Help me understand Gothic Horror Literature (US-based) better

Cafe Society
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I’ve been trying to puzzle out the difference between horror and Gothic literature (of the horror flavor), and how that might work outside of the south - which seems to be were most Gothic lit in the US is set - and…I’m stumbling. I think this is because I have a nebulous idea of what Gothic horror is to begin with, and common descriptors like “lush” and “languid” do little to actually define anything, and waters get muddied even further when you consider that most famous Gothic stories are set way back when rather than now. I *do *think contemporary Gothic stories still can and do exist, though…

So, I have a three part question:
Assuming we’re talking about stories in a contemporary setting

I. What are key common elements to contemporary Southern Gothic horror?

II. If the Gothic horror setting was moved to contemporary New England instead, what would be the key elements that would set it apart from Southern Gothic?

III. If one removes the traditional locations, be it languishing on a former plantation in the south or in a remote fishing village in the north, because they’re not common now, can gothicism still work?

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[QUOTE=elfkin]

I. What are key common elements to contemporary Southern Gothic horror?
[/QUOTE]

Ruin- not just post Civil War but even something in modern day- crumbling mansions, abandoned buildings, empty fields.

Very small towns and or rural settings. It’s hard to get a sense of past evils that took place in a city but it’s much easier in a small town or a rural area from Indian artifacts to people who remember the time of Emmett Till to buildings and churches that were there at the time.

Grotesques. All Gothic horror have them but So-Gothic has a unique spin: “idiot manchild”, the deformed or deranged old woman, the crippled who repeats himself over and over, etc., usually clad in overalls or worn and patched cheap cloth.

The Heat & Humidity. Always and forever and then some.

[QUOTE=elfkin]

II. If the Gothic horror setting was moved to contemporary New England instead, what would be the key elements that would set it apart from Southern Gothic?
[/QUOTE]

Snow for one. Coldness. The past (Gothic is usually very concerned with the past of a place or an area) is different- the puritanism, generally speaking older continuous habitation. Less racial diversity. Basically, in three words: Stephen King’s Maine.

[QUOTE=elfkin]
III. If one removes the traditional locations, be it languishing on a former plantation in the south or in a remote fishing village in the north, because they’re not common now, can gothicism still work?
[/QUOTE]

Probably the hardest thing to get around now would be the Internet, cable, cell phones, and other connectivity to the outside world. Isolation is an important part of gothicism. I think that’s why a lot of modern horror goes to things like zombie apocalypses and other things that take away the technology. But, I’m sure there are ways to make traditional gothic work even with a modern setting.

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There’s also often an element of religious fervour bordering on fanaticism – the old fire-and-brimstone preacher, capital-S Sin and things like that. The dichotomy between outward virtue and inward depravity. Sometimes coupled with a ‘family above all’ mindset that may take on cultish proportions, and a depraved sense of tradition – right is what always was right (this is how it’s always been – this is how we do things in the country, as Slim Cessna puts it); right is what the preacher or the patriarch (or, more often than I think anywhere else, the matriarch) says. Incest, whether implied or outright, as a cause of the grotesque and an outgrowth of ‘keeping it in the family’. The horror is, I think, not typically supernatural, the demons are those of men, even if often externalised (‘the devil made me do it’). The faded southern belle is a common theme, too, or, as Sampiro already pointed out, ruin in general, a sense of run-downness, both in scene, setting and characters.

I think subversion is in a sense an overarching theme – the sense that what is good and virtuous (family values, religion, etc.) may become depraved and deformed (incest, mad preachers…); in a sense the grotesque is a symbol for this.

And the goddamn heat.

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I honestly am not familiar with “Southern” Gothic, but know a little about classic British Gothic Literature. Basically, I understand “Gothic” to imply an aesthetic, rather than a storytelling genre per se like horror. For example, Frankenstein by Mary Shelley is Gothic Science Fiction. It involves isolated locations, the cold, and deep and dark emotions, but doesn’t involve ghosts or seances or really “horror”-y things to my knowledge.

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Andrew Lloyd Webber and Jim Steinman wrote a musical called Whistle Down the Wind based on a 1961 English movie about children who hide a man (an outlaw) in their family barn because they believe he’s Jesus Christ. In the musical the location was changed to rural Louisiana and for the religious fanaticism they added a couple of scenes with snake handlers. I think the musical was a financial disappointment but he did the Southern Gothic part really well.

