ABRAHAM: Do you bite your thumb at us, sir?
SAMPSON: I do bite my thumb, sir.
ABR: Do you bite your thumb at us, sir?
SAM: Is the law of our side if I say ay?
GREGORY: No.
SAM: No, sir, I do not bite my thumb at you sir; but I bite my thumb, sir.
GRE: Do you quarrel, sir?
ABR: Quarrel, sir! no, sir.
SAM: If you do, sir, I am for you: I serve as good a man as you.
ABR: That’s it, bitch. Come get some.
(Romeo and Juliet, Act I scene I with a little poetic license at the end there)
I’m also very angry at what happened to clayton, but I’m also saddened that this thread itself has turned into a fight. I’m not on either side here, just trying to inject a little levity.
I don’t know about you, but I would not characterize the dialogue as redneck. It sounds more like stereotypical teenager to me. I also don’t see the “looking to bash a queer” part. There is nothing in there to suggest that they thought either person was gay. Faggot, cocksucker, and retard are pretty generic insults from what I have seen.
Scylla: I am saying that I have encountered, while living for nearly half a century in the area in question, people who would in fact perpetrate such an assault as happened to clayton and would speak and act in a manner lampooned by matt in the OP. If that be stereotyping, then I plead guilty to stereotyping.
But stereotypes exist because they depict a reality. Not everyone nor at all times, but some people sometimes do behave as stereotypes suggest – that’s where they come from.
I knew a dairy farmer who was 5’2", nearly toothless, balding, and looked like he’d served as a model for some of the yokels in the Snuffy Smith cartoon strip. He was a retired Master Sergeant, combat veteran, scholarly historian, and accomplished classical clarinetist.
I knew a young man who was the spitting image of Owen Hart, the deceased WWF wrestler, and who was feared by every teenager in his home town. Only I and his closest friend (my ward) knew the gentle, compassionate, less-than-self-confident young man behind the tough-guy mask.
And I’ve known some people who would have beaten up clayton because “he didn’t look normal” and it was late at night and they had nothing to do.
Okay, maybe it’s because I’ve never actually met a redneck (well, possibly a few, but they were in the navy, so I consider them “navy people” and not rednecks), but nothing about matt’s bit of dialogue made me think redneck.
I did think big, dumb, burly, young people, though. And though there are, I would assume, rednecks that fall into that category, I don’t think that category is exclusive to rednecks.
I’ve known asshole teenagers (and supposed grown-ups in their 20’s and 30’s) who talk exactly like this in Canada, Australia, Papua New Gunea, and New Zealand.
Scylla, I like you, but for Christ’s sake, let it go. This is going around in circles. matt was presenting a hypothetical account of what might have happened. clayton never said he was called a faggot, or that these guys were rednecks. The point matt was trying to get across (in his own way) was how fucked up it was to beat the shit out of a kid for sitting on a bench at 5 in the morning. I’m not defending the terms matt used; rather, I’m defending the intent of the OP, stated in the previous sentence.
So maybe matt assumed these were homophobic rednecks who used the word “faggot” liberally. Well, people like that exist. Did you expect matt to have contacted clay to get a full description of his assailants, what they said to him, and what transpired, so that matt’s post would be accurate and offend no one? Oh, come on.
And I’m sure there are rednecks named Biff and Jimbo or WHATEVER who go around bashing young guys they think are gay, whether or not they are. In fact, I know these sub-humans exist. Ever hear of Matthew Shepard? Thank God clay wasn’t strung up like a FUCKING SCARECROW IN A FIELD and left to DIE. For doing NOTHING WRONG.
matt was expressing disgust that a kid - and a nice one too (I met him last weekend at Doperéal) - would be beaten up by retarded double-Y chromoshome fucktards from Bumblefuck, NY - for doing nothing more than sitting on a park bench. Don’t take it so motherfucking literally.
In fact, in MY Upstate NY town, we have loads of 'em. Try stolling into one of our redneck bars looking at all “different” or “acting funny” and you would find yourself in a very bad place. It’s, unfortunately, the way it is here. Come visit if you don’t believe me. I could easily envision the conversation in the OP happening here.
As long as we’re doing different imaginary versions…
-Hey, Jimbo.
-Yea, Biff?
-You hear about that little twerp on a bench?
-What the fuck you talking about, man?
