaks from lights on a Christmas tree and was honestly wondering what could have caused it. This is the first time I’ve seen anything remotely like that roll in 30 years. 'Course, I haven’t exactly been looking for it, either.

But, but…

:rolleyes: :stuck_out_tongue: :frowning:

OK, OK. If you were serious, forgive my impertinence. To even an amateur photog, the images have an obvious origin – we’re not talking anything extreme here. Elementary, my dear Watson.

Can you see how such streaks are made? Try it yourself. If you have access to a digital camera that allows the shutter to remain open and this can be repeated on the same image, you can see the results immediately. Some experimentation may be needed to get the best iris (F-stop) setting and the length of time the shutter is open.

You can also produce similar images with a video camera. Set the exposure to admit the most light possible, then in a dark environment, wave a small flashlight or other pinpoint light source rapidly around in front of the camera. (It may work best if you don’t point the light directly at the lens, and experiment with distance from the camera.) You should see streaks of light if you play the video back in slo-mo or stop on a single frame.

If you are photographing a Christmas tree, and due to the total amount of light detected by the camera, the automatic exposure computation gave you a long shutter time, and you moved the camera (or the tree) during the exposure, the tree lights would smear. If the flash then went off, other non-luminous objects would be frozen by the flash. Only light sources would produce traces. Make sense?

Make your own ghosts, and fool “Dr. Dave.”

Any one can edit photographs. I’m going to need to see proof those photos have not been forged.

Oh, puh-leeeeze!

Did this place suddenly stop being the Straight Dope Message Board?

You’re gonna need proof? So that you can start believing that ghosts are the cause of bad amateur photography in America?