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I’d say the House of Seven Gables was Gothic horror, and that was set in New England. Then you have things like the Fall of the House of Usher, which isn’t set anywhere in particular.

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Or Lovecraft Country, depending. (Compare and contrast Campbell Country.)

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There are still plenty of isolated Victorian houses, some with gables and towers, that adorn the Northern countryside. Many of them far enough away from each other that cell service can be spotty. I must confess that I haven’t read any American Gothic stories, but that setting seems plenty atmospheric, old, and alone to me. Throw in some darkness and owls and a storm that downs telephone lines (oh noes, the residents opted for DSL!) and you’re golden from an atmosphere standpoint.

However, it’s lacking from a decadence standpoint. Isolated communities up north are not known for their descent into moral questionability, and if a story were written so, it may work but might not be considered “gothic” (except maybe if it involves an angry mob.)

But anything works in fantasy and remember Western New York was once known as the Burned Over district because of all the new fiery religions being born there. I’m imagining another wave of religious fervor to come over the district, only for the protagonist to find out that the new religion is actually a cult trying to revive the ghosts of Indians to take back their place in the southern Finger Lakes (with scenes set amidst the copious waterfalls and glens therein.)

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It’s far more of a fairytale than gothic, but What-the-Dickens by Gregory Maguire solved this set of problems handily in what felt like a very realistic way: power failure in the aftermath of a terrible storm cuts off contact when a family refuses to evacuate. Now, I’ve never lived through a hurricane of that magnitude, but blizzards and ice storms? Oh yeah. Isolating, oppressive weather often kills tech too, so I think your earlier point about the weather could solve this issue as well.

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Katrina is prime for modern day Southern Gothic.

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I’ve got a whole rant on ‘The Grotesque’ and the portrayal of the South in literature that I’ve been trying to formulate properly for a long time now. The South (and Southerners) is portrayed as freakish, abnormal, cruel, tragic, extravagantly decaying, eccentric, and bizarrely sexual – I’m thinking of works such as Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil, Baby Doll, Deliverance, Black Snake Moan, even in Red Dirt, which I liked a lot, there’s a whole subplot where a pair of cousins have a secret affair that’s slowly destroying both of them. I do think Southerners tend to be more eccentric than other American subcultures, but the portrayal of us is so over-the-top that the humanity of the characters is obscured; they become some sort of canvas to project all manner of sin onto. It really disturbs me sometimes, as though I’m catching a glimpse of how other Americans view us, not as people, but as a walking, talking freakshow.

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Musicals, I think, are a taste I have yet to acquire, unfortunately…

My own ‘introduction’ to the genre was I think Nick Cave’s excellent novel And the Ass Saw the Angel, in which the religious fanaticism theme features heavily – at the time, I read it mainly out of my love for Cave, but it’s nurtured within me a deep fascination with the themes of decay and decomposition of the once-virtuous and beautiful (which bears a strange beauty in itself).

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The inevitable quote:

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It doesn’t have to be complete isolation – a Small Town Where Everybody Knows Everyone’s Business When a Stranger Shows Up can work just as well.

[QUOTE=Mississippiene]

I’ve got a whole rant on ‘The Grotesque’ and the portrayal of the South in literature that I’ve been trying to formulate properly for a long time now. The South (and Southerners) is portrayed as freakish, abnormal, cruel, tragic, extravagantly decaying, eccentric, and bizarrely sexual – … It really disturbs me sometimes, as though I’m catching a glimpse of how other Americans view us, not as people, but as a walking, talking freakshow.
[/QUOTE]

On an episode of Designing Women, Julia Sugarbaker said something to the effect of, “In the South we don’t lock our crazy relatives up in the attic. We put them in the living room for everyone to see.”

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I wrote a paper in a film class once where I argued that Natural Born Killers was basically an updated Gothic story, Southwestern Gothic, if you will. Mickey and Mallory were similar to the “Misfit” character in A Good Man is Hard to Find in many ways. The Post-War Southern ruins are replaced with the crumbling remains of 1950s Americana. Religion is replaced by Mass Media. Half Man Half Wit mentioned the theme of Subversion, whick NBK has in spades.

At the time I wrote it, it had been several years since I had either watched the movie or read any southern gothic, so I’m not sure if my theory stands up to closer scrutiny, but I did well on the paper:)