Help a newish Hip-hop fan educate himself

This isn’t so much asking for recommendations, but as a relative newbie to the hip hop scene, how do I keep up with what is going on in the underground? It seems that I only find out about stuff 2-3 years after the album hits (for example I just found out about Canibal Ox and Aesop Rock within the last 6 months). I know about some mainstream stuff, but to be honest I don’t ever listen to the radio so I don’t even know what the crap flavor of the week the radio is playing these days.

Are there any publications/websites that are dedicated or just encompass underground hip hop? The only place I know of that even touches on this stuff is Pitchfork, and they only cover a little bit.

I guess my question really is: I know how to keep up with what is going on with rock (or indy rock), how do I do the same thing with hip-hop?

I’m not all that big into hip-hop, but I do keep up with the metal underground (or did; I’ve become a little less active over the past year or so). Since you mention you’re a relative newbie, I’m going to give you a few tips on finding older music as well. Some of these may not be as helpful in the hip-hop arena as they are in metal, but it can’t hurt to try.

First off, the best general reference sites are AllMusic and Amazon. AllMusic has a lot of information about different genres and acts, and the reviews tend to be pretty detailed. Amazon has a lot of information about what people who bought one item tended to buy, and their user written guides have a few diamonds in the rough.

Secondly, read the liner notes of the albums you buy. The artists will generally mention other artists that they think you should check out, for whatever reasons. Obviously this doesn’t work all that well with iTunes et al., so this one might not help.

Thirdly, go check out the record labels’ websites. Major labels don’t tend to put much effort into online promotions because they have radio time, but smaller labels use the internet a lot. You’ll always find information about other artists on the label, and you’ll generally find mp3s for download. You might also be able to buy direct from them, which translates into cheap CDs and a place on their mailing list.

Fourthly, and closely tied to number three, go check out the artists’ websites. They’ll probably have information that you would find in the liner notes, and also probably have mp3s (or a link to a Myspace page with mp3s).

Finally, do go look for message boards and other sites with fora. There’s no substitute for being connected to the larger fan community.

You can also go to Pandora. Start a station with an artist that you like and it’ll play tracks from other artists that are similar.

I was really unimpressed with Pandora. I started off with some pretty obscure bands, and while it got the basic style right, it pretty quickly gravitated towards more mainstream stuff, which isn’t exactly hard to find.

Sometimes you have to continually tweak it to keep it on track.

Hip-hop head here.

I find that I have the same problem as you, and I think the real solution is tough. Probably the best way to keep abreast of new stuff is to know someone who is really into it (and up on it) and just pick his (her?) brain constantly for recommendations. But how does he find out about stuff? Don’t worry about it.

Also, go t live shows and concerts when you can. A guy spitting rhymes in a ghetto little club one night, might be on MTV the next month. OK, not really cause mainstream hip-hop/rap sucks, but you get the idea. These guys have to start somewhere. I think moreso than other genres.

And finally, and probably best, is to understand the hip-hop is all about “crews” and associations. If you really dig into this stuff, it’s sometimes like playing Six Degrees of Ice Cube’s Cousin. In addition to tons of actual family relationships, hip-hop is all about featuring other people. Look at the details of one of your favorite albums. Who are the rappers featured in some of the songs you like. Chances are pretty good that that dude has his own, relatively unknown, album. These guys are constantly being featured on each other’s albums.

With all the above said, I find myself somewhat stuck in the early-mid 90s and very early 2000s. I’m just finding out about awesome stuff that’s already over 10 years old.

Here’s a quick list of some good ish in no particular order:

early Wu-Tang
early Nas
Cannibal Ox
Cage
Krs-One
Roots Manuva
Dr. Octagon (and associated alter-egos)
MF Doom
Deltron 3030 (and associated alter-egos)
Redman
Pharcyde
Vast Aire
Atmosphere
Outkast
Goodie Mob
Blackalicious
Mos Def
Talib Kweli
The Roots
Dilated Peoples
Gang Starr

Just to start with. You could make a pretty intense little schematic drawing up all the connections between the above mentioned groups.

Funny, you don’t look newish.

I also like Kayne West, Jay-Z, old Public Enemy, and Black Star (which is Mos Def and Talib Kweli). I generally ask my hipper 7th grade students what is the current hot musi, to stay abreast, and borrow stuff from them. If you don’t have access to any teenagers, I guess try Rolling Stone’s online reviews for starters.

This is exactly my problem, I don’t even have someone to talk to SDMB is the closest thing I have (not that I use it that way). But almost all of my new discoveries have been due to reading a thread on hip hop, they are just a little too few and far between. The idea of going to shows is a good one, I will ask around and see if I can find some good hip hop clubs in LA (I know there have to be some, I just don’t know about them…not really my scene.) Your list had some great stuff in it, and a couple of things I hadn’t heard of too, so I will deffinatly check them out.

