Sorry, I simulposted.
Thanks, I appreciate it. And I accept your apology.
And that would be the end of the hijack. looks around fiercely. RIGHT?
Good.
No. I had no idea where you lived. I’m lumping anyone in any category. I’m talking about specific people. I’m sorry if anything I said offended you. Like I said, I like and respect you as a poster, but some your comments in this thread I couldn’t let go by. Bygones. (Hopefully.)
Yes, it pissed us all off. clay is a great guy, and what happened sucked. I think we were more concerned about his well-being and just decided to pitch vitriol around to whoever did this to him.
At the time, I briefly put myself into the same position at his age. Being openly gay, had I spent a publicized night on a park bench, I would have probably been beaten over the head with tire irons until I was brain dead (that used to happen where I used to live). So I kind of understand the fear. I used to be so scared of walking home from my boyfriend’s home at night - only 10 minutes - because I was sure they were waiting for me behind the trees in the park.
I made it out unscathed. I was never bashed, and I never have been in the 10 years I’ve been living in Montreal. But clay was beaten up for no reason. That just kills me. He did not have it coming, he did not deserve it, and the whole thing is absolutely sick.
Period.
I, for one, am glad that Scylla doesn’t have some special bond with assholes who beat people up for no reason at all.
Now to the OP.
What does* pass for conversation before a guys decide to beat somebody up for the fuck of it? What, beside a less lampoony version of what matt wrote, could have been said between those creeps?
Is it the brutal stupidity that comes first, or the severe low self-esteem that being brutally stupid instills?
Biggirl:
I thought about this because it bothered me a lot.
I’m probably wrong, but it would seem to me that in a scenario like Matt describes there should be some taunting first. If it were a couple of guys that were pissed off because what Clayton was doing seemed weird, or queer, and they decided to beat him up on the spur of the moment, than I doubt they would have appeared out of nowhere and beat him up for “no reason.”
I would think there would have been a buildup or they would have made fun of him first, or let him know why they were teaching him a lesson.
I also wonder about the time. I get the impression that it was an early morning kind of thing, not a “the bars have closed, hey look at this kook on the bench as we walk home drunk,” sort of thing.
Maybe it’s just because we haven’t been told much, but it doesn’t seem like a spur of the moment attack by assholes.
It sounds to me like somebody deliberately planned and executed it.
Somebody saw him there, or knew he’d be there and picked a time when they could sneak in and bash him some (I’m getting this from the impression that it was attack that came without warning from out of the blue.)
If I’m right (and why should I be with my track record in this thread?) than that points to a very different scenario. Someone who knew him or knew of him and his stunt and thought they had a reason to get him.
Scylla, you’re actually very close.
I had seen probably more than a thousand people the day before, and word was passed around, and these were underage kids (so far below legal drinking age, not from the bars, and their punches were right on, so I doubt they were drunk), and this was early in the a.m. (a little after 5).
So I’d assume these kids had seen me the day before, left their places or stayed up all night until there was absolutely no traffic, then paid me a visit.
Their only comment was “you’re sitting in my seat.”
then I was beaten.
So I hope that fills in any gaps or answers any questions.
Just ask me anything if you have any other questions.
Who knows what was going through these people’s minds, they were crazy, so it is really impossible to figure it out. Nobody truly rational would do something like this, so I just don’t really try to figure out what they said. I’m just happy it didn’t cause any long term damage. They’ll get them, it was the headline story on the paper yesterday and the police (and a few local people) have put rewards on any information leading to their arrests. They’ll get them, I’m sure of it.
So that’s what it means…I have been wondering for the longest time;)
This is getting out of control, even for the Pit.
I don’t believe for a moment that Scylla was attempting to defend the jerkoffs who decided to give clayton_e a beating for no reason. I also don’t think that those of you who are berating him for his posts in this thread are really thinking this through.
He questioned what he perceived as matt_mcl framing the discussion about this as a condemnation of a “hate crime.”
I didn’t read it that way, but it’s still a valid question.
As much as we would like to believe otherwise, there are ignorant dickheads in this world who will react violently to unconventional behavior.
I’d be willing to drive for forty minutes to stand guard for clay should he wish to continue his vigil, or whatever it was. If Scylla lived around here, I’m sure he would too.
Unfortunately, he doesn’t live anywhere near here.
Biggirl, I have no idea what passes for conversation between complete fucktards when they’re working themselves up to beat the hell out of somebody.
I’d wager my house that Scylla doesn’t know either.
Please sir, (or madam), may I use this as my new sig line?
clayton_e, the thought that the “people” that beat you up probably planned an evening around it is pretty disturbing to me. I guess this is the same kind of mentality that sees someone doing something good or interesting, or an informal, community thing that is working, and decides to destroy it just cause it’s there. I believe the term for people like this is “spoilers”.
Feel free to use it, of course.
yer friend,
Mr. xenophon41
You don’t have to be part of some “oppressed minority” to be the victim of a hate crime. IMO, all beatings of this nature are based on some kind of hate, and probably self-hate on the part of the perpetrators.
These guys heard about a kid who had decided to spend 24 hours on a park bench, and then obviously decided they would beat the crap out of him.
Really retarded, given that clay’s adventure was going to figure in the local media. Real smart, Biff, Jimbo, and whoever else. For all they knew, Palve could have been taking pictures of the whole thing.
The fuckers will be hauled in. It’s a small town. Had clay done that here in Montreal, he’d be SOL. (Don’t let that stop you from choosing Montreal for school, clay! Just don’t stay on park benches! 
)
I still can’t believe I’ve never been bashed (knock wood again) and that someone just hanging out on a bench was. It makes me sick. Just sick.
Clay, by all means, continue your fun adventures. Don’t discount Montreal for school. I’m sure all of the Dopers here would love to have you join us. And you can eat poutine, all you want! 
Also know that for Montreal Dopefests in the interim, you’ve always got a place to stay at the Evil Pad®. Take care, buddy. I’m signing off of this thread unless something inflammatory comes up.
Kalashnikov, how dare you stereotype surfers like that!!!
(Sure sounded like surfers to me. )
Oh, damn, there was a whole other page that I hadn’t read yet. Now my post sounds very non-sequitor.
Sorry. :smack:
Well, in that case… nice weather then, eh?
(Don’t worry about it, Toots.)
clayton, I saw the pre-beating pics. I’m sorry to hear that that sweet face has been damaged. Here’s hoping it heals fast and thoroughly!
I’m going to reply on topic, hopefully avoiding the hijack.
This happened to me… New Year’s Eve '99, San Francisco. Me and a group of friends watched a movie at Van Ness and Geary downtown, and me and two other friends were taking the bus home (the 31) through a bit of a rough neighborhood. I sat right next to the back door, my friends sat across form me. We’re talking, minding our own business. Suddenly, I feel my head get slammed into the window and my glasses and hat go flying. When I get myself composed, they had already gotten off the bus. My friend was bleeding from the nose; he still has the scar. He was hit with a boombox, apparently, I was lucky enough to recieve a forearm.
The point is, not a word was said prior to their little attack. We made no contact with them, nor they with us. No taunting, nothing, save for some swearing back and forth out the window after they got off the bus. To this day none of us know why. They did, quite literally, “[appear] out of nowhere and beat [us] up for ‘no reason.’” Like little kids hitting the cat because simply it’s there.
Bunch loons out there.
I should note that the guys who attcked us had been sitting at the back of the bus, not too far from us, and they hit us as they were on the way out the door.