-There’s some little fuck sitting on a bench.
-Huh?
-He’s, like, sitting on a bench, dude.
-He’s sitting on a bench? What is he, retarded?
-Shyah, I dunno. What kind of fucked up reetard sits on a bench?
-Yea. It’s like he want’s to be different or something.
-What the fuck is up with that?
-The fuck should I know? Little faggot doing something completely harmless and fun I’ve never heard of before? What the fuck?
-Fuckin A. We should beat the shit out of him.
-Yea, let’s go beat the shit out of him. Teach him a fuckin lesson.
-Not to sit on benches.
-Fuck yea. Little fucker. We’ll teach him not to do harmless fun things for the hell of it.
-Hey asshole, what’re you doin on OUR bench, huh?
Kalashnikov gets up and retreats several yards. They follow.
Kalashnikov - Stay back. Leave me alone!
-wassamatter, you scared, faggot?
Kalashnikov looks around and sees no stores open, and doubts that he can out run these guys for very long. He keeps backing up. They keep closing in. He brushes back his jacket and draws his pistol.
The goblins run for their lives.
Kalashnikov holsters the pistol, draws his cell phone and calls the police.
Some hours later…
-I bet he wouldn’t really have shot us.
-Oh yeah, so why did you run away?
-You ran too.
-No shit. I ain’t getting killed over nuthin’.
-Think he can identify us?
-Dunno, it was pretty dark. We better stay out of this town for a while though.
-Let’s go hang in Mass. instead. It’s safer there.
-Damn right.
Scylla, this is the most perfectly bizarre thing I’ve ever heard in my life. The only thing I characterized these guys as in my little skit was as violent dumb-ass thoughtless two-volt shiteating motherfuckers, which is something we already knew. Anything you choose to add to that is strictly your own perception, and I graciously decline any responsibility for it.
Praytell, I have heard from sources about that there is a gentlemen who is passing his time sting on a bench.
I’m afraid, my good man, that I do not quite understand what you mean.
I am sorry if I was unclear in my original statement. There is a gentleman sitting on a bench and that appears to be all he is doing. It appears the bench sitting is serving as an end in and of itself.
Please elaborate.
I do apologize, Biffington. Before I add too much to the story let me just say that there is a man who is sitting on a bench and actually has been for quite some time now.
I thin k I understand. There is a genetleman.
Correct.
And he’s sitting on a bench.
Yes sir, I believe now understand the dilemma.
I do understand that a man is sitting on the bench, but am not clear on the motivation. IT appears to me that this is the act of someone who is, unfortunately, a bit unstable of mind.
That is certainly quite possible. In fact I would think you must be unstable to a considerable degree to engage in such an act.
The poor unfortunate man probably does not even realize what unnecessary attention he is brining upon himself.
That is certainly, a shame.
A shame, indeed. He seems quite harmless, but I wonder. Do you think maybe his bench sitting in public could be a problem?
You know what, I think you may be right. An unstable man may be dangerous to others, or maybe even to himself. I suggest we subdue him and maybe we can avert a most egregious situation.
Yes, I believe that we may be able to help the poor man gain some of his sensibilities.
Certainly enough sense not to sit on a bench in public for no reason.
Oh jesus christ, listen to yourselfs. You’re fighting over the smallest stupidest details. I don’t know nor care why they did it, it very well may have been for the reasons that you’re all fighting over.
Matt, thank you for the consideration of starting this thread, I’m sorry some people decided to take it apart as if it were a few paragraphs of a classic play in high school english. I did understand your point, and felt no offence whatsover. thank you for your consideration.
And to everyone else, lay off him. It very well could have been for the reasons he says, and yes, I do live in a redneck town. Get off his back.
There must be something better for all of you to do with your time than pick apart someone’s thoughts of anger against some criminals.
Sorry, but it’s like “Hey, let’s defend the rednecks! Maybe their necks aren’t red! Maybe they’re not homophobic! Don’t pounce on FUCKING PREDATORS WHO BEAT KIDS UP FOR NO FUCKING REASON. Let’s try and understand them!”
FUCK THAT. I don’t care if you’re straight or gay, clay, but some guys pounced on you, and we’re just expressing our outrage. To have a respected poster come in here and try and somehow negate our rage is unacceptable to me. He has every right to say what he wants, but I have every right to tear him a new asshole. I stated quite clearly that I still like Scylla, but I had to say something. I’m more concerned about you, Clay, than about arguing about who these characters were. But it happened, and I had to say something. Maybe they weren’t rednecks; maybe they never called you a faggot. Doesn’t matter. They beat the shit out of you, and that pisses me - and a lot of others - off. I don’t know if I would have had this visceral a reaction had I not met you last weekend, but it sucks nonetheless. When I can put a face to the person who’s being pummelled, it just makes it worse for me.
How many times have I walked home at 4 in the morning wondering if I would get bashed? Or my friends walking home? I’m lucky that I’ve never been beaten up in my life, being openly gay (knocks wood), but to think of someone just sitting there and getting pounded really makes my blood boil. It sounds perverse, and it is, but if I were to be gay bashed it would be because I’m gay. You were beaten up for no reason. I do not know what is more sick: hurting someone because of your prejudice, or hurting someone for no reason at all.
I think it boils down to hurting someone else is wrong, no matter what the motivation.
It’s just sick, sick, sick, sick. And anyone else who tries to defend these fuckers is going to get a barbed wire buttplug shoved up his ass (you know who you are).
Wtf kind of bug’s up Scylla’s ass now? Ok, looking at the OP. What assumptions are being made?
Redneck names? I think the reaction of other dopers suggest that’s a personal mode of reference, not one implied by the OP. If matt truly wished to imply this, he’s talented enough to come up with something a little more specific/sterotypical.
“Dude”? I would say it’s traditionally more of a stoner reference, with something of the rank teen about it. Perhaps suggesting ignorance maybe, which rednecks haven’t cornered the market on last I heard. So, an implication the attackers are ignorant. I don’t think that’s unreasonable?
“Shyah”? It doesn’t sound typically redneck to me. Perhaps I’m incorrect. Last time I heard someone say ‘Shyah’, it was a Harvard graduate. But then, anecdotal counts for shit, so what do I know.
Assumption - the sort of bonehead who would go around beating up random people for whatever reason, will sometimes pigeonhole said-random people as faggots. This kind of behaviour is by no means limited to rednecks. It happens, more than it should. So, another reasonable assumption, especially if it is likely that the OP has experience of this himself.
Sometimes it’s easier to attribute an unsettling experience to bigotry or hatred, rather than to random violence for no reason that we can understand. Unless the shitwipes are caught and feeling particularly talkative, I doubt we’ll have any clue as to why they did what they did. As someone who pays attention to the news, is aware of the world around him, and who has been attacked by wandering hoards of neanderthals even when not looking “stereotypically gay” (which would be what, precisely? Let me know, I’m curious); I believe matt’s guesstimate is as good as any. And as always, it’s nice to see the SDMB is functioning as a little real world of its own - complete with some fuckhead out spoiling for a fight with the sissy boys.
I live in Bumfuck, PA. I just moved off of a 90 acre farm in the middle of nowhere that I lived on for 9 years. I own a tractor, and a pickup truck, and a shotgun, as do most of my neighbors.
Do you wish to lump me in that category?
**
Ummm. In case you didn’t notice, it kind of pissed me off as well.
Since when is redneck a socioeconomic group? Redneck to me has always been someone who acts like an ignorant fool, often to the detriment of those around him or her. And I mean ignorant in the classic sense of the word: uninformed about any kinds of ideas of lifestyles outside of the little box in which they dwell, and suspicious (at best) or hostile (at worst, often violently so) of those with those ideas or lifestyles. Narrow minded people with an overclocked fear of that which they consider to be “different.” I’ve known rednecks from different races, different economic strata, different geographic locations (even in NYC) and different insular little worlds, but that’s the base commonality between them: they lead insular, unthinking lives and don’t think anyone else should do otherwise.
There’s a difference between “redneck” and “trash.” They can be applied to people together, but they can work on their own and have vastly different meanings.
My objection was a minor one, and through the responses here it seems to be growing out of all proportion to its original intent.
I read your OP as The Hardy Boys as Psychotic homophobes. You say that’s not how you meant it. Fine, no problem. My bad. I’ve known you here long enough to trust and respect you.
This is getting way too bizarre.
Clayton:
I’m sorry about the hijack. Best of intentions and all. Feel better.