Yeah, I look more Irish than newish, though I am plenty newish, but only on my fathers side. So technically I guess I have to convert.

No matter how many times I tell myself I will always preview…
That first sentence should read:
This is exactly my problem, I don’t even have someone to talk to about it. The SDMB is the closest thing I have (not that I use it that way).

I think your list is great, but c’mon. Call him Kool Keith and refer to his other name of the weeks as his alter egos. I think he does his best stuff under his original name. :cool:

The first thing you need to is be willing to embrace the mainstream. Hip hop is structured entirely differently to rock, and if you want to listen to something other than rap for white college kids (Aesop Rock, Jurassic 5, Sage Francis, Atmosphere etc.), you’ll need to be prepared to give a fair listen to anything, no matter how big it sells. For instance, the only hip hop record to make the list of the top 10 best selling albums for the first 6 months of 2006 was T.I.'s King, and it’s also one of the year’s best hip hop albums.

For a start, the lines between mainstream and underground in hip hop are less easily defined - Jay-Z shouts out underground icons like Talib Kweli and signs the Roots to Def Jam. Secondly, regionalism is very important in hip hop, and an artist who is a local hero selling CDs out the trunk of their car one day can be an international superstar the next if their region attracts the right amount of attention.

There’s also the problem that if you are 2-3 years behind, what you’re listening to right now is basically the peak of an underground that really fell off straight after. In '06, the only real interesting “conscious” albums have come from The Coup and (apparently, though I haven’t heard it yet) Mr. Lif, which is very different to how things were a few years ago. (Also, The Roots new record, not out yet, is being talked about as their best in years, but they’re on Def Jam now, so it hardly counts as being underground). 2005 was even worse for underground rap - almost entirely regressive or didactic or both. There’s no dominating underground force right now the way Rawkus and Def Jux used to run the underground game. Not that the best artists are doing huge numbers, but they have far more in common with the biggest artists than the backpackers and all that. Probably the most anticipated hip hop release of the year right now is the Clipse’s new record, and they’ve got production from the Neptunes and rap about dealing.

The best way to find out about what’s hot is cheking out blogs - try Nahright.com, Sohh.com and the XXL blogs, and check out the links from those sites. It’s also a good idea to get up on local scenes. The Bay Area, Miami, Houston, Memphis, Atlanta and Baltimore all have thriving scenes at the moment, and a bit of research - even sniffing around on Wikipedia a bit - will turn up some good names. (New York isn’t so hot at the moment, but the Dipset still has their hardcore fanclub, and there are people who think Papoose is the second coming, even though I don’t see it. Then again, he just signed a $1.5 million contract, so maybe he will do something worthwhile).

If you’re in a major city, you can hunt out the guy’s selling mixtapes, which are always a good entry point for an artist. They’re always cheap and throwaway ($5) and have a lot of junk, but often some good stuff as well. Lil’ Wayne’s Dedication #2 mixtape is probably one of the best hip hop albums released this year.

And if all else fails, just see what Wu Tang Clan members have albums out, and go from there. :smiley:

What Jayrot said and I also recommend everything De La Soul have ever done.

Oh, most definitely. De La kicks ass. My list wasn’t meant to be exhaustive. Here’s more:

A Tribe Called Quest
Aesop Rock
very early Black Eyed Peas
Fugees/Wyclef
Soul Position
Vordul
Aceyalone
some EPMD
Albums–

Soulsides Greatest Bumps
DJ Muggs Presents, Soul Assassins
Amethyst Rockstar by Saul Williams

And if you fancy some good rap in other languages (doesn’t matter if you speak it or not):

Orishas – A lo cubano
MC Solaar – Prose Combat
Supreme NTM – Supreme NTM
Cypress Hill – Los grandes exitos en Espanol
X Plastaz – Maasai Hip Hop
Some various Japanese rap on DJ Krush’s albums

Thanks man, this is the kind of info I was looking for. Like I said in the OP I don’t really need recommendations for older stuff, I want to be able to get into the scene myself so I know the good stuff that is comming up. I have never had a problem digging up the old stuff (although Jayrots list was great, I do have or know of 90% of it. I know about De La and all that too) but I had no idea about T.I. and all that. I hear a lot about mixtapes but honestly don’t really know how to go about seeking them out, but I live in Los Angeles so I can probably figure something out.

It is strange to me that the mainstreem is where its at as far as hip-hop right now, because I am mostly an indie rocker kid. But what you said about the structure of the rap community being very different from the rock community makes sense. I am not prejudiced against big number artists per se, its just that my experiance in music up to this point has told me that the mainstream isn’t usually the place to start looking for the really good stuff. I am also about 3 years behind for hip hop so the fall off in the underground you are talking about is probably why I am not finding any newer stuff.

I will check out the blog you mentioned and start trying to connect the dots from there. Thanks again. If anyone else has suggestions for other good sites to check out or for a place in LA where I can find stuff let me know.