This would be exactly the kind of VP blunder that Hillary made in 2016, and so of course it’s something Biden would do. There’s nothing whatsoever strategic about choosing Yates. She doesn’t make up for any of Biden’s weaknesses. She’s a DC insider. She’s white. At 59 years old she is still “old” to younger voters. She looks like the ultimate “Karen”. About the only thing she adds to the ticket is being a woman. And, just like Tim Kaine, if Biden runs with her and loses, 5 years from now nobody will remember who his running mate was.
Sometimes I wonder if I’m living in the same universe as the other people following this election. Have we learned nothing from the past?
Sally Yates: She’s from Georgia (strategic southern purple-ish state), she’s a career civil servant who ran the day-to-day of the DoJ (experienced at managing a federal department, ready to step in should the old man keel over at some point), she’s not a “career politician” (which, for better or worse, carries a stigma with some voters), she was fired for standing up to Trump’s illegal executive order which won the hearts of the early Resistance. And who exactly are your “younger” voters flocking to? Bernie. The dude’s older than Biden. They’re not flocking to Mayor Pete or Booker or Klobuchar or any of the other younger candidates. A candidate’s age is no indication of whom younger voters will vote for. Regardless, I want to win over the blue collar Industrial Midwestern voters that either sat out or voted Trump in 2016 and rock-steady older voters. That’s my justification for Biden and Yates.
Imo, we *have *learned from the past, and that’s why Democratic/anti-Trump voters are actually showing up for elections since 2016 and not just assuming their vote isn’t necessary any more.
My take: Voters have seen what a “deviant” candidate has looked like over the past three years (and by deviant, I mean outside the mainstream/center). If the economy’s still humming in November 2020, I’d much rather have a more “normal” centrist ticket, like Biden-Yates, go up against Trump than something deviating from the norm (like Bernie or Mayor Pete or Warren or Stacy Abrams or Yang or whatever).
Bad economy, deviant president: Any Dem will likely win.
Good economy, deviant president, “deviant” Dem candidate: Trump will likely win, as people will vote for the devil that has “given” them a strong economy.
Good economy, deviant president, “normal” Dem candidate: Dem has a better chance of winning as people might just vote for a return to normalcy, good economic numbers be damned.
And I’m not sure why you’re slapping your head at me. Did a fly land there?
For those who laugh at the SDMB being a target for Russian trolls, last nite one hit us, spreading a fake news story in three forums.
Interesting thing about the story- that a Ex-US Diplomat to Ukraine had been found dead- wasnt that story, it was the comments- where the made up comments were blaming the Clintons for murdering her, as if of course Hillary was a master Ninja. :rolleyes:
This is one case where I think we should acknowledge that Joe Biden knows his fellow Senators better than the media and we do. Biden had a lot of success negotiating with McConnell when he was allowed to by his boss.
Joe found his inner Trump. He does need to just reconcile himself with the truth that Hunter is a very troubled boy who isn’t above using his father’s name to make a living. Joe shouldn’t feel bad, George HW Bush had four kids like that.
I disagree that it’s somehow ‘not accidental’ – I think Bernie’s a decent guy. But because he flirts with conspiracy theories and goes full-on populist, he attracts the occasional idiot chauvinist who puts up a ‘progressive’ facade but doesn’t recognize his own ‘bro-ness’
But yeah, the criticism of not doing background checks speaks to administrative weaknesses that are getting exposed.
I don’t know how old that guy is, but I was saying shit like that in high school. I probably would have been stupid enough to say it on Twitter if Twitter had existed at the time. There’s a pretty big difference between someone who’s 18 and someone who’s 27. There’s a difference between immature trash-talking and serious bigotry.
That’s not really the point though, I understand, it’s that nobody checked to see if shit like this was on his public online footprint before he was hired.
Interesting article here: Why the US Left has failed black voters
It matches why Biden has such a lead with black voters. The older ones back him. From his days as a senator he built up a relationship with them.
He is fondly perceived by the black community and black public officials in Delaware even if they didn’t always see eye to eye on an issue…because he was always there to hear them out. He met with community leaders, preachers, activists, groups. He invited them to address their grievences and worked with them. In fact he is remembered fondly for being the only white lifeguard at a segregated swimming pool as a college student.
It’s also why after he made those stupid comments at a fundraiser of being civil to people like James Eastland, a lot of the older black public officials in Congress or Delaware – while disapproving of the comment – didn’t turn on him and in fact gave him a defence. Because they’ve known him for decades. Some of them don’t support him for president, but they like the guy.
Yep, with black voters it seems to be about relationships, not ideology. And just as you can’t build a relationship with black voters just by going out on the trail and pandering to them(Liz!), you also can’t destroy a long term relationship overnight either. Black voters are sticking with Joe and that’s not likely to change.
Or it could be, perhaps, just perhaps, the same reason older whites support him. Some things really aren’t that deep and this is one of those things.
My dad (70 something black man) is a Biden supporter. I promise you that nothing special distinguishes his feelings toward him from your average 70 something white man who favors Biden. They like him because he’s familiar and establishment-backed, which makes him safe and relatable to people who don’t want too many boats rocked. My dad is socially conservative…that is common among black folk, especially the AARP demographic.
If you ask what young black people think of him, lo and behold you’ll find them saying the same thing younger whites say about him.
I’d argue the reason older blacks are less likely to break for Sanders and Warren is that these candidates are more progressive than Biden…and remember?[Blacks are more socially conservative than whites.](Blacks are more socially conservative than whites.) Their support for the moderate candidate shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone except people who are ignorant to the strong strain of traditionalism that courses through the Bill Cosby generation.
It’s annoying me that Biden (and Biden supporters) is trying so hard to pass himself off as the “some of my best friends are black” candidate. I mentioned my Biden-supporting conservative Dad, but let me tell you about the community activist whom is my mother. She too is an older black person but she is as progressive as they come, and she will not be voting for Biden.
I don’t understand the appeal of Biden at all. Do people think he’s Obama version 2? Do people think he can beat Trump? It’s nice to have experience but he basically spent almost his entire adult life in DC which to me is not a positive.
I’m disappointed that no one here is discussing that ugly scene in Iowa that Biden mangled, IMO. If this is what we can expect whenever someone brings up Hunter and the Ukraine shit, I swear I will not be able to handle watching the news anymore. Might need to throw out my TV and cancel internet service.
They think they know how to quantify Biden. He’s not a revolutionary; he’ll deliver moderate reforms, and even if that’s about half of what we want on our progressive wish list, it’s miles ahead of where we are going now. We’re racing backwards with Trump. The revolution can come later. Let’s just get a Democrat in office first. I think that’s what voters are thinking.
Besides that, he’s up against a field of people who have narrow appeal (Sanders and Warren) or who simply haven’t established name-brand recognition (Buttigieg and Klobuchar). It’s a relatively easy field to beat.
I agree with this. The economic and political situations are much too fragile for a rash of expensive progressive programs right now. (And anyway, they’re not happening in 2021 even in the unlikely event that the Ds get 50 Senators.)
I was hoping Booker, Harris, Klobuchar, Inslee, Castro or even Hickenlooper would take off, but I guess charismatic stars only come along once a generation or so. (Sanders or Warren may be charismatic, but are too radical to win the general. Other front-runners — Buttigieg, Bloomberg, Yang — also have little chance against Trump in my opinion.)
Hillary’s e-mails were the dominant issue in the 2016 campaign. Biden’s Ukraine “corruption” will be the dominant issue in the 2020 general campaign. I hope Joe finds a good way to deal with it.
Biden’s authentic, he’s a straight talker, we know what he believes, we know what kind of guy he is. He hasn’t been a chameleon throughout his career, just shifting with the political winds, being all things to all people. The public is tired of politicians and Biden’s like John McCain in that he developed a reputation over the years for not being a bullshitter or strategy-obsessed guy. He just chose his specializations as Senator(finance, judiciary, foreign policy), and worked hard for decades on those issues. I won’t say he’s the most qualified man to ever run for office, but I will say that there has never been a candidate easier to assess by the public. Some people that have been around longer, the public still isn’t sure who they are or what they believe. That was one of the problems Hillary had.
If that’s the best they have, it won’t be much. However significant or insignificant you feel her emails were, it was a choice SHE made. Biden’s problem is more like a Billy Carter problem: he has an errant family member who is going to cause him headaches, but I don’t think the public is going to hold Hunter’s dumb ass against him. Biden had a squeaky clean history before Hunter decided to try to make a living off the family name. Even Joe himself didn’t use his name to make money until the last few years. The dude lived off his salary for